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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 01:45 
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That is what driving really is ... the elusive end of the rainbow...


Take a normal drive home - 20 miles or so... Personal elements get in the way - the disagreement you had with a work colleague, the cold weather outside, the dark evening.

You master these and concentrate on the drive ... hopefully.

But let us just think - what should we do as routine on every drive.

Again - I am just going to ask a few basic questions - really basic stuff to all regulars here - but which I would like all our main contributors to comment on - on basis that our numpty lurking brigade may actually think about their driving by our collective know-how. :wink: Feel free to pick and choose - and confess - am most interested in "closet speeder's" answers here :wink:



1. What do you do before ] you set off?

2. You join any new road - what is your first routine gesture?

3. You intend to turn left at the first lights. Talk me through your approach as they are changing to red....

4. The speed limit increased to 40 mph - but you know there is a cross road and a further education college ahead and a bus stop. What should be your safest speed at this point?

5. The 40 mph limit ends and you are in the NSL stretch. You see a triangle warning you of a series of S bends - left and then a tight right. Talk me though your approach. Do you evaluate your performance?

6. On the straight - you see "slow moving" vehicle ahead - and you also know that this in old IG's fave hunting ground :lol: what would you consider as main safety prerequisites for your overtake ? :lol:

7. Just as you got all prepared and positioned for the overtake - you notice why old IG is larking around there... the advance notice of the "Give Way" and the crossroads... (which you of course notice by taking a crafty look up the truck's left side flank...) :wink: Describe your driving plan - as the artic truck signals a right hand turn and you also intend to turn right. You also note the car behind you and his position indicating a left..

8. The junction is a blind one... what is your driving plan here?

9. You catch up to the articulated again - and this time you are determined to overtake...you are going to need maximum acceleration to complete this ..... again what isyour driving plan? Do you hold back for good view? Weaver for a good look?


9 b) How do you evaluate the preconditions ? How did your action affect the truck driver? Was he as aware of you as he should have been? How could you have made him more aware of your presence?

10. Just after this you see lollipop showing 30 mph lollipop. You are in over the border where that thoroughly nice cuddly IG is not larking around.... what is your first thought?

10b) After you have decided that no pink flashy things are around :wink: (I have read that site :lol: ) - what is your peripheral vision on the alert for?

Do you think how your driving may have affect that horse rider? And the cyclist back there?

11. Through the village and on nice NSL road - just right for that fixed input steer and pushing the envelope a bit .... How do you tackle the gentle bend? Was the fixed input the correct steer to use here?

12. Journey's end... you see the parking spot.... what routine things are you doing?


13. What do you do with your valuables - and your origin b2 as you prepare to leave your car?

14. Do you reflect on the journey and think about what or who annoyed yu during the journey?


Or how you could improve your technique? :wink:

Just a few things to just think about on every drive - whatever the experience level....


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 15:20 
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That's a very interesting collection of questions, but I fear that the presentation of 14 questions in one post is really too much for most folk to try and deal with. As a rule of thumb, I try to keep posts to one or two key ideas or questions. That makes it far easier for people to think about the issues and respond.

I thought about splitting it into 14 posts for you, but even that might be "overload".

In general, I think we'll advance the debate further by examining issues one at a time and in detail.

But don't let me stop anyone making complex multi-question posts if that what you want to do.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 15:45 
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Hmmmm! Rather too much there but also lacking detail. Dry, wet, cold, windy? There are so many small factors that have a large effect on the way I might drive it's not really possible to answer. I only realised today that I make quite a comprehensive check before I do anthing planned. My wife asked me to pass her some gum from the drivers side dash cubby hole. She then had a go at me for ignoring her! I wasn't, it's just that I hadn't planned to do this and I was assessing the road before looking down for what she wanted. It took a couple of seconds and I didn't even realise I did it.

So to answer Q14 Yes :)


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 16:51 
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I did think of splitting it up ... guess had too much mulled wine last night ....

Not intended to ask anyone to answer all 14 musings from one run of mill journey (Perhaps it show how complex driving can be and how much we have to take in - on even a routine drive?)

Feel free to explore any one chunk ...however you wish...with whatever conditions you wish or have anecdotes of.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 17:15 
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In Gear wrote:
1. What do you do before you set off?


I imagine the grim reaper waiting around every bend.

In Gear wrote:
14. Do you reflect on the journey and think about what or who annoyed yu during the journey?


I thank God I managed to make it after dealing with bone heads for 15 miles, then I damn them all to hell fire for eternity and curse myself for having to share the road space with such beings. It's been this way since my crash back in February!

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 18:26 
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In Gear wrote:
Just a few things to just think about on every drive -


You have got to be kidding.... :lol:

I do about 1000+ mile per week.

I park, I throw the keys on the table and I get on with my life.

If someone is being an asshole I keep out of there way. I never cause someone to brake, swerve or have to take avoiding action. I never rely on anyone to give me room.

I have developed a 6th sence for speed cameras though. And I now pick up speed camera boxes in my peripheral vision just like I do traffic lights.

