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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 14:13 
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Media : BBC Radio 2 Jeremy Vine Show with stand in Paddy O'Connell http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/

Topic : 80mph Motorway limit increase
Date : 30.9.11
Time : 13:00 onwards for about 30 minutes inc callers.
Other Guest : Liz Voysey (lost daughter 2004 in an incident after overtake with a lorry and another car hit her from behind).

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 17:01 
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Quote:
lost daughter 2004 in an incident after overtake with a lorry and another car hit her from behind).


So how did that happen? Did she pull out into the path off another car that she either, (a) did not see, on a relatively straight road (I'm assuming it was a motorway as this is the issue on the agenda) or (b) misjudged the speed of?

or were there other circumstances that put the blame on speed and not her driving?

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 17:04 
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"Hard cases make bad law."

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Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 23:32 
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graball wrote:
Quote:
lost daughter 2004 in an incident after overtake with a lorry and another car hit her from behind).


So how did that happen? Did she pull out into the path off another car that she either, (a) did not see, on a relatively straight road (I'm assuming it was a motorway as this is the issue on the agenda) or (b) misjudged the speed of?

or were there other circumstances that put the blame on speed and not her driving?

From what I can glean from various articles:

The daughter (Amy Voysey) was initially involved in a minor collision. She decided to wait in the car until she was recovered; the hazard indicators were on.
A lorry driver, at a reported speed of 80mph, collided with the stationary vehicle.
It is reported that the speed limit for that class vehicle (on the A47, at north Tuddenham) was 60mph.
For whatever reason, the lorry driver (Glenn Paraman) was given 7 points and £300 fine. The sentence was passed before the DBDD law.

The Sun wrote:
Liz said: “I was told that if he had been under the 70mph limit he would have seen her.

Either it happened on a blind bend, or someone is spouting misleading propaganda.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 00:31 
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Thanks for the info...

Liz implied today that Amy had had a collision with the lorry (she had carried out an overtake but it is totally unclear !), and that it was another driver who had then collided with her and his airbags saved him but her daughter died.
As Steve points out it was the A47 in Norfolk, a good quality A road but we'd have to check the local layout to be sure of vision ability details.

Liz wanted to comment as it seemed that she took great exception to Hammond's comment about "its impact on road safety would be 'marginal' ", here as she felt that this de-valued her daughter.
I am informed that there will be next to no discernible difference in the Stats ...papers to follow ...
He was simply referring to variants of incidents not referring to the incidents themselves, but I can understand why she took it like this.

If Brake want to defend this stance then why send out highly emotionally charged people, than try and defend this with facts and figures ? Might it be because they have none?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 01:12 
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SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
Liz wanted to comment as it seemed that she took great exception to Hammond's comment about "its impact on road safety would be 'marginal' ", here as she felt that this de-valued her daughter.

Stats and perspective don't matter to folks touched by such a tragedy. This is what makes the debate so dangerous.

It may seem unsympathetic to focus on overall trends instead of individual events, but it is the only way to ensure the subsequent conclusions are reasoned and balanced.

SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
If Brake want to defend this stance then why send out highly emotionally charged people, than try and defend this with facts and figures ? Might it be because they have none?

A very good point!
Also, it is rather more difficult to engage in a data driven logical debate with mothers who are shedding tears for 'their loss'.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 22:49 
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Steve wrote:
The Sun wrote:
Liz said: “I was told that if he had been under the 70mph limit he would have seen her.

Either it happened on a blind bend, or someone is spouting misleading propaganda.
This bothers me. There is the total assumption that there was nothing that her daughter could have done to help herself and that her life was going to rely on someone else.
If (is a big word) the chap driving the car/vehicle 'was doing 70mph she would have lived' is nonsense. If the chap had learned about skid control, or many other car skills she might have lived as he may have been able to avoidance brake away from her car. If her daughter had got out the car and got to a safe place she may have lived too ... perhaps had her daughter learned more about car control she may not have had the accident in the first place ... harsh words I know but someone surely has to say this as it is true. We (mostly) only have accidents by making mistakes, it is rare that we 'could do nothing'.
I am sorry for her loss it must be awful - to my mind made worse by her being so impelled to try and stop cars from in her mind 'speeding'. This was not necessarily the whole problem in her daughters incident as far as I can tell from the little facts that are about.

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