Safe Speed Forums

In fact they appear to be dying out. Being "nice" - along with good manners und tolerance .. are a dying art per another study

OK .. we are losing "neighbourliness"....ist a skill - but then when people end up stabbling each other over whose car ist parked in whose driveway und then jump off motorway bridges in what appear to have bubbled over into uncontrolled raging tantrums - und because he built a wall instead of a fence.. und did up the house und disturbed the peace with barbecues und loud music.. .. (sometimes I think the Swiss have a point in banning lawn mowers und barbecues after church on Sundays... ) But people do not know names of persons who live next door or over the road these days und borrowing a cup of sugar - ist substance banned by the thought police

Another vanishing "skill" - being punctual . But then again .. per the prat site fun und games.. they proudly proclaim ist better to be late for work .. even if you refuse to play the game

Talking correctly? Well that ist a matter of opinion.. Are we talking Oxford English, Queen's English, Estuary English or reeeet Norrthurrn! Or able to write und speak with no spelling or grammatical mistakes?

Und looking smart? Ist this shorts with the sandals und the white terry towel socks und the "ain't 'alf 'ot mum shorts" or lycra ones for evening meal in 5 start Swiss hotel instead of changing to nice smart casual - but tasteful?

Technology ist blamed for loss of the skills of letter writing, hand writing und conversation.. with many chatting on-line - but without the faces und the voices .. people get all het up und vulgar abuse inveigles the scene.

A recent survey revealed the top 20 skills we lose

Not surprisingly GOOD MANNERS tops the list..

This ist the list: Und you know I think some of these spill over into roads und safety on the roads too.

1. Good Manners
2. Letter Writing
3. Cooking a meal from scratch with whatever in larder
4. Neighbourliness
5. Speaking correctly
6. Discipline
7. Handwriting
8. Needlework ( you need to be able to sew a button or a hem at least)
9. Survival Skills - definitely on decline)
10. Received wisdon (ist passing on TRADITION down the generations und verges on a discussion elsewhere - which ist a bit heated


11. Looking smart
12. Punctuality
13. Good conversation
14 TOLERANCE OF OTHER CULTURES!
15. Monogamy (You Brits have highest divorce rates in Europe! )

16. Political awareness (how many can name ALL members of Cabinet und Shadow Cabinets und comment on them then ) Most Brits do not even bother to vote anyway.. which might say just as much about political wallies as much as an apathetic nation who may just wake up in a dicatorship if they do not wake up from la-la land.

17. Housework.. (I do wonder when office desks, handy phones.. ordinary phones, steering wheels all have "more germs than toilet seats")

Listen 'ere - my lav seat ist my business but the Klo gets Big Dom und a toilet duck und a blue (or rather lemon rinse) in the cistern.. und I launder the sheets each week too.. und.. I do wipe my office desk und lovingly pamper my car inside und out with stuff from Yee Olde Carre Shoppe in Keswick..


18. CAR MAINTENANCE There ist nothing like tinkering with an old engine und getting her to purrrrrrrrrrrrrrr all over again. Und the satisfactions too.. But some do not even bother taking new car to garage to check tyres these days Ask them what tyre pressure should be for car fully laden und empty und you get a blank stare.. Ist as if I speak Schwyzer to them... But seriously.. new cars .. not really possible to DIY apart from perhaps the odd oil/battery/sparky change or check.

19. Home DIY.. Well Nanny State put a stop to that one anyway. Soon you will have to ask permission to change a light bulb lest you hurt yourself!

20. Poliical correctness. By this they mean the correct kind.. the one which does not patronise nor condescend nor border on insanity

Oddly enough - this survey found that those surveyed did want to improve their skills.. but driving car or riding bike well do not feature ..

Nein.. they wanted to...

have better sex.. (ist what you make it.. und .. we have kittens after all )

juggle (I hesitate to ask - but is this .. nein... you could not concentrate - )

winning arguments (I tend to win all mine sort of .. ) (I am not sure in what context they mean "winning arguments"

playing poker.. (it gets more risque und rudey here )

gatecrash parties successfully? That would set those laydeez in charge at Laddette Academy into deep faints (ITV chav TV - oddly compelling just for the looks on the faces of those elderly ladies as the "student ladies" offer more that wafer thin mints after dinner

But back to seriousness...

But do you agree with the list? What would you add .. like to see more of?

Oddly enough - we had more obvious advice from our Tone last week..


"Sneeze und cough into hankies und do not infect others"

]

Again.. this ist part of good manners.. Using a hanky und not spluttering over others..




One could add tolerance on the road.. observed on person today blast his horn just because the driver in front stalled engine at traffic lights.. The fact this person had a P plate just did not seem to bother him und - in my opinion - this twazak tailgated the poor little guy up to the next roundabout where fortunately he chose a different exit. Then there was the biker who did not give way to the cyclist at the chicane.. und the driver who gave the cyclist room.. but straddled the double whites und nearly hit the mirror of the on-coming lorry. It was a close call und blaring of horns und no doubt rudey gestures ... All avoidable... with dollop of COAST und a second's patience, thought und plan und driver should have waited a couple of yards until double whites ceased to be in any case when road opens to a dual carriageway at a healthy NSL

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

Neighbourliness indeed my dear cousin. Ta - by the way for this almost whimsical post of bye-gone days.

"Neighbourliness" as a declining skill..

Oh YES!

I am sure all have read and heard of the chap - sadly one of a gorwing number - murdered just because he challenged some yobs on his doorstep."

By the way .,. I am no pee-cee plod... I call a yob a yob! Yobs are not "offended" - they usually are void of such feelings from my experience to date.. "proverbial water off a duck's back"

But these attacks on the one who dares...

If people had the courage and just confronted as a group of neighbours.. these thugs are like all bullies.,.. basically [i] cowards

I think we have to re-develop our "neighbourly skills" and just chat to our neighbours a bit more. From a police point of view.. it helps in terms of "self policing" and "intelligence gatehring" should something go "wrong." - and I mean this in terms of sudden "domestics". We had one really sad case whereby a young lady caring for a an elderly lady who was suffering from demtia snapped, shouted a lot and almost ended up with an ASBO for "disturbing the neighbours" by getting enraged by the elderly parent she was struggling to care for. The officer dealing used common sense by the way. (IG blows trumpet for his colleagues )

Oh - there is a sort of happy ending as we did get the relevant services involved and some help for this struggling middle aged singleton of modest means and her old Mum. But a little more awareness and understanding and general neighbourliness may have prevented a "disturbance" in the first place/

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Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

I think we are losing values very quickly.
I think most people are becoming mindless consumers.

Now you seem to be judged on what you own, and if you are 'good looking' (not that you can tell cos it is all make up).

Look at the role models for children.
I have just moved into a new area, very few people have smiled and said hello, despite my smiling . If I say hello I get a reluctant hello (I fact this happens everywhere)
One of my neighbours looked shocked when I first said hello.


It is a real shame; no one seems to trust any one.

I think people, for whatever reason think the world is a horrible place, full of evil people. People don’t seem to realise most people are like them, friendly have families and people they care about. I don’t really know who is to blame for this.

We let our children get away with too much; we teach them they have rights, however we teach little about social responsibility.

Fact I think that maybe at the core of the problem. Everyone is so concerned with their own individual rights, now one seems to care about the individuals social responsibility.

There seems to little focus on where the individual’s rights stop and the individual’s social responsibility start.

One example comes to mind:
When I was a student I was on a train, sat opposite was a young woman with her baby.
Then she started to breast feed the baby in front of me. It made me feel quite uncomfortable.
While I understand she does have the right to breast feed her child, but I feel she does have to also consider that some people may feel uncomfortable with her doing it.

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Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor

1. Good Manners - I'd like lots more of this please!

2. Letter Writing - I'm not that bothered about "letter" writing, but I'd like to see more people capable of writing fluently and grammatically in their native language!

3. Cooking a meal from scratch with whatever in larder - I'm not great at that myself!

4. Neighbourliness - yes - more please!

5. Speaking correctly - I'd prefer to say people should be able to speak in a way appropriate to the context or situation?

6. Discipline - SELF discipline please!

7. Handwriting - Frankly as long as I can read it I don't care about this.

8. Needlework ( you need to be able to sew a button or a hem at least) - I CAN do those and so can my sons

9. Survival Skills - definitely on decline) - not sure what you mean?

10. Received wisdon (ist passing on TRADITION down the generations und verges on a discussion elsewhere - which ist a bit heated Happy that WISDOM is passed on - not all traditions are good however

11. Looking smart - smart by WHOSE standards - I'm a bit iffy about this. I'd settle for clean and not "scruffy"

12. Punctuality - Yes - more please!

13. Good conversation - I don't find this an issue - I choose my friends on this basis

14 TOLERANCE OF OTHER CULTURES! Yes - tolerance not "submission" though!

15. Monogamy - well - one at at time anyway....

16. Political awareness (how many can name ALL members of Cabinet und Shadow Cabinets und comment on them then ) Most Brits do not even bother to vote anyway.. which might say just as much about political wallies as much as an apathetic nation who may just wake up in a dicatorship if they do not wake up from la-la land.

