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PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 01:42 
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Pratnership wrote:
SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
Pratnership wrote:
...and that it's wasn't such a leap anger me greatly. ...
The way I meant that is not the way that you have taken it. When people are abused they go one of two (typical) routes - they can become very promiscuous or very frigid. The 'wasn't such a leap' referred to the potential damage that prior incidents may have already caused.


Prior incidents? You make the assumption one or more of these were previously abused, which is not the case! This has gone very far off topic, I can only hope I have the wrong end of the stick. Can I suggest that no-one try and second guess the circumstances when they have no knowlage of the situation? Perhaps close it, as it seems to have served it's purpose anyway.

You are a sensitive soul ! I was explaining my possible earlier thought ! OF course I have no knowledge of this - am now curious though that you claim to have a great deal of knowledge on this.
Yep this is now all totally off topic and I am going to move it ...

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 11:35 
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Social network sites only cause harm when misused - but the managers of such sites seem to me to encourage this, in their quest to increase traffic and therefore revenue.
On top of this, certain manipulative users take advantage on the lax moderating environment to abuse people's privacy.

It is interesting how some users see the site as a huge part of their life, and believe everything they see and read there. Several celebrities have expressed concern this week that fake accounts in their names are being used to influence and deceive other users!

Of course there have been calls for a panic button - but that does not help those users who simply embrace the deceit they are presented with.

IMHO society would be a lot better off without them!

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 21:19 
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Ernest Marsh wrote:
Social network sites only cause harm when misused - but the managers of such sites seem to me to encourage this, in their quest to increase traffic and therefore revenue.
On top of this, certain manipulative users take advantage on the lax moderating environment to abuse people's privacy.

It is interesting how some users see the site as a huge part of their life, and believe everything they see and read there. Several celebrities have expressed concern this week that fake accounts in their names are being used to influence and deceive other users!

Of course there have been calls for a panic button - but that does not help those users who simply embrace the deceit they are presented with.

IMHO society would be a lot better off without them!


I've often wondered if the sort of people who frequent these sites are the same as those who witness some sort of incident ,report it on 999, then call up the press ,invite them along to give their version on air .I've never seen the need for them ,and after a recent change of policy of one ,where unless the poster opted out , a lot of their personal data was available to every TOM/DICK & HARRY ,I'm glad I don't subscribe to any of them ,although having had invitations to join in as a friend ( traced back to grand kids) ,I wonder how much of my data /address etc is held by them ,ready to be auctioned off next time they feel the need .

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 09:32 
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SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
You are a sensitive soul ! I was explaining my possible earlier thought ! OF course I have no knowledge of this - am now curious though that you claim to have a great deal of knowledge on this.
Yep this is now all totally off topic and I am going to move it ...


Yes, I do claim to have a lot of knowlage about this.

If you wish I can send a PM detailling what I know. Either way, you take me at my word or not.

The reason I am so 'sensitive' as you put it, is because it looks to me like your downplaying it without having the slightest clue as to what went on. If you knew some of the effects in this case, you would understand. I stress this is how it looks to me.

And when I said about his account being banned, I didn't mean you should keep it. More the confusion about his totally unrelated sex charge making him banned, rather than the huge amount of driving offences he had and lies he told on this forum.

Basically saying that people will be banned when convicted of a crime, but not if they lie and spread disinformation on this forum?

Edit: I just reviewed my PM's. I did send all the information back then as was requested by you, including the court date and time of his driving offence along with the offer of proof if needed. I said he should be banned or at least made to tell the truth on the forums - I never heard back from this.

Anyway, as for social networking sites, whatever the usefulness you think, they are here to stay, and will doubtless evolve. Education is by far the best key, there is simply no other answer.

You can't rely on the site itself, even the best security measures can't do much to anyone reasonably intelligent and determined.

You cannot rely on yourself either, there are some incrediably smart predators out there, I can assure you that you wouldn't always know when your child was talking to one.

And with it becoming common on mobile phones etc, you can't police it effectively.

The only way, is too stress that theres no need to give out details to people. And try and teach how even seemingly innocent bits of information can be used.


I've seen men have a massive library of pictures of someone they claim to be, so they can say 'Here's me on holiday...heres me at home chilling'

It's quite scary really!

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Last edited by Pratnership on Mon Apr 12, 2010 14:53, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:34 
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Pratnership wrote:
I've seen men have a massive library of pictures of someone they claim to be, so they can say 'Here's me on holiday...heres me at home chilling'

It's quite scary really!

Yep - and they often get these pictures from social networking sites, and personal picture albums.

It's not just men either - I had a woman in the US post a picture of my son on a help forum, and try to claim it was her picture - trouble for her was my son's picture was too well known and she was rumbled by the managers of the site where she posted them! They were able to alert authorities in the US before I had even received their emailed warning, and she was forced to stop her deceit which apparently involved several sites.

They seem much more on the ball there than here - where we are still struggling to get Sarah's law adopted!

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 13:23 
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Sarahs law is a bit of a double edged sword.

The problem is vigilantes, and the people who do things like demonstrate outside an offenders home. While I cannot summon up any sympathy for those convicted, it only helps to drive them underground.

It has to be said that the authorities do not maintain a good level of monitoring, and it's quite easy for them to go underground, as it were.

And the partial ideas were even worse - tell people theres an offender living in the area, but not who! Worst idea in the world, any single bloke just moving into the area would be under suspicion, or worse.