1 million safe miles so far......can't be doing that much wrong... :wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 19:34 
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In Gear wrote:
{snip}
1. What do you do before ] you set off?

Do a few slow breath exercises to ensure stress levels are as low as reasonably practicable. If it is the morning run to work instead of the evening run from work, I check that my razor is in the car and tie around my neck for the first two trafic jams.
In Gear wrote:
2. You join any new road - what is your first routine gesture?

Mirror - to see if, despite having observed before going out, that a fastard isn't approaching, so I can either accelerate quickly or breathe in, whichever is appropriate.
In Gear wrote:
3. You intend to turn left at the first lights. Talk me through your approach as they are changing to red....

Lift off and, depending on the speed of their cycle, brake, such that I arrive at the lights when they are changing back to green. If I'm too close for that, brake, checking mirror, ensuring that I'm well to the left. Indicator use will depend on all sorts of things.
In Gear wrote:
4. The speed limit increased to 40 mph - but you know there is a cross road and a further education college ahead and a bus stop. What should be your safest speed at this point?

Too little information - and no matter how much you'd written I still would not be able to answer it. However, the chances are if there are more hazards ahead than where I've just been I'll be covering the brake rather than the throttle.
In Gear wrote:
5. The 40 mph limit ends and you are in the NSL stretch. You see a triangle warning you of a series of S bends - left and then a tight right. Talk me though your approach. Do you evaluate your performance?

Mirror. If there is nobody in striking distance behind or in front and it is such a series of bends one can see right through, paying deference to any solid white line my side of centre, I'd take the racing line at, say, .3g speed (ish, less if wet). Any of these false and speed would be regulated to maintain the car my side of the road.
In Gear wrote:
6. On the straight - you see "slow moving" vehicle ahead - and you also know that this in old IG's fave hunting ground :lol: what would you consider as main safety prerequisites for your overtake ? :lol:

Two or four-legged animals potentially out of control, any junctions or hahas (invisible dips) and any semblence of inattention/lackadaisical driving in the slow-moving vehicle(s).
In Gear wrote:
7. Just as you got all prepared and positioned for the overtake - you notice why old IG is larking around there... the advance notice of the "Give Way" and the crossroads... (which you of course notice by taking a crafty look up the truck's left side flank...) :wink: Describe your driving plan - as the artic truck signals a right hand turn and you also intend to turn right. You also note the car behind you and his position indicating a left..

Mirror, brake - exaggerated a little - to let the arctic know I've aborted the overtake. Leave right indicator on, staying toward the crown of the road but with wheels parallel - and if necessary overlapping the arctic slightly so he is certain I'm not alongside him. Checking mirror to ensure the left turner is not about to make a thre-way pileup.
In Gear wrote:
8. The junction is a blind one... what is your driving plan here?

hang back until the arctic has completed his manouevre. Road positioning will be adjusted slightly to see/be seen by as many as poss as soon as poss after arctic has gone.
In Gear wrote:
9. You catch up to the articulated again - and this time you are determined to overtake...you are going to need maximum acceleration to complete this ..... again what isyour driving plan? Do you hold back for good view? Weaver for a good look?

This is why I drive a 2.4 auto :wink: . I hold well back for maximum visibility and to also, if necessary, hold back any tailgaters so I can accelerate hard without pulling out for a short way to be able to check nothing is coming from behind. Indicator then if nothing coming either way, go for it - foot to the boards and headlights flashed once for a second or so on full beam.
In Gear wrote:
9 b) How do you evaluate the preconditions ? How did your action affect the truck driver? Was he as aware of you as he should have been? How could you have made him more aware of your presence?

That's what the headlight flash was for - and why I was holding back.
In Gear wrote:
10. Just after this you see lollipop showing 30 mph lollipop. You are in over the border where that thoroughly nice cuddly IG is not larking around.... what is your first thought?

"I wonder why that was there - what am I expecting in about 300 yards time?"
In Gear wrote:
10b) After you have decided that no pink flashy things are around :wink: (I have read that site :lol: ) - what is your peripheral vision on the alert for?

Anything and everything. The "busier" the terrain, the slower the speed.
In Gear wrote:
Do you think how your driving may have affect that horse rider? And the cyclist back there?

Definitely. I live in a village of equestrians and am always ready to keep differential speed right down and make use of the SSS in the Accord to keep in the highest possible gear so as not to be noisy.
In Gear wrote:
11. Through the village and on nice NSL road - just right for that fixed input steer and pushing the envelope a bit .... How do you tackle the gentle bend? Was the fixed input the correct steer to use here?

I don't know what a "fixed input steer" is, sorry.
In Gear wrote:
12. Journey's end... you see the parking spot.... what routine things are you doing?

Assuming the bay is one tight enough to require an up and back... Mirror. Get distance behind, either by a short burst if practicable or by pulling over early if necessary. when clear both ways - and checking for pedestrians, animals etc, fairly nifty parking.
In Gear wrote:
13. What do you do with your valuables - and your origin b2 as you prepare to leave your car?

