Safe Speed Forums

Hmmm, micra or corsa ripping past me at 90+ is beyond the basic limits of the vehicle & thereby the average driver. One wee pothole and it's all over. An 'executive' saloon eg. 7series, jag or nice merc at the same speed doesn't really worry me - car is designed for much higher speeds and in general the drivers are more than capable.
Ah, if only..... but in the real world a driver doing 55 on a B road - not a problem, I can just enjoy the scenery, and make a break for it on a long straight. But 45 on the same road - failing to let anyone past, THAT'S the ones we want to have their license revoked!!

I think we've got wires crossed Guron.

I don't have a problem with people driving slower. It is their right to drive slower than the speed limit as you say for a whole world of reasons.

It's my right however to want to go faster and drive at the limit. Whilst it's tough luck if I'm stuck behind someone slower, it's also reasonable for me to want to get past.

My point was against BW's apparent double standards. It's ok to go slow and hold people up. In his words - it's "Tough Shit" but the concept of overtaking and exercising my own rights to drive faster than the slow mover makes BW rile and call me irresponsible.

My message is that drive slower if you want, but expect to be overtaken.


Finally, I'm totally disinterested in being politically correct so on that basis, a slow moving vehicle that I cannot get past is an obstruction, whether they mean to be or not. I'm not branding slow movers as "idiots" at all. I am saying that I, and anyone else who wants to, have the right to overtake when safe to do so.

Like it or not, there are a hefty number of people who don't drive slow deliberately for technical reasons. Those who are incapable of driving at the limit shouldn't have a license IMHO. Driving at the limit when safe to do so IS a requirement of the test. There are also some people who seem to get a rise out of wasting other people's time. Those are the ones who fanny about at slow speeds, straddle the middle of the road and speed up as others attempt to overtake. This behaviour is apparently endorsed by BW et al, on the basis (this time) that anyone who wants/needs to overtake hasn't left enough time to allow for the willful wasting of their time by someone else. I don't see such an obstruction as being anything other than a rolling kidnap.

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Very well put, Jamie!





People may however have a reason to drive faster!

I think Jamie and I were both trying to say that we respect the right of some people to drive slower, but would expect them - in an ideal world - to respect our right to drive faster, and make at least reasonable allowances for us to do so. I know when I'm driving a loaded up van, I'm always looking out for ways to let people get safely past.

The trouble is that on a busy-ish single carriageway, it is the slowest few per cent of drivers that determine the speed of everyone else. If I was one of them, I'd be feeling guilty as hell.

The problem is though that these drivers are just too blinkered, nervous, ignorant or whatever to realise what they're doing. If ever you're heading a long queue of traffic with nothing in front of you then it's obvious that you're driving at an inappropriately low speed. Now any observant, competent and considerate driver who has chosen to drive at that speed, (and as already suggested there are many valid reasons why a driver may do this), will keep well to the left and make it as easy as possible for the queue of traffic to pass.
Unfortunately, many drivers are driving as described because they are oblivious to everything and only have a tunnel-vision of the road up to 10 metres in front of them.

I drive the A6068 in Lancs/West Yorkshire almost daily - a nice NSL SC with lots of turns and hills, but quite wide. Really fun to drive when you get an open road - one or two sections, even 80-90mph is safe. Invariably it seems though I get stuck behind some stereotypical 40/50mph everywhere driver. There are only a couple of safe spots to overtake and if you encounter an oncoming queue you've had it. However, a couple of weeks ago I was the beneficiary of some very courteous driving by an LGV at an overtaking spot. He was of course limited to 40mph, but as we hit a long straight where overtaking is possible, he signalled left, slowed a little and moved over and waved me past . Very very rare to see that these days but I was very pleasantly surprised - of course gave a thanking double-indicator flash as I pulled back in. Now if only a few more drivers showed similar courtesy it would make such roads so much nicer to drive.

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Why can't we just use Common Sense?

No-one (apart from you) is talking about "blasting people off the road".

Although you admit that pulling over would be more considerate you stilll say that "it's tough shit if you're the one behind". This does not make sense - unless of course you mean "it's tough shit if you're the one behind BW because I'm NOT going to pull over". Your next comment - "Other people may pull over" - adds some weight to my assumption.

Am I correct? I'd be interested to know.

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Save a cow - eat a vegetarian

This courtesy is fairly common in Scotland (rural), it's just the odd town/city drivers (no matter where from) that have never seen a B road that is about 6" wider than two cars that freak out - doing 35/45, braking at every oncoming vehicle & bend, looking just past their own bonnet & never, ever in the rear view. [following may be based on actual events ]....does the sight (oh, I forgot they don't look behind then) of a black montrosity behind indicating for an overtake not HINT that I want past? No! OK, will the repeated flash of headlights not persuade you? No! What about, the extended use of my horn, until you move your sorry ass over? Ah, your not a slow, deaf a$$hole, just a blind one.

