Safe Speed Forums

Going back to GoodDriverSam's posts re single track rural roads .. I'm not convinced the place actually exits .. but anyway there is a point I'd like to make.

Could it be that some residents of such places sometimes actually cause the road to be more dangerous than neccessary through their own selfishness?

A case in point, I'm on a single track no through road with very limited passing places, on that road there is one corner that requires extreme caution. The reason for this required caution is that there is no visibility "through" the corner as the householder there has chosen to plant trees and bushes right on the edge of the road, obcsuring the view. Before the house was built, there was complete visibiltity though the corner as it was just a field.

One of the conditions of planning consent being granted for that house was that they were required to provide a passing place at the front of the property, and because of this they were also allowed to built the house much further back from the road than would normally be considered (this ruined their neighbour's privacy and view, but enhanced their own). The passing place was never provided, and they now have a nice large front garden, and are further away from the road than any other house around here, no doubt substatially increasing the value of the property.

There is virtually no visibility to the right from the end of their driveway as a result of their own tree planting, and it is not possible to see if anything is exiting the driveway on approach until right on top of it. If someone was to t-bone them while exiting their driveway whose fault would they consider that be? I obviously can't say for sure, but I'm fairly confident they'd blame the other party for "speeding", rather than take any responsibility themselves for restricting the view.

_________________
You only need two tools - WD40 and duct tape. If it doesn't move and it should, use WD40. If it moves and it shouldn't, use duct tape. :0)

Zippo. I think you make a valid point.

With regard to the planning .. it they did not keep to the plans as passed - you can notify the planning department who could insist they comply with the plan... especially if you can prove they have created a hazard here.

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

A loud toot on the horn as you approach the corner would seem to be in order, Zippo!



There's a house on my way home that had a kind of unused gate entrance, which got used as a passing place on a very narrow stretch. Then it changed hands, and the new owners filled in the passing place with fence posts. So I give a loud toot on the horn as I pass by, due to the heightened difficulty caused by this act.

Which is, of course a violation of HC112 and possibly an offence under CUR99

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Where?

I'd be using horn to warn other road users of my presence then...

And use the route more often

There are places you shouldn't park which are dangerous or illegal. From memory, brow of a hill, within 15 yards of a junction, on a bend etc. So if I make modifications or extensions to my garden shouldn't that be a violation in the same way as being dangerously parked?

_________________
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

Quite agree. Modifications nand extensions which encroach onto the carriageway should be prohibited.

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Yes, or at the very least properly assessed beforehand. Thinking of Zippo's case, those trees or bushes are worse IMO since they are permenantly 'parked' dangerously. I'm sure if I planted my car at the side of the road where there are central double white lines I wouldn't find it there the next day - and quite rightly so.

Oh and Zippo.

_________________
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I was under the impression that these trees were "parked" in a garden not on the road. Do you also object to cars being parked in a garden.

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

I would if it were obscuring the view of the road ahead in a dangerous manner. To my mind it isn't about whether it's in the garden or not but whether it is a safe thing to do.

If I may give a true for instance... I once saw a huge St Georges flag in a garden which when the wind changed blew partially towards, and into, the road. Now maybe the owner didn't know this when he planted it and maybe he also has a right to do it, but if it were me I would have considered my actions first and, whether illegal or not, I would not put others in harm’s way for my inconsideration or stupidity.

I've often argued here that illegal isn't necessarily always wrong just as legal isn't necessarily always right.

_________________
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I think as light tooty toot toot would work . but that ist just me.


Now Mac Doc arrive. i Must PERFORM my "wifelies" to him .. I spend longest time reading all threads here.

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

I am grateful for the feedback regarding the successful solutions we have put in place to prevent the dangerous practice of speeding in our village.

There seems to be some concern that our actions may be breaking the law. Yet there appears to be no concern that driving above the posted speed limit is breaking the law. In fact the view frequently expressed on this site is that motorists should decide what they consider to be a safe speed and drive accordingly. As for the SS post banging on about “criminal charges”... pots, kettles and black come to mind here!

It is clear that many of those who have responded to this thread feel that speed limits do not matter, are set wrong and should be treated with contempt, or at least treated only as a rough guide. In direct contradiction to this is the suggestion that we (our village) should go through the “proper channels” by consulting the local authority and/or police regarding our problems. These suggestions are from the same posters who heap scorn on the police for enforcing limits they don’t agree with and accuse the authorities of being incompetent in the way they set speed limits! It is our view that LA’s are incompetent at dealing with problems such as ours and are soft on motorists giving them an easy time and letting them get away with dangerous and unpleasant behaviour. That is why we, just like those who decide to drive at what speed they like, have taken it upon ourselves to deal with things.

I can assure Zippo that the scenario in the village I describe does exist. The postings from johnnytheboy regarding use of the horn and Big Tone’s suggestion of using the route more often illustrate perfectly why I will not reveal its location! I wonder what johnnytheboy would do if he used his horn and around that blind bend were horse riders and his behaviour resulted in a horse throwing a rider? The procedure at blind bends is to slow down in anticipation of the unknown. The solution is not to cut back shrubbery so drivers can increase their speed. Any decent driver will slow down and proceed with caution at a bend – that is what markings on the road that read “SLOW” means.

And to Mole - the Dept. of Transport define speeding as two types of behaviour - that within the limit that is inappropriate and that over the limit. We are concerned about both types. Of course cameras only get those over the limit, I don't dispute that. But we would all the same welcome a camera - they work, VAS do not (we already have two and drivers ignore them - useless things they are).

We are not doing anything that is illegal – but make no mistake everything we do is designed to make life difficult and inconvenient for passing motorists who wish to break the law. You could say that everyone is suffering because of those who speed.

