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Another Blair babe is now calling fo those ,sentenced to community service to wear a unifrom to show "justice is being served"

Her idea is to "humiliate" the yobs - but this could be counter productive as some of these yobs may take a "pride in being acknowledged as bad and hard". - and may cause vigilantes to make revenge attacks on these people.

More stunt politics and next thing - those served with Nips may end up being forced to wear such uniforms.

Blair babe Blears said that they should be seen top be peforming community taskes such as akeing floral baskets (already banned as they might fall on someones's head. Ridiculous..... )

She goes onto say that teenagers should not be on te street after dark... er... how do my kids get to and from school in winter.... surely she is not suggesting ... I t-t-take them in the car again? (My eldest performs this task at present - but in September I will either save bus fares by taking them or spend a fortune on the school bus service...._)

I note she offers no parenting skill courses or even Green Cross and safety courses....

Stunt politics .. like pratnerships...

Need one say more?

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MM-not so long ago this Labour Govt was telling us all about the good side of their parenting program - "parents were responsible " for the failings of the kids - truantism/ etc/etc.
Havent heard much about that recently - suspect it has gone down the pan. we had a history in this area of the yob culture - we defeated it by the good/oppressed forming a group to defeat it and pressing the council to apply ASBO s and enforce the conditions of tenancy on council tenants - pity that labour cannot read the motto of neighbourhood watch - goes something like "evil cannot survive in a society that cares"

Trouble is that the liberalies got in and started to use NW groups to expound the anti car lobby theories.
So what happened was similar to the takeover of the unions in the 60s .
Whats wrong today is that the silent majority has been terribly british and stood back - the rowdy minority has taken over and the tail now wags the dog.
The time has come for the dog(or cat) to take control of the tail again

Rubbish - this country has rejected Conservative principles, and will continue to do so for my lifetime, hopefully.

The problem is that conservative blame culture targets the wrong people. Remember the anti-single mum crusade during the late Thatcher/early Major years? I've seen families where both parents are present producing rude children. Likewise most immigrant families produce some of the best-behaved, hard-working children on the planet, and yet it is those who are demonised, rather than our homegrown parents so fixated on their jobs and keeping up with the Joneses that they let the telly act as surrogate babysitter!

FYI my intense dislike of the Conservatives stems mainly from the ad hominem attacks on single mothers (and the non-powerful in general). My Mum, who was divorced while raising myself and my sister (Dad never accepted growing up and buggered off around the world with a lass who was the spit of my Mum, but two years younger and without children, lest she be blamed for her situation) did an admirable job and is currently a first-rate primary school teacher trying to undo the damage that this culture of blame has caused.

As I said, Peak Oil is reality, and that means that we *will* have to give our cars up sooner or later, or at least cars as we know them. All conservatism and the pro-car lobby offers us is denial of this reality.

Tc.

How come the Conservatives had a larger share of the vote than Labour in the recent election then?

I would say that England is most definitely, staunchly conservative through and through; and the reason we temporarily have a Labour Government is simply because they adopted enough conservative policies to make themselves electable, whilst cleverly selecting a leader who is deemed to be more charismatic than his opponent.

But I have to admit the latter point still defeats me, as I have never been able to see anything in Lord Tony other than a slimy jumped-up double glazing salesman. But that's just my opinion...

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Backlash from the majority of Labour and Liberal voters who opposed the war in Iraq, mainly. Incidentally, could you give me a link to a non-Telegraph article to make this claim? The Tories did worse this year than Labour did in 1983. Says somewthing really.



Maybe 20 years ago, but the times they are a-changing. Thatcherite "I'm alright Jack" politics will never again have a voice in this country if I have anything to do about it. The wealthy and upper middle-class will have to pay their taxes, like their European brethren.

Selfish Tories are a dying breed in this country, and that can only be a good thing.

Tc.

I don't have a link, but I'd say the point is beyond doubt - all you need to do is go and add up the total votes cast in all the seats to see that if we had PR we'd have a small Conservative majority now.


The problem is that the middle classes are being asked to pay everyone else's taxes too! This isn't about being selfish, its about being fair.