Are you sure you can remember the original topic?

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I stole this .sig

If Yokel is stuck behind a slowpoke, he insists it ISN’T tough shit for him, but it is for everybody else, I expect. So have it your way, if it makes you happy, Yokel!

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I stole this .sig

Yeah, fair play, the noise of all the bits flying off your junk-pile would wake anybody up - even a janitor could afford a fast car, or whatever it is you got.

But look - blasting your way through just gives male motorists a bad name and increases the call for more curbs on speed - with boy-racers “unleashing full throttle” all the time, the anti-car brigade don't need to work very hard to get more cameras, humps and bollards in, do they? So let’s quit with the aggressive nonsense and drive patiently, or we’ll bring more restrictions down on ourselves, not less!

On the other hand, jamie_duff is realistic enough to figure out that it is tough shit for the one behind, as I was saying. My advice is to look out for yourselves, and don’t bother other drivers with any of this “unleashing” rubbish, or it’ll all end in tears.

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I stole this .sig

You presume too much.

Feminists are annoying enough. Condesending feminists just take the biscuit. Condesending feminists who start to get personal is going too far in my honest opinion...

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SOme of what BW writes is nonsense, but I think this is a valid point.

Well I could overtake at half throttle but it would mean a little longer on the wrong side of the road.

The quote above has been taken well out of context and well you know it.

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Thanks for your backhanded compliment, guron83! I have no problem with overtakers – I sometimes overtake tractors myself. But all right minded people would never advocate duffie’s mad idea of “unleashing full throttle” to frighten and intimidate slower road users, which works against everything we are trying to do at this website.

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I stole this .sig

Yet again, basingwerk, you've taken a very odd interpretation of someone's remark.

It could just be ignorance, but I'll do you the credit of assuming it's spite.

When you're occasionally overtaking tractors, do you use half throttle?

Is full throttle only for boy racers?

I have lots of experiences with the 45 everywhere brigade, mainly thanks to the fact that I have half an hour of single carriageway at the start of my morning commute every day. I've reached the following conclusions about these people.

1) A lot of people these days think that the speed limits are 70/60/50 for M-Way, DC and SC

2) The majority of them that are going slow without an obvious reason tend to be elderly men or middle aged women (though this could just be that there are more of such people on the road at the times of day I use it)

3) Most of them are perfectly capable of driving at and above the speed limit, but only choose to do so once they notice they are being overtaken. They will also tailgate anyone going slower than themselves.

4) 3) doesn't apply to vehicles that have a genuine reason for going slow, such as tractors, HGVs, bin wagons etc. These vehicles will generally be helpful when you want to get past, with the exception of horseboxes.

5) The best way of dealing with them is to hang back at a considerate distance, don't flash your lights, tailgate or do anything else agressive, If you sit back more than 3 car lengths (or 2 seconds whichever is greater) they will not notice you. When the overtaking opportunity finally arises, accelerate briskly, aim to have a 15mph speed differential before giving any obvious sign of overtaking such as crossing the white line (obviously, have room to get down to the correct speed again should you have to abort) they will still speed up and attempt to block your manouvre but it will be too late. Do however plan for the possibility of them managing to get so close to the car in front that you can't get in and will have to overtake that one too.

Basically, these people have decided on their own range of safe speeds (nothing wrong with that, apart from the 40 in villages thing) that they are comfortable at driving with. Anyone below this speed is going too slow and is an obstruction, anyone above this speed is a lunatic who is going to get everyone killed.

It's thanks to these people that I bought the Legacy. They can easially add an (unpaid) hour to my working day

Yeah, I’m paranoid like Jamie_duff and Lum - it's tough shit for tractors if I unleash full throttle in my Renault clio automatic and wake them up rudely as I pass them! Jeez, you guys are so tough!

BTW: have you figured out yet how driver id systems will become important over the next few years? Let me know if you need help figuring out the writing on the wall.

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I stole this .sig

That's about the same technique as I use under exactly the same circumstances - essentially giving the inconsiderate sods the least opportunity to do something selfish and stupid.

I don't know about you, but it surprises me how many of these "upright citizens" take it upon themselves to flash their headlights at you in order to impress upon you what a speed-crazed-fiend you are! Interestingly, if I'm in my soft-top with the roof down, this doesn't happen - probably because my mass of (very) grey hair is obvious... Perhaps they're embarrassed into "silence" by being overtaken by an OAP.

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"Politicians are the same the world over... We build bridges where there aren't any rivers." - Nikita Kruschev

Way to go - that way, being selfish and stupid is the reserve of the overtakers, not the poor, downtrodden overtaked!

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I stole this .sig

You wouldn't be suggesting that overtaking was per se selfish and stupid, would you?

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

What on earth are you on about?

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Save a cow - eat a vegetarian