Take valuables with me (or if too big, in the locked boot). I do not know what an origin b2 is. Is it a jammer/detector? I hate those - they slow me down. Too many falsies. Tried one ten yerars ago and gave it back.
In Gear wrote:
14. Do you reflect on the journey and think about what or who annoyed yu during the journey?

Often - if there was an event that was out of the ordinary. I have dfone that several times - even in print on here (or was it in uktraffic yahell group?) Always grateful for a review.

Did I pass muster, sir?


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 19:53 
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I think you may be setting a PhD exam for GCSE candidates :P

As Paul said, all the questions are valid, but one bite at a time is easier to digest.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 21:16 
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I really did take it one bite at a time..... :P


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2004 23:28 
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basingwerk wrote:
In Gear wrote:
1. What do you do before you set off?

I imagine the grim reaper waiting around every bend.


Attack life...it's going to kill you anyway.. :wink:

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 00:56 
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basingwerk wrote:
In Gear wrote:
1. What do you do before you set off?


I imagine the grim reaper waiting around every bend.


Wrong answer. In your case - you should be worrying about meeting me around every bend as you drive far too slowly .... :lol:

basingwerk wrote:
In Gear wrote:
14. Do you reflect on the journey and think about what or who annoyed yu during the journey?


I thank God I managed to make it after dealing with bone heads for 15 miles, then I damn them all to hell fire for eternity and curse myself for having to share the road space with such beings. It's been this way since my crash back in February!


You should be asking yourself if they were the bonehead or if you did something to make them appear like boneheads to you. I suspect the latter :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:

You need to be more tolerant! :roll: :wink:


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 01:08 
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In Gear wrote:
basingwerk wrote:

I thank God I managed to make it after dealing with bone heads for 15 miles, then I damn them all to hell fire for eternity and curse myself for having to share the road space with such beings. It's been this way since my crash back in February!


You should be asking yourself if they were the bonehead or if you did something to make them appear like boneheads to you. I suspect the latter :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:

You need to be more tolerant! :roll: :wink:


Tolerant is good, but if we could make it pro-active and defensive I think we'd do better still.

How about it Basingmate? Fancy joining the IAM (or alternatives)? You'd never regret it. It puts you in control.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 01:14 
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Roger wrote:
I really did take it one bite at a time..... :P


Was the worse for wear from red wine when I posted the original :roll:

But Roger ....

A fine effort!!!

Fixed input steer .... nice relaxed grip/relaxed shoulders - quarter-to three . Relaxed mode means you feel an enhanced feedback from the road .. and react more quickly to control a skid etc. Keeps your brain in touch with how much steering lock you have applied during faster cornering in open to view conditions.

You steer by turning your wheel with your hands in unison but without shifting the wheel hold position. You can also hook your thumb and forefinger around the cross spoke - but don't do this on rough surfaces as kick back from a rough surface could break your thumbs....


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 01:38 
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In Gear wrote:
Roger wrote:
I really did take it one bite at a time..... :P


Was the worse for wear from red wine when I posted the original :roll:

But Roger ....

A fine effort!!!

Fixed input steer .... nice relaxed grip/relaxed shoulders - quarter-to three . Relaxed mode means you feel an enhanced feedback from the road .. and react more quickly to control a skid etc. Keeps your brain in touch with how much steering lock you have applied during faster cornering in open to view conditions.

You steer by turning your wheel with your hands in unison but without shifting the wheel hold position. You can also hook your thumb and forefinger around the cross spoke - but don't do this on rough surfaces as kick back from a rough surface could break your thumbs....

All you ever need to know about steering techniques (and lost more that you don't need to know I suspect...)...

http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=75

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 02:20 
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JT wrote:
All you ever need to know about steering techniques (and lost more that you don't need to know I suspect...)...

http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=75



Hey JT - after 20 odd years and training at Hendon, numerous refresher courses and teaching young bloods how to drive a cop car ....

........

I am still learning how to drive a car :wink: :wink:

You never really stop learning - always a new idiot every day... you would not credit what I have seen over the years.......and still see ... :roll:

Shhh! Don't tell willcove ... he is convinced I cannot drive - you know ! :wink:


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 03:48 
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Quote:
Fixed input steer .... nice relaxed grip/relaxed shoulders - quarter-to three . Relaxed mode means you feel an enhanced feedback from the road .. and react more quickly to control a skid etc. Keeps your brain in touch with how much steering lock you have applied during faster cornering in open to view conditions.


Ah.

I do this a LOT - but I pre-empt if that makes sense - I get a relaxed grip on the wheel before the bend, such that my hands are at quarter-to-three at the apex, the idea being that I am in best position to take corrective action if required at the most likely time I am to need it.

Off to read Paul's page that JT linked to....


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2004 05:19 
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In Gear wrote:
Hey JT - after 20 odd years and training at Hendon, numerous refresher courses and teaching young bloods how to drive a cop car ....

I am still learning how to drive a car


Oh yes... I hope and pray I never stop learning.

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