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PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2009 21:15 
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Idiots.

MEN wrote:

Drivers jailed over race crash
May 27, 2009

TWO drivers who raced at high speeds and left a woman severely brain damaged in a horrific crash have been jailed.

Motor trader Joel Wharmby raced a high performance sports car against Lee Unwin, who was on a high powered Suzuki motorbike, before crashing into a Renault Clio carrying five passengers.

On impact the Clio was thrown into the air and span around, throwing three women from the back seat into the road.

They suffered life threatening injuries and one, Samantha Butterworth, 33 at the time, was left permanently disabled and remained in hospital for more than 18 months after the accident which happened on Manchester Road, Rochdale, in September 2007.

Unwin, 38, of Oriel Close, Chadderton, and Wharmby, 24, of Victoria Street, Littleborough - who did not know each other - were each given the maximum sentence of two years behind bars for dangerous driving but Wharmby's was reduced to 16 months for entering an early guilty plea.

Unwin was convicted of the offence following a four day trial in March. Both were disqualified from driving for three years.

The court heard how they were both using vehicles which could reach top speeds of 170mph and were travelling at 70mph on a 40mph stretch before the crash.

Unwin was riding a high performance red Suzuki GSX R60 motorcycle when he spotted Wharmby at traffic lights in a Noble M12 GT0, a low-slung sports car,

Manchester Crown Court heard. Prosecutor Robert Smith said: "The two defendants then engaged in an episode of competitive driving.

"The Noble was the first vehicle in the offside lane, with engine revving.

"The motorcycle ridden by Unwin approached the lights, it moved off at speed as though Mr Unwin wanted to compete with the Noble once the lights turned to green.

"Other witnesses described how Wharmby tried to play catch up with the Suzuki by moving into the inside lane."

The Renault Clio, carrying friends home from a shopping trip in Manchester, was turning into New Barn Lane when it was hit by the Noble sports car which Wharmby was delivering to a prospective customer.

Miss Butterworth and friends, Reanne Fraser and Gemma Chauhan, 24 and 25 at the time, were all hospitalised. The court heard they had not been wearing seatbelts.


You have still not faced up to and accepted the gravity of your dangerous driving.

Recorder Paul Reed QC

Miss Fraser remained in hospital for two months and Miss Chauhan for seven weeks.

Recorder Paul Reed QC said witnesses had described hearing engines screaming as Wharmby egged Unwin on for a race and Unwin was 'giving it welly'.

He said it was fortunate there had been no fatalities and referred to a statement from Samantha's mother, Susan King, saying: "Mrs King describes in harrowing detail the ordeal she and her family were put through when they expected at first that their daughter, Sam, was going to die but miraculously she pulled through.

"But the disabilities she has means she will never make a full recovery and have a normal sort of life."

He told Unwin: "You have still not faced up to and accepted the gravity of your dangerous driving."

The Recorder said he hoped the sentences would serve as a reminder to others of the penalties they could expect for similar offences.

He also branded the two-year maximum sentence for dangerous driving as "hopelessly inadequate".

Barristers for both defendants said that the three victims had not been wearing seatbelts which had contributed to their injuries.

Two men in the front of the car, who were wearing seatbelts, received either no injuries or minor ones, the court heard.

Pc Martin Slater, of Greater Manchester Police's Road Policing Unit, said: "Neither men knew each other but took it upon themselves to race at excessive speed down a busy road.

"Their stupid, childish actions have ruined not just Samantha's chances of living a normal life, but have greatly affected her family's happiness too.

"The fact Unwin left the scene of this terrible collision, when three innocent women had been thrown from their car, is inexcusable and it is only by the grace of god that no one was killed.

"Driving like they did proves that clearly, Wharmby and Unwin could not have been less bothered about the safety of other road users."

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PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2009 21:17 
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Law ist an ass? or ass licker to pee-cee fools?

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 00:59 
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Good argument for wearing seat belts though!


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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 06:26 
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Mole wrote:
Good argument for wearing seat belts though!


If it were demonstrated that wearing seat belts would have prevented or mitigated the injuries should the sentence be reduced and should the damages paid be less?

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 07:54 
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I think the sentence already lenient. Driving ban should start on completion of jail sentence - und these bans seem to be concurrent with the prison term. :? :?

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 10:09 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
Mole wrote:
Good argument for wearing seat belts though!


If it were demonstrated that wearing seat belts would have prevented or mitigated the injuries should the sentence be reduced and should the damages paid be less?


seems to be the way cycling without a helmet is going.... :(


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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 14:47 
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3 women not wearing seatbelts injured, 2 men in the front who were wearing seatbelts uninjured if I've read it correctly. That sums it up really. Don't think really need to comment on the racers.


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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 15:42 
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Mind Driver wrote:
3 women not wearing seatbelts injured, 2 men in the front who were wearing seatbelts uninjured if I've read it correctly. That sums it up really. Don't think really need to comment on the racers.


Indeed. The thread title could as well apply to the injured women as to the racing drivers.