I don't think anyone truely knows which is worse. Sarahs/Megans law looks like it works, but then theres a lot of offenders been pushed underground because they fear what people will do when they find out what they have done. So needless to say, these ones that are lost to the system and not being monitored can pose a much greater risk.

I know that the law is on trial, whereby someone with children can contact authorities about someone to see if they are guilty of any sex offending. This only applies to those who think their children might have contact with an individual, though I presume it could be just living on the same street.

Going back to social networking sites, there is an absoloutly frightening amount of fake profiles on there. A lot of them are quite obvious, but for all those that are, how many look real? Anyone can check for themselves simply by looking for dodgy groups on facebook and soem of the members. Such groups constantly get deleted but always sprign back up under a new name.

I did send a list of recommendations to facebook. Such things like no-one under a certain age can make a group with various keywords in (like sex, masturbation etc), anyone whom creates such a group should have their profile deleted, or be prevented from starting any more groups, or becoming the admin/owner of any groups. Being able to report someone for such behaviour - theres no option to do this as yet, it's just bullying etc.

Just a list of things which would make it a bit better, rather than the obvious trading and meeting ground for such preverts. I never recieved a reply, and afaik, nothing has been implimented.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 16:38 
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This bias claim is being handled via PM as was asked by Claire. As you are well aware of. Since you say they are nothing more than air, I'll outline it here (though not the details in consideration of what I have been asked - but I fully approve of someone posting all these details).

I am very concerned as to why a member here was not banned after the admin and moderating team being given multiple bits of evidence of lying, completely false posts, doing many illegal motoring actions (not just speeding), and making many false claims about me. All of his post reports are tended to almost immeidatly, while mine were not looked at until a week later and after renotification.

And yet this member is banned for being found guilty of a sexual offence. This to me is a large part of why I think this forum suffers bias.

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 Post subject: Forum behaviour
PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 17:41 
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I should respond to this as it crosses over into my responsibilities.


There is no bias. The logic of the differing responses is obvious and numerous.

- The primary thrust of this campaign/forum is about road safe driving. We can help make folks aware of bad driving and can steer them onto the right course.
- Whatever that user did behind the wheel, it was not lawfully serious and proven enough to warrant custody.
- Folks who aren't detained can still access forums; a ban from the forums will hinder us from helping anyone with any poor driving.

The same cannot be said for the new offence.

- Such offences are not part the skill set of this forum/campaign. We’re not in a (comparatively equally strong) position to help, even if we had known about it.
- That new offence was lawfully serious and proven enough to warrant custody.
- A detained user has no access to any forums; we cannot help even if we were all experts in preventing that behaviour. Therefore a ban now has no negative impact.




If you continue to take issue with the moderation then please directly contact the moderators. Repeating that same complaint on the forum will not be viewed as constructive.
Please refrain from doing so.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 18:51 
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I have added in here two posts that are more appropriate in here than Here

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 20:47 
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Load of utter rubbish Steve, what utter rubbish. Having banned someone whom is now in custody is a pointless exercise, and nothing could be done to help someones driving when someone is proven to be lying and willfully doing something directly against the entire ethos that this site is about. I'd love to see it on the site where it says that anyone known to be in custody for any reason will have their account banned.

No point in commenting anymore, people will make of it what they will. Just a shame I'm not allowed to post all the links I sent you about all the driving offences and lies isn't it?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 21:31 
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Pratnership wrote:
Load of utter rubbish Steve, what utter rubbish. Having banned someone whom is now in custody is a pointless exercise, and nothing could be done to help someones driving when someone is proven to be lying and willfully doing something directly against the entire ethos that this site is about.

So, banning him, when you were requesting for us (through me) to communicate with him 'about his driving', would have done what exactly?

Pratnership wrote:
I'd love to see it on the site where it says that anyone known to be in custody for any reason will have their account banned.

Many people (especially trolls) would question us if he wasn't banned; I think the reader easily realises you would have tried to use that to your advantage too.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 21:31 
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This has gone on long enough. Please check your PM inbox.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2010 02:16 
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Quote:
Sarahs law is a bit of a double edged sword.

The problem is vigilantes, and the people who do things like demonstrate outside an offenders home. While I cannot summon up any sympathy for those convicted, it only helps to drive them underground.


Who remembers the News of the World's "Name and Shame campaign" all done (allegedly) in the name of kiddies safety (I suspect circulation figures was more the point) end results:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2000/aug/30/childprotection.society A doctor harassed

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/865633.stm An offender, known to police goes underground

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2010 06:03 
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For the record, this site is here to try and encourage people to understand good motoring behaviours and through this develop their skills, knowledge and perhaps ability. We point out our issues with the use of enforcement cameras as a negative road safety tool trafpol police substitute.

Due to the serious nature of this specific offence and for the sake of all concerned Squirrels account is deactivated until further notice, if anyone has any ongoing issue with this please PM the Admin Team or any of us directly.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2010 23:53 
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I don't want/wish to know the nitty gritty of this ,but lets add some backing to our mods ,who are doing a great job on this ,from what has been said /I've observed on here . Compare how this has been handled with the response on other sites to things that mods wanted damping down (perhaps PH & Cap Gatso) -where posters on here and there will remember how the sledgehammer was used ,as opposed to the more reasonable approach on here . :clap:

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