There are no parking restrictions on the lanes – we park our cars there even if we have off road parking. We do NOT park near blind bends or on the brow of hills.

We ensure we salt the roads during winter when there is frost, ice or snow. This is not illegal. The effect of the salt in breaking up the roads is a result of a perfectly legal practice.

We have a pool of drivers who drive within 30mph at all times and slow down to 20mph at bends and other hazards and where “SLOW” is indicated on the highway. This is called driving at an appropriate speed. Yes, that is an appropriate speed according to the driver in question – just like your appropriate speed over the limit is safe in your opinion.

There is no law that dictates what time horse riders can go out.

Yes, we do deliberately plant trees/shrubs to obscure views and slow drivers down. If they refuse to do so, they are clearly stupid and should not be on the road. And there is nothing illegal about planting on private property.

To concerned parent – as I advised before, you need to force these selfish drivers to slow down. There is no other way. Good luck.

Not so. We have indeed addressed CP's issue of exceeding the limit.

You won't just be breaking the law, you'll be extremely anti-social - you openly admit it.


Absolute rot. This is an illusion you have created on your own prejudiced mind. No-one has said this. also, this is mentioned on various campaign pages.
I say again - again: This campaign isn’t against speed enforcement; it is against the way it is done.


I'm guessing you don't know the difference between 'decisions from authorities' and 'policing via trafpol'?


That sounds like you haven't even tried.


Interesting use of language!


The same horse riders you encouraged to go out and deliberately hold up 'maniac' traffic on 'blind bends'? Yeah, right!


Forcing a slow down where inappropriate speed is used is understandable; forcing total frustration onto all traffic, when better solutions are available, is not.

Had you given the location of your village, some might be tempted to contact your local trafpol such that can act against the obviously bloody-mindedness of those who deliberately cause "15-20 minute hold ups"!

_________________
Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

STEVE writes: "Had you given the location of your village, some might be tempted to contact your local trafpol such that can act against the obviously bloody-mindedness of those who deliberately cause "15-20 minute hold ups"!"

And you wonder why I will not reveal the location!!!

Speeding is #1 in the British Crime Surveys list of anti-social behaviour.

If you do not agree that speeding is wrong, why are you bothered about the method by which speeders are caught? The truth is, that if every camera was replaced by police you would still be moaning if those police enforced speed limits in the way that they are duty bound to do.

Re: your "absolute rot" charge. Surely this site at the very least encourages contempt for speed limits and therefore the law, it encourgages drivers to choose their own "safe" speed.

We have contacted the LA's - they gave us two VAS signs. They worked for about a week, then they were lit up by 90% of drivers who still exceeded the limit at the dangerous locations they were placed. C'mon, tell the truth, the only reason drivers like them is because they can ignore them. They cannot ignore cameras.

If we are frustrating drivers - then our action is working. It appears we are frustrating them so much they now take the main routes that were built for them... and good riddance to them too.

Anyway, I did not come on here to argue. I came on here to offer Concerned Parent some sound advice. Meanwhile, our action will continue and escalate if need be. Our mission is to make our village the most miserable place to take a short cut - I think we're well on the way. Thanks everyone who made comments especially garball for his salt / rain tip!

And now your colours have been nailed to the mast! You are indeed afraid of trafpol busting your anti-social activities.


I don't dispute that, but people have a habit of conveniently convoluting idiotic, highly dangerous, highly noticeable, and waaaaay too fast joyriders and boy racers, with safe, considerate and relatively inconspicuous commuters, as well as overestimating travelling speeds of others (especially those who don't drive regularly).


No one has said that!


Because we want the fairest method, the most effective against dangerous or anti-social behaviour, with the fairest threshold for action, with the fairest penalty.


Real police usually apply discretion, which is welcome where limits aren't set appropriately. They usually act upon the risk/danger caused, not a proxy based on an infringement.

They also do a whole heap of other services, including any form of anti-social behaviour (not limited to driving offences), and aren't limited to watching out for one technical infringement.


It also encourages limits to be set appropriately, as well as enforced fairly. It does not encourage anyone to act illegally.


Yet:


Then what did you do when you weren't satisfied with the VAS? Nothing?


They can ignore cameras, especially those who decide to circumvent the law in other manners (you know, those most dangerous, anti-social and most likely to be noticed). Trafpol is altogether different; they can stop even those who would try to circumvented the law.


Hopefully someone will call the police to act against the deliberate and gross obstruction.

What do your horse riders think of you sending them out amongst greatly frustrated "manics" on "blind bends"?

_________________
Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

GDS/Greenshed/chunky, salt doesn't break up the roads, ice does....ha ha ha ha...... salt only attacks concrete....ha ha ha ha......your knowledge is SADLY lacking...ha ha ha (just like your road safety knowledge)...it's a shame that you don't have a few more children in your "village", they might be able to teach you lot a few things...ha ha ha...you people really do need to get some real life experiences....ha ha ha

_________________
My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Has someone hacked your account, because I would suggest you can't believe both these statements at once.

I'm sure this has been covered before, but in your scenario why is the village a rat-run?

Are you devoting a fraction of the (unbelievably) huge logistical effort to slow down "speeding" drivers you have described to campaign for whatever's causing the "ratrunning" to be remedied?

Presumably they are using your village to avoid something, what is it? Could it be corrected in some way? Or do you just not care about anything but "your" village?

Between you and me, I think the person is dillusional, believing that they live in this "made up" "village" where everyone has a screw loose and goes around driving tractors up and down the road to "scare off" the "outsiders", they use unattainable amounts of road salt which the council probably delivers weekly to keep them satisfied....no doubt little green men visit on a full moon to help with their "festivities" of bear baiting, virgin sacrifice and unicorn racing, followed by a dodo roast.

_________________
My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.