Our poltical parties have brought us down to the depths here...


17. Housework.. (I do wonder when office desks, handy phones.. ordinary phones, steering wheels all have "more germs than toilet seats")

Within reason - clean first, tidy second

18. CAR MAINTENANCE - at least so they can check their own oil!

19. Home DIY.. Well Nanny State put a stop to that one anyway. Soon you will have to ask permission to change a light bulb lest you hurt yourself! Agreed

20. Poliical correctness. By this they mean the correct kind.. the one which does not patronise nor condescend nor border on insanity Agreed

Who needs monogamy?

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Andrew.

Ooooo! best not let my missus hear you say that! She's a real breastfeeding evangelist!

Trouble is, I've been in the situation where you're somewhere you'd rather not be and a baby starts yelping for a feed. It's not an easy one to get around. I have to say that faced with the prospect of the wee brat bawling its head off for the rest of the trip or the potential risk of a glimpse of something rude, I think I'd probably have opted to avert my gaze and live with it! Even as a bloke, I have to admit that there's something a bit perverse about a society where you can't walk into a newsagent without being confronted with rows and rows of publications that show rather more than you'd have been treated to and it's considered "normal". But heaven help the woman caught using them for their primary purpose!

Wives and husbands? (usually)

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Ah yes there is them. Well it depends which country they're in...

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Andrew.

Which I did, (I was about 19-20 then.).

But where do her rights stop, and my mine start?
We both have rights;

She has the right to feed her child.
I also have the right not see her do it, is it my right to live with it?
This is what I mean where do the individual rights stop and social reasonability start, There may have been more people on the train who did not feel confortable with it?



Agreed.
But in a newsagent you can just avert your gaze and live with it.

_________________
Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor

I remember many years ago a lady on the train - not overly crowded (she sat diagonally opposite me) asking if she could feed her child - I was very pleased that she asked, had no problem with her doing so, arranged myself slightly lower in the seat so my book obfuscated any view of anything happening below her chin and we carried on with our journey. We exchanged smiles periodically. I was not in the least bit uncomfortable - far from it. This natural process is all part of humanity. I'm sure from her smile that my gesture to avoid inadvertent "ogling" was appreciated.

You where asked, I was not given a choice. It was her right, and I had to live with it.

This is point I am attemptingto make, WHERE DO INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS STOP AND SOCIAL REASPONCEABLITY START.

Yes she has the right to feed her child. I am not saying she does not. However I am saying surly she has a social responsibility to make sure people are comfortable with it. Because if she does not she is infringing on other passengers right to have a relaxed journey.

It is not something I feel comfortable with, however my rights don't count?
Does she have the right to make me feel uncomfortable?
Do I stop having right because this makes me feel uncomfortabe, it is a perfectly processes and part of life.

_________________
Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor

I do sympathise. I was in a comparatively uncrowded train. I could easily have adopted a "I'll move to another seat" strategy. However, since I had - truly had - no problem, my staying actually alleviated any "third party" problems. Had the train been very crowded, she may not have asked, as a refusal may have then been more problematical for her. I really don't know.

In many ways - though not all - it parallels smoking in confined public spaces? That I would have objected to in yesteryear if circumstances allowed. Typically I simply had to bear it.

If she asked you if you minded and you said 'yes' what would you have expected her to do next?

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Less Kodak, more Kojak.
In times of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

Do you know, I wish I never cited that example, Reasons?
-You are concentrating more or example.
-I feel like am being treated like an unreasonable person (which I don’t think I am).
-No one is discussing.

WHERE DO INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS STOP AND SOICAL REASPONCABLITY START?

I like to consider myself as a reasonable person, and despite my feeling uncomfortable I probably would had said 'no' and looked the other way,BUT I would have felt LESS uncomfortable as feelings/rights were considered while she was practicing her rights. However I was not asked, so my rights did not matter, while she practiced hers(Which is my point, the breast feeding is largely unimportant).

We all have rights, however there are times when these rights affect the rights of other individuals. We therefore have a social reasonability to consider how our actions/rights affect other people.

E.g.

Smoking in a room full of people who do not wish to smoke.
The smoker has the right to smoke, however non-smokers have the right not to breathe in second had smoke.

I have the right to listen to my personal stereo on a train, however I do not have the right to play it so loud other passengers can hear it.

I think MP3 players on mobile phones with loud speakers are a prime example of this.
When on a bus individuals will listen to their music form their mobile, with little consideration of other passengers. They see it as their right to play music from their phone, however they do not consider they have a social responsibility to other passengers who may not want to listen to their music.



I feel today we focus on the rights of the individual so much, people are becoming selfish and no longer consider or care how their actions may effect others.

_________________
Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor

I think it's a generation thing. The younger generation certainly go more on rights than social responsibility. I don't think that applies anything like as much among the gentlefolk born and bred in the "old money" era.

Well that's the example you gave, and I'm interested in why you think what she did was wrong, which you obviously do.

As has been pointed out already in this thread, they're just breasts! And it's not as if you've likely to see much anyway; I doubt very much she whipped them out and dangled them in front of you. Once the baby's on there feeding what is left for you to see and be upset or uncomfortable about?

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I really just don't understand why it's a problem at all.

You should also consider that a woman might feel a bit self-conscious announcing to half the train "I'M GOING TO START BREAST FEEDING MY BABY! IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM, PLEASE LOOK AWAY NOW!!!"

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Less Kodak, more Kojak.
In times of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

If I were the woman I wouldn't feel very comfortable myself whipping out the baby's drink with surrounding people potentially watching.

Ist why France, Germany und even Switzerland invite the speeder to see the photo evidence in private at the police station as they might have been "speeding to see their mistress"

I do not know if this has ever been used as "mitigating excuse" though...

But ja.. I am loyal to Mad Doc und for you blokey blokes with the rovin' eyes - wives can smell other wimmin.. if you have bit on side.. better make sure her fave perfume ist the same as the wife's!

I have my own perfume made at Fragonard und I wear Givenchy scent - usually bought for me by Mad Doc on our "special days" like my birthday, und our anniversary.

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

Ach Liebchen - I see from your signature you also like Joe Walsh I ldo love his work away from Eagles - und I like the Eagles as well.


You felt embarrassed as young man when a Mama feed her baby on a train. Ist always a problem as men und wimmin do see breasts as "sex object" und a woman well endowed as "a right little sex pot".

Ist a bit like size of male bits und bobs . But where speed matter.. size does not matter in how those bits actually perform their natural task.. which ist ensuring we procreate und ensure our genetic profile survive to future generations.

From the lady's point of view.. a train toilet ist probably the nastiest loo on planet. Und there are ways of breastfeeding a child discreetly.

With all kittens to date - usually fed them, winded them und changed nappy before we set off anywhere. Of course - you cannot control appetites und when they required feed outside family home .. und if not weened or ready for juice or bottle of whatever.. und required my milk. there are ways of remaining a lady und retaining that "mystique". When a nursing Mama (und you know .. boobies producing milk - not so comfy in reality.) But I used to wear a button down blouse or dress und wear a shawl or wrap - now very fashionable und no one actually noticed me feed them in a more public view.

But you keep things discreet if you have to feed "in public" as public loos are not really as hygienic as they should be - especially train ones.

If the lady subjected you to a full frontal droopy booby ...leaking milks - then that ist neither ladylike nor acceptable behaviour.


But perhaps she did not ask if OK to do so.. why you felt embarrassed perhaps?



Ja .. ist true.. "rights of the individual und a "me.. me ME" society erodes our cultural und established society.

Have this with handy phones in restaurants.. at the plays at the local "Theatre By the Lake".. at the ballet...

These should be switched OFF out of repsect to those on stage und those who paid good money to enjoy a lovely night out watching und marvelling at the talent of others to act und sing und dance like that.

I did breastfeed all my kittens in public places on very very rare occasions - but did so so discreetly that no-one even knew this had occurred. Ladies act like ladies Liebchen .. even when nature try to dictate to them.

Chavettes.. Ladettes.? Ist a different ball game.

Now must go.. want to watch some men playing bows und arrows in tights on the telly ....

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

Exactly. The "special cuddle" is not obviously recogniseable to one walking past who isn't tuned in - and to one who is, it is really not a problem!