Safe Speed Forums

Oh, you are up late, Paul. Hi.

Unfortunately you sound a bit like a scientologist.

Good luck to your passion and commitment, but this is all a bit train-spotter-ish to an outsider like me. It seems you do not get too many outsiders with contrary views.

Smeggy, I'll just argue this one or else it will get too quotey.

I have never heard of COAST. I am willing to bet that if you canvassed 1000 random drivers, neither would 999 of them. So what on earth good is that, as an argument?

Because you are going slower, you are covering the ground at a reduced rate. Therefore the time taken to cover that ground is greater. Therefore you have more time to react.

If you were creeping along at 5mph in a traffic jam it would take a great deal of time. If you are doing 100mph you can barely blink.

Does that cover it?

You really need to stop saying that XXX "we need to be instilling on motorists". That is a semi-religious obsessive mantra.

2)Please, PLEASE, ask yourselves if this forum/site is quite healthy in that it seems populated by like minded beings to greater or lesser degree. I'm not trying to insult intelligence, but you must have an inkling that you understand what I mean by this. It would be far better for your cause to invite more outsiders like me into here. I seem to be alone in my views, yet out in the real world I am not.

"I have never heard of COAST. I am willing to bet that if you canvassed 1000 random drivers, neither would 999 of them

.......the vast majority of people support [speed cameras]

It seems you do not get too many outsiders with contrary views.

A quick word first: Flippancy does not prove or disprove anything, nor does it impress people.

My point is, the longer you spend in close proximity to (ie alongside) another vehicle, the greater the potential for danger. If you pass a lorry with a small speed differential you may be next to it for 10 or 20 seconds, or more. What happens if he has a blowout in that time and ends up on top of you?
Healthy speed differentials are good, not only for safety, but for traffic flow as well. Imagine a motorway with three lanes of traffic all electronically limited to 70mph, plus/minus 1mph. Nobody can make any progress on anyone else and nobody is willing to give an inch. Now imagine that you're in the outside lane and you've been trying to move over into the next lane for the last 10 miles but you can't because there's a queue of bunched-up traffic in lane 2 so there's no gap big enough to pull into, you can't get past because you haven't got the extra speed and you can't drop back because there's someone on your tail. And your exits coming up in a mile or two.
If you think that I'm exaggerating, just have a good look at how lorries behave the next time you're on the motorway.

Ling, firstly - without wishing to sound patronising - may I compliment you on your arguments against us. You've not gone 'off on one' at all and presented your case well. However (and you knew that was coming!) you yourself have confirmed in my mind EXACTLY what this site is about. You said and that is the problem! If more drivers knew what COAST was, and adhered to it, our roads would again be the safest in the world! But no, it is drummed into the populace that the only thing you need to do as a driver in order to be safe, is merely comply with the speed limit. There is SO much more to driving than that!

And, why are most (nearly all) of you men?

How do you know how much ground you have available? If something happens a quarter of a mile ahead of you, you have plenty of time to react. If something happens 10 feet ahead of you, you have no time to react, regardless of your speed. You can't predict when and where something's going to happen, and how far you're going to be away from it when it does, and the speed you happen to be travelling at makes absolutely no difference to where and when something happens.
And before you say something like, "Yes, but all other things being equal, the greater your speed the less time you have", you just cannot have all other things being equal if your speed is different. You cannot just change an object's velocity without also changing its position in time and space - that's basic physics. If your speed is different, you're going to be somewhere else at the time that that something happens.

Because, biologically speaking, thats what I was born as....

That's simply not true. My husband has just taken his C and his D tests, my nephew has just taken his car test, I took mine 5 years ago and in all that time, with all those hours of training, not once was COAST mentioned.

awww c'mon, you can do better than just one quote! I put it to you that you have no answer for the other points raised, especially the #1 issue: proof that 'speed cameras make a (good) difference'.


It doesn't matter what it's called, it's all about concentration, observation, anticipation, giving yourself space and time to react - this is all common sense stuff, wouldn't you agree?

Smeggy, but what about when I'm tuning my radio? Surely, everyone tunes their radio? Do you suggest I slow down to tune it? To give me more reaction time?

Usually it is reach, glance, road!, glance, stab, road!, glance, stab!, glance, ROAD!!, shit!, road, recover.

That's the drill. What acronym does that make?

look very carefully at that statement



No, not at all! You've made the suicidal assumption that the driver will keep the same gap to the vehicle in front at 5 and 100mph - that's very anti-C.O.A.S.T.


Like what we already have concerning speed adherence?

I took mine 5 years ago and in all that time, with all those hours of training, not once was COAST mentioned.

You're right, and thats part of the problem. I'm not sure where COAST orginates (Roadcraft?) but the IAM have their own - IPSGA (Information, Position, Speed, Gear and Acceleration) which defines their idea of a good system of driving.
Some of the most common expressions heard after an incident/accident are "appeared" and "suddenly". In reality few things 'appear' or happen 'suddenly', we are normally given ample warning if we open our eyes and look in the right place; too many drivers don't. They drive without a plan reacting to things that happen immediately ahead of and around them.
If we can just forget about enforcing one tiny element of driving practice and spread the COAST word then perhaps, just perhaps, we might make better drivers out of all of us.

So are you saying that while you were learning to drive, your instructor never once made mention of the following:

C - Concentrate
O - Observation
A - Anticipate
S - Space
T - Time

I would find it incredibly unlikely that none of these factors were brought to your attention while learning to drive, and if they weren't then your instructor failed you badly.

If more drivers knew what COAST was, and adhered to it,

Are you trying to convince me that most people on this forum drive while chanting COAST every 15 seconds, going through the sequence?

You only need to mess it up once, and the factors to conspire against you, and the accident has already happened.

And you sound like an ignoramous.

Ask yourself - honestly and accurately - the following questions:

1) How did we (i.e. the UK) achieve the safest roads in the world long before speed cameras came along?

2) What sorts of things does a driver have to do to avoid crashing?

3) If you're driving a car with a broken speedo, does it increase your crash risk?

4) If driving a car with a broken speedo does not substantially increase your crash risk, how important can the number on the sign be?

5) If we divert national driver attention and risk assessment to a low priority safety factor, what are the likely effects?



That's up to the visitors. We welcome alternative views. Indeed, I hope we have made you welcome.

And, why are most (nearly all) of you men?