If my experiences are anything to go by, the policies of this Government are gradually turning the country into a "demeritocracy"...

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It'd technically be a hung parliament, and a Lab/Lib alliance would be far more likely. Though remember that first-past-the-post is a two-edged sword that put the Tories back in power in 1992, when by all rights they should have been out on their ear.




Which "everyone else" are you talking about? Aside from the fact that public services have to be funded somehow, what do you think you're being overcharged for? Don't you think as someone who's got a well-paying job out of the system that we should contribute more to help those less fortunate?



The Conservatives on the other hand promoted those with obscene amounts of inherited wealth and those who'd engage in underhanded business practices to enrich themselves as standard-bearers to emulate.

I realise that we're taking the thread off-topic here, but I'd rather see rewards for creating sustainable amounts of wealth and following ethical business practices rather than the 'greed is good' philosophy that typifies Tory mentality.

Tc.

Do you mean that people in England staunchly vote conservative through and through, or that they staunchly believe in conservative ideas through and through? And if the latter, what uniquely identifies conservative ideas?

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Note the small 'c' in my post!

Whilst it is nigh impossible to sum up "conservative ideals" in a sentence or two, perhaps the simplest definition would be "the opposite of socialist".

For myself I believe in personal responsibility, "Lassaiz-Faire with a catch net" would sum up my philosophy reasonably well. I believe in rewarding achievement, in encouraging people to strive to achieve their very best rather than judging all by the standards of the lowest.

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I don't see myself as having a got a well paying job "out of the system", I see myself as someone who has strived for twenty years or more to better myself, and made all sorts of sacrifices along the way to get to where I am today.

I am happy to make a fair contribution to public services, what I object to is the inept mis-management and emphasis on petty regulation and beaurocracy that has seen my tax contributions rocket over the last two administrations, whilst public services have steadily worsened. Meanwhile we have a socialist "nanny state" which continually overrides my judgement in telling me what I may or may not do.


I don't think it "typifies" Tory mentality, though perhaps it typifies your view of it? I don't think "greed is good", nor ever have done.

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Tc.
I realise that we're taking the thread off-topic here, but I'd rather see rewards for creating sustainable amounts of wealth and following ethical business practices rather than the 'greed is good' philosophy that typifies Tory mentality.

1) At least under Tory rule we had [/b]democracy - u know - govt of the people by the people for the people - no policing of votes - as we all knew we could trust the parties to play by the rules -

And Just prior to a general election we get postal vote fraud -
quote from a judge "on a scale equal to a banana republic"

A very old joke once said - mount yer asses and camels and i'll lead you to the promised land - Labour got hold of it several years ago and rephrased it - lean on yer shovels ,sit on yers asses ,smoke yer camels - this is the promised land -

Nothing against the bloke who's lost his job or the single divorced or by choice single mum.
Been on the dole a coulpe of times but fought my way back into work.
Its the full time dole livers with several part time jobs that i object to.

Likewise - but most of the Tories favoured the haves over the have-nots... you can't deny that. I've gone out of my way to do the best I can, and feel very fortunate. Personally I get warm fuzzies from helping out those less so.



18 years of under-funding under the Tories are going to take longer than 8 years to turn around - any economist can tell you that. And from my personal experience public services have actually improved, it's just that with an exponentially growing population it takes more money to do so.

Better than employing middle-managers at rates far above the workers they manage to try and figure out how to do as much work with fewer resources, which was the Tories' one-stop solution to everything. For example, the NHS is only over-bureaucracised due to Tory meddling in the '80s - the simple fact is that it is the third largest employer in the world behind the Chinese Army and the Indian railways, plus the current administration system was designed to cope with the population we had in the 1940s. It's bound to be expensive.



As for the nanny-state... I believe it was the Conservatives who brought in the draconian 1994 Criminal Justice Act, which circumscribes far more harmless activities than the current government.

Do you believe in the apocryphal benefit cheats as well?



You are having a laugh, right?

