Safe Speed Forums

Like so many others I must admit that I whole-heartedly supported the use of speed cameras. Anything that was effective in reducing the amount of accidents caused by motorists could only be a good thing.

I have a clean license, I may on occasions inadvertently go over the speed limit, I haven’t had an accident for over 25 years and am far removed from the teenage boy racer, I am what you might say a normal driver.

Motorists in the UK are now so programmed and desensitised to an array of signs with laws changing on a weekly basis that whenever they see a “safety” camera in an unfamiliar area I suggest most people momentarily pause to establish whether its a 30, 40 or 50mph speed limit and have witnessed motorists effectively performing an emergency stop to the lowest possible limit.

I haven’t felt strongly enough to voice my opinion on the matter until last weekend. Whilst travelling on the A5, I braked suddenly in front of a speed camera on the brow of a hill. A motorcyclist was tucked in behind my offside rear and nearly crashed head on into a central refuge to avoid a collision. Irrespective of any fault of travelling too close one has to step back and say would this of happened if the camera wasn’t there. The motorcyclist was probably familiar with the route and speed limit like most of the other drivers as it was commuter time, hence my sudden braking could have been seen as “out-of-the-ordinary” by other regular motorists’ not mere visitors.

With hindsight it made me reflect on the amount of attention I give to looking out for safety cameras at the expense of looking out for pedestrians, cars, and bikes in unfamiliar territory, it is indeed quite shuddering.

I believe that policies are becoming disjointed, evidence to make all fixed speed cameras bright yellow was seen as a victory for those in the “raising” revenue camp, but after reading the article http://gadgets.liveflash.co.uk/sat-nav/2008/11/speed-trap-vans-should-be-bright-yellow/ suggesting mobile “safety camera vans” can be whatever colour they want really does suggest that research can be tailored to support either sides argument. Does new strategic thinking by social philosophers rather than “weekend safety course” politicians need to bring about change?

Yep that's ALL it takes - THREE points and a £60 fine for you.


Wont matter, you WILL be fined anyway. Speed cameras are dumb unstinting unswerving unemotional machines. YOU HAVE TRANSGRESSED THE LAW.

I wasn't even speeding when
i got flashed, so I went to court, where the magistrates admitted the pictures did not show me speeding, but the camera technician told them that the picture on his computer back at the office was clearer, so they found me guilty.
If I had had a lawyer, apparently he would have insisted the evidence had to be seen in court!

Good luck - it's only a matter of time before you have one of your lapses in front of a camera and... BLAT!

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

I think I know the bit you're talking about. Is it the stretch of the A5 between Hinckley and Atherstone?

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David

I'm ok with local camera spots, in fact routinely use residential streets to avoid them. But in unfamiliar teritory, yes I have a panic attack and brake to 25mph just in case.
But I am worse as a passenger and shout at my Dad when ever I see a camera.
Of course its my problem but aren't speed cameras a cause of distraction?

To take the role of devils advocate....
I never brake when I approach speed cameras.....mainly because I'm usually at the limit anyway....or below...
If councils want to set limits at 20mph, that's ok by me....I do not AGREE with deliberately low limits....I just cannot drive at them...as said before....in a 20 limit I drive at 15-
And in a 30 limit it usually works out at 25....
I will be the van driver doing 50 on a s/c road, and 60 on a d/c road.....loads do not....(don't do over your vehicles limit in northants.....they DO check commercial vehicle speeds)
I don't make the problems, but I also do not intend to make problems for myself by exceeding set limits....
Life's a bitch.
As far as I can see, most trucks are candidates for disqual....I have yet to notice many driving at 40- on a s/c road....likewise most van drivers.
Please do not forget, this gov has signed-up to the eu discord to reduce traffic by 25% by 2015.....

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

I missed this gem.

You should stop giving attention to speed camera observation and concentrate on knowing what speed you are allowed to drive at at alll times. Then you can do the same as all of those well educated drivers do and sail on through the speed camera without even bothering to acknowledge its existance. Then your ignorance will not present a risk to other drivers as you have described it did on this occasion. Cameras don't kill, ignorant drivers do.

The camera policy does kill because it has displaced what should have been a far better road safety policy ("fatality gap").

It's not like I haven't said this before, and to directly to yourself! (oddly enough, both remain unacknowledged)

Then there are the other side effects....

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

Yes, it's just SO easy to know what speed you're supposed to be driving at! I mean, if you're a car driver, it's 30 in a built up area, 60 on NSL SC, 70 on motorways and dual carriageways!
(Well, at least it USED to be simple)! Now, of course, in their quest for greater safety, the "experts" have speed limits all over the shop - several in the space of a few miles if you're unlucky!

As long as you can read numbers in even sets of 10's in red circles you would be doing fine. The key is to "want" to do it in the first place.

A key is setting the limit in a needless manner, resulting with inevitable accidental creep; clearly not a case of 'want' (not borne out of desire).

How many drivers (other than joyriders and racers) set out specifically to exceed the speed limit? Do people really 'want' to exceed a limit, or is it more a case of then wanting to make safe progress without being needlessly restricted by limits that encourage disrespect (especially on motorways).

My mum was recently done for 36 in a 30 (non-residential). Why? It was reduced from 40 and the 40 signs were simply taken away (no 30 signs at all).

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

That is the problem with 30 limits. They not only do not need repeater signs but the use of same would render the 30 limit against regulations (unless there are no lamposts (spaced a few hundred metres apart))
The road DID have lamposts didn't it ?

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Yes the road does have lamps posts (at least on one side of the road, not so sure about the other), just as it did when the limit was 40.