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 17:47 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
If it were demonstrated that wearing seat belts would have prevented or mitigated the injuries should the sentence be reduced

Thinking out loud:

Is it mandatory (via lawful regulation or whatever) to wear seatbelts, even when in the rear seats?

I'm giving my opinion on both answers for completeness:
- If not then the racers caused the serious injuries, by dangerous driving
- If so, and it can be reasonably expected the injuries wouldn't have occurred if worn, then they merely caused the crash by dangerous driving.

It is mandatory that seatbelts be worn where fitted. Unfortunately for these racers, there are exemptions are granted for wearing seatbelts, and seatbelts need not be installed on all cars. Hence I'm tending towards them not having a reduced sentence.

dcbwhaley wrote:
... and should the damages paid be less?

Assuming you're talking about the injured in the car:

I believe there is no official expectation that non-belters get reduced treatment/payment. Please do correct me if I'm wrong, but if I am wrong then many others could have that expectation too.
Assuming that's the case then my answer is No for the simple reason that, at some level, their decision would have been partly based on their reasonable expectation that they can expect to get adequate treatment/payment if they don't wear a belt.

If it was already accepted and known that non-belters would get reduced treatment/payment then they might have made a different choice.

To deprive anyone based on their choice, where there is no reason for expectation of deprivation resulting from that choice, is unfair.

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 18:22 
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I was in a passenger in a coach crash (in Germany) a few years back. I was wearing a seat belt, my mate in the next seat had his on (he says) but flew out of it. The insurers (british) tried to reduce his claim on the assumption that he wasn't wearing one.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 18:48 
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graball wrote:
I was in a passenger in a coach crash (in Germany) a few years back. I was wearing a seat belt, my mate in the next seat had his on (he says) but flew out of it. The insurers (british) tried to reduce his claim on the assumption that he wasn't wearing one.

Was such a clause stipulated within insurance documents that your mate would have signed and agreed to?

- If so then IMO the insurers have every right to reduce payment to those found unbelted (doesn't apply to your mate of course)
- If not then it's tough for the insurers.

Either way, I don't believe the unbelted passengers in that car signed or agreed to any such clause.

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 19:49 
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Cyclists, who have no legal requirement to wear helmets, can expect vilification on these forums if they are injured when not wearing one. Yet car passengers who disobey the law regarding the wearing of seat belts do not.

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 20:22 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
Cyclists, who have no legal requirement to wear helmets, can expect vilification on these forums if they are injured when not wearing one. Yet car passengers who disobey the law regarding the wearing of seat belts do not.

Oh no, sorry but that's wrong.

All I was saying is that it would, as things stand, be unfair to reduce payments to those who didn't belt up (I apply the same logic to unhelmeted cyclists, who I don't vilify). Also, I'm very much against people who don't wear seatbelts (for those who know, I was Seatbelt Steve on the GOS guestbook; or more of the same from our own forum) - consider them vilified by yours truly. To reconcile: I strongly believe the law should be changed such that those who don't belt-up should be made to pay their own additional costs (that would make them belt up).

Now I think about it, I'm ass about face from what you describe (and I'm against compulsory helmet use).

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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 20:23 
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Quote:
G.B. Rogers studied over 8 million cases of injury and death to cyclists over 15 years in the USA. He concluded as follows: "There is no evidence that hard shell helmets have reduced the head injury and fatality rates. The most surprising finding is that the bicycle-related fatality rate is positively and significantly correlated with increased helmet use."


[Rodgers, G.B., Reducing bicycle accidents: a reevaluation of the impacts of the CPSC bicycle standard and helmet use, Journal of Products Liability, 11, pp. 307-317, 1988]

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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 01:15 
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I worked with a bloke some years ago who was injured in a car crash whilst not wearing a seat belt and his payout was reduced somewhat because of it. I'm not a big fan of "compulsory" anything really, but we live in a society and we have certain obligations otherwise it would all fall apart. I wonder whether the fairest thing would be to split any compensation between the injured party and the NHS so that some of the extra cost of treating the additional injuries was defrayed? I know such a scheme would be extremely difficult to administer fairly (there will be the odd freak accident where NOT wearing a seat belt / having an airbag / whatever, actually REDUCES the level of injury).


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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 09:26 
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In a crash featuring high speed neither seat belts nor air bags make a lot of difference.
In medium speeds they shift body damage to different modes.
In low speeds they are quite effective.
The number of accidents featuring people who wear belts with a peg on them ( to give more slack !) and then get, literally, thrown back by the airbag deployment to the detriment of their neck is rising....
Factually, the lowering death rate is mainly due to better, and faster, medical intervention.
In any accident featuring rapid deceleration the person within the vehicle is not going to walk-off into the sunset whistling a happy tune.....the seat belts keep the carcass restrained, but the internal organs become detached and damage is quite severe.
You should be aware of the case of facts being arranged to suit a pre-determined conclusion ?