Tory deregulation led to the collapse of our industries in order to make a quick buck for the investment classes. Deregulation of farming pretty much directly led to the BSE crisis. Ham-fisted attitudes to Europe cost us nearly 20 years where we could have been doing something positive and inclusive rather than let Franco-German interests carve the market up between themselves. Then you had the Westland affair, where we threw away a much better deal with a European conglomerate in favour of a deal favouring the Yanks, down to ideology alone. The Herald Of Free Enterprise sinks, but we don't get legislation enforcing extra safety measures on ro-ro ferries because P&0 makes a million-pound donation to the Tory party.... the list goes on.



Funnily enough, the last two electoral cycles have seen two of the most pro-employment governments in this country's history. The apocryphal tales of 'benefit frauds' are very much tabloid hype - archconservatives don't have a leg to stand on without straw men to knock down.



Know any outside the ones in the Currant Bun reports? 'Cos I'm from a pretty poor area originally and I don't know any.

Tc.

You seem to be describing Tony Blair. Are you a labour voter, by any chance?

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I stole this .sig

The uniform could have a type of Tutu on it, like a ballet costume. And a silly pink hat. They would have to been really stupid to take pride in that!

She's right though - make'em hate doing community service!

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I stole this .sig

Used to be a joke bout Mrs T - responsible for reducing very large fims to small ones - Mr B has the honour of putting his majority on a crash diet.
But the political bit has got a bit OTT, don't you agree - my idea of political correctness is that [/b] i dont start biting a nose coz i dont like your politics -
I and others in here ( well i hope so ) believe that your support of a football team/ political party is your own concern. None of my business till you start shoving it down my throat - ( not you b/werk, i add)
You want that - go to a country where the idea of postal fraud /voting fraud originated
When that starts we descend to the level of the "hoodies" - "i dont like the way you think, therefore i'll bring my mates and a big stick"
Rant over.

Now i like the bit from the mad doc
The uniform could have a type of Tutu on it, like a ballet costume. And a silly pink hat. They would have to been really stupid to take pride in that!

Not bad - make them sit throught how your colleagues undo the damage they've done
Ever heard what hapened to "parenting courses" or was that another idea that fell by the wayside.

I would have thought the Blair government was following the typical Labour path of increased taxation, wasteful public expenditure, centralisation of power and tighter regulation of both business and individual lifestyles.

Blair's trick is to give people the impression that he is somehow conducting "Conservative-lite" policies, which he isn't.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

According to the Times election supplement from last week, the national share of the vote (excluding Northern Ireland) was:

Labour 36.1%
Conservative 33.1%
LibDem 22.6%

The Conservatives won a small overall majority of votes cast in England.


They got a significantly higher proportion of the vote - 33% against 28%. However, the workings of the electoral system left them with fewer seats than Labour in 1983.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

I seem to remember a lot of so-called "experts" (including M. King Hubbert of Peak Oil fame) telling us in 1973 that the oil would have run out around now. But it hasn't, and the reserves/production ratio is much the same as it was back then.

Obviously oil reserves are ultimately finite, but they're not going to run out or anything like it in the lifetime of any of us. If prices rise, previously uneconomic reserves can be profitably extracted.

Even without oil, there will still be a need for independently-powered vehicles not hooked up to a central power supply, and it's hard to believe some of them won't be used for private transport. I suspect a very high oil price would concentrate people's minds on developing much cheaper and lighter rechargeable batteries for vehicles. People aren't going to have to give up their cars *ever*.

Tell me, _Tc_, do you value the freedom, flexibility and mobility that the private car gives to people? Or do you at heart welcome the possibility of some kind of oil crisis as a means of curbing that freedom?

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Peter E - YOU SAID -

Tell me, _Tc_, do you value the freedom, flexibility and mobility that the private car gives to people? Or do you at heart welcome the possibility of some kind of oil crisis as a means of curbing that freedom?

Thats why i put in the bit about respecting other peoples views to their politics( no way getting at you by the way, only agreeing) - as far as im concerned this site is about motoring, ok if a sideline issue is politics then fine, but i respect everymans political opinian - i expect them to respect mine and leave my nose on my face.

The last etimates I saw was that there are sufficient reserves to last another 50 years at current rates of consumption.