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

Then as long as it was correctly posted (lollies each side of the road at the change of limit) the lamposts and no other signed limit means that the maximum speed was the default limit: 30mph.
It is really amazing how many people do not know that (I'm not suggesting your wife didn't)

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

...but it is not quite that simple is it? - you need to know how far apart the lamp-posts are (assuming that they are lamp-posts and not footway lights or some other construction) and factor in the accepted error of a certain number in a given set being further apart than the specific legal measurement. All whilst trying to avoid any real hazards

Putting up 30mph repeaters would end all of this ambiguity, but unfortunately the phrase "if it saves just one life" doesn't apply when the authorities have to put their hand in their own pocket

mb

I don't disagree that the road is a 30 limit.
The point is that the 40 roundels had disappeared but no 30s were put in place to warn of this and it caught well-meaning people out. Those 40 signs were the only roundels showing any speed on my mum's route to the road where she was caught.

She knows what the default speed is, she just didn't know that it had been applied to that road.

My brother also hadn't noticed that limit was dropped. I pointed this out to him when I realised [me as passenger] he was abiding by the previous limit, he genuinely didn't know.

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

Ignoring the fact that the national speed limits (think lorries, towing, etc.) don't have any such signs.

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Andrew.

Just now got off the phone with me mam. She said she has been told that 'where there are no signs and the lights are very tall the limit is 40'
Needless to say, I have corrected that error

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

How very predictable

So, let's assume, for the purposes of the argument, that we DO all "want" to. The question that needs to be asked, however, is whether it actually improves the lot of the vulnerable road user (pedestrian, cyclist etc) by having so many and frequently changing limits? OF COURSE, it's easy to "read numbers in even sets of 10's in red circles" - just like it's "easy" to change a CD whilst driving, look at one's speedo, look in one's mirror, eat sweets...

MOST people get away with doing any of the above, MOST of the time without hitting any pedestrians. Whether or not they SHOULD, is a completely different matter! So, I ask you, just for the record:

Do you believe that changing speed limits more frequently allows the driver more or less time to look for other Hazards?

Hi, i want people to be safe on the roads and people walking/cycling to be safe too. But speed cameras on motorways and duel carriage ways are a bunch of money scamming s**t c*nts.

Everyone goes over the limit now and then, its going to happen, it has happened and will always happen. I hate the speed cameras on motorways i hate the government for being retarded a$$ wipes and the fact they are trying to get 15% of all vechiles off the road by 2015 or w.e is just adding to the problem. This is a spoof speech between government road officials:

man1: we need to get millions of cars off the road by 2015, the PM told me
man2: Ok MORE speed cameras, Less pothole fixing and up the fine and make the test harder
man1: *rubs hands together* were gonna get a massive bonus for this, you genius!!!

REMIND ME AGAIN WHY THE F*CK DO I PAY ROAD TAX?

I reguarly drive from london to north wales (300miles approx) and i see no less than 100 speed cameras on route. Granted alot of these are the ridiculous average speed cams which are so easily dodged by a simple lane change but still it is my human right to be able to travel as fast as i want when it is safe to do so. If it wasnt your right to do so then all cars would be limited to 70mph as this is (apart from germany) the highest speed limit in europe.

You all talk about safety well now its time to get off your high horse as looking at your speedo once every 3 seconds for around 0.75 secs just to check your speed is dangerous. You are looking at your spedometer for 1/3 of your time spent driving because of speed cameras, so for a 3 hour drive you are staring at your speedo for a hour of that. Hmmm sounds dangerous now doesnt it. Looking at a txt takes 3 seconds and you would have to recieve 1200 txts in a 3 hour journey to be staring at your phone for that amount of time on route to your destination.

I fully understand cameras on 30mph accident blackspots, outside schools and in rural villages, but a F*cking speed hump every 20yds would eliminate the need for that too.

Any way you look at it the government are doing it for money there is no other agenda involved. And anyone who wants to destroy all speed cameras is welcome to in my opinion.

PS: ive never been caught speeding and i dont condone dangerous driving, drink driving, drug driving or excessive speed in built up areas but i do believe on a 3 lane motorway let us open her up and drive like god intended!!!

I dont mean to offend any jobsworths out there, youre fine to do your stupid 50mph on the inside lane of the motorway, just dont expect me to let you out to overtake

and omg does anyone read the highway code?

In the UK Highway Code, a built-up area is a settled area in which the speed limit of a road is automatically 30 mph (48 km/h). These roads are known as 'restricted roads' and are identified by the presence of street lights.

In August 2006, the Department for Transport issued new guidance relating to speed limits. It states that:[1]

Section 82(1)(a) (of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (RTRA 1984)) defines a restricted road in England and Wales as a road which is provided with “a system of street lighting furnished by means of lamps placed not more than 200 yards apart”. Section 81 specifically makes it an offence for a person to drive a motor vehicle at a speed of more than 30 mph on a restricted road.

"Street lighting" is further defined as follows:

As set out in paragraph 45, it is generally recognised that a ‘system’ of street lighting could be three or more lamps spaced not more than 183 metres apart. However, street lighting (for the purposes of determining whether or not a road is a restricted) is not necessarily limited to street lamps, but may extend to lighting provided by authorities or parish councils.

To avoid confusion that could arise if some 30mph zones were 'street-lit' and some were not, DfT guidance goes onto say:

Direction 11 of The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002 (TSRGD 2002) defines the requirements for the placing of speed-limit repeater signs. This states that speed-limit repeater signs cannot be placed along a road on which there is carriageway lighting not more than 183 metres apart and which is subject to a 30 mph speed limit. The Department will not make exceptions to this rule.

This leads to the conclusion that:

This means it should be assumed that, unless an order has been made and the road is signed to the contrary, a 30 mph speed limit applies where there are three or more lamps throwing light on the carriageway and placed not more than 183 metres apart.