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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 21:45 
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jomukuk wrote:
In a crash featuring high speed neither seat belts nor air bags make a lot of difference.
In medium speeds they shift body damage to different modes.
In low speeds they are quite effective.
The number of accidents featuring people who wear belts with a peg on them ( to give more slack !) and then get, literally, thrown back by the airbag deployment to the detriment of their neck is rising....
Factually, the lowering death rate is mainly due to better, and faster, medical intervention.
In any accident featuring rapid deceleration the person within the vehicle is not going to walk-off into the sunset whistling a happy tune.....the seat belts keep the carcass restrained, but the internal organs become detached and damage is quite severe.
You should be aware of the case of facts being arranged to suit a pre-determined conclusion ?


i'll assume for now you have sources for all those assertions ?


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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 22:42 
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I recall several years ago being a passenger in my friends car, He braked suddenly and we both felt fine.
A week later i became very ill at home, A doctor was called and he could see the pain i was in, An ambulance was called and i was taken to A&E.
I had terrible abdominal pain and then The doc asked me if i had been in any accidents lately.
At midnight that day i was taken into surgery, Yep i was in intensive care for 7 days, They did something called a laperotomy, Nice big cut right down to you know where, I had severed the mesenteric blood vessel and lost 2 litres of blood. I recall the surgeon telling me how lucky i was to survive.
The doc told me that the lap belt had severed the mesenteric vessel and i didnt even know till a week later.
So i would say yes seatbelts are not as safe as some may think.
A little info here,
http://www.springerlink.com/content/w234078g04444188/
Abstract Between 1981 and 1989, 541 children were admitted with abdominal injuries sustained as passengers in motor vehicle accidents. Twenty-nine of them had seat belt injuries of the abdomen. From 1981 to 1984, 1 child was admitted each year with such injuries and 21% of the abdominal injuries were due to seat belts. The number of cases had increased to 8 in 1989 and 78% of abdominal injuries were due to seat belts. These changes coincided with increased compliance with seat belt legislation in the State of Victoria. Restraint of children under 8 years of age in the front seat was legislated in 1976 and in the rear seat in 1981. In 1985, drivers were also held responsible for the restraint of children 8–17 years of age. Most of the children with seat belt injuries of the abdomen used lap belts or poorly fitting lap/sash belts. Twenty of the children had other non-abdominal injuries including 11 head, 7 thoracic, and 12 limb injuries. Eight children had spinal injuries including 7 Chance flexion-distraction fractures of the spine and 1 spinal cord injury without radiological abnormality. Chance fractures were only detected in one-half of the children on admission and in only 1 of the 9 children who had a laparotomy. Seventy-five per cent of children with spinal injuries had a laparotomy; 67% of those with abdominal injuries had spinal injuries, while only 7% of those not undergoing laparotomy had spinal injuries. These findings indicate that all children with seat belt injuries of the abdomen need careful clinical and radiographic assessment of the thoracolumbar spine. Prevention of seat belt injuries of the abdomen and spine requires legislation that ensures that all children use effective restraints that are appropriate for their age, size, and position within the vehicle.

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PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2009 23:50 
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nigel_bytes wrote:
Abstract Between 1981 and 1989, 541 children were admitted with abdominal injuries sustained as passengers in motor vehicle accidents. Twenty-nine of them had seat belt injuries of the abdomen. From 1981 to 1984, 1 child was admitted each year with such injuries and 21% of the abdominal injuries were due to seat belts. The number of cases had increased to 8 in 1989 and 78% of abdominal injuries were due to seat belts. These changes coincided with increased compliance with seat belt legislation in the State of Victoria. Restraint of children under 8 years of age in the front seat was legislated in 1976 and in the rear seat in 1981. In 1985, drivers were also held responsible for the restraint of children 8–17 years of age. Most of the children with seat belt injuries of the abdomen used lap belts or poorly fitting lap/sash belts. Twenty of the children had other non-abdominal injuries including 11 head, 7 thoracic, and 12 limb injuries. Eight children had spinal injuries including 7 Chance flexion-distraction fractures of the spine and 1 spinal cord injury without radiological abnormality. Chance fractures were only detected in one-half of the children on admission and in only 1 of the 9 children who had a laparotomy. Seventy-five per cent of children with spinal injuries had a laparotomy; 67% of those with abdominal injuries had spinal injuries, while only 7% of those not undergoing laparotomy had spinal injuries. These findings indicate that all children with seat belt injuries of the abdomen need careful clinical and radiographic assessment of the thoracolumbar spine. Prevention of seat belt injuries of the abdomen and spine requires legislation that ensures that all children use effective restraints that are appropriate for their age, size, and position within the vehicle.


How does it correlate with the overall injury rate though. If overall injury goes down 100 and seatbelt injury goes up 50 well then they are still successful. In a high speed collision your internal organs may become detached and cause serious problems with the belt on. Without the belt its going to hurt. Bit bolded is important. Seat belts are designed for full sized adults, not for kids. Improper belts can do serious harm to users so thats why booster seats are important.


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PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 07:05 
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Mind Driver wrote:
Seat belts are designed for full sized adults, not for kids. Improper belts can do serious harm to users so thats why booster seats are important.


Cars always seem to designed on the assumption that they are only ever going to be occupied by full sized adults. Which is strange considering that a substantial proportion of passengers are children or small adults

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