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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 18:29 
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbiHwGBs ... re=related

CW wrote:
Latest 'Killer' driver on the loose in Cheshire
Monday, 3 August 2009 Keith Bingham 6 Comments
Cycling Weekly British news logo
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A driver in Cheshire who twice in the space a month has attempted to run off the road the same members of Port Sunlight Wheelers - and who is known to police because he already has six points on his licence - remains at large because the Crown Prosecution Service claim that none of the witnesses were able to identify him.
He's been heard boasting about his exploits in "chippies". The car involved is a hot-hatch, blue-coloured Renault Clio hurtling around the Chester area. One of the Port Sunlight Wheelers nearly wiped out by this guy is a police officer, Garry Doolan.

Doolan says End to End record holder, Andy Wilkinson, was involved in the second incident. Doolan says he has learned that the driver voluntarily attended a police interview, but gave a "no comment" interview. However, according to Doolan, the driver had previously told the police officer that he had "had a go" at the cyclists because they were riding four abreast - which Doolan refutes.
Doolan says this "significant statement" coupled with four witness statements from four experienced racing cyclists should have been enough to link the driver to the car.
However, Chester CPS claim they do not have the name of the driver and without a name, they cannot prosecute. "The CPS should not be playing judge and jury in this matter," says Doolan. "The CPS should also realise that, if his reckless behaviour is not checked, this driver is in danger of going on to seriously maim or kill a cyclist.
If that happens, that blood will be on their hands.
 "As a police officer, I despair that four decent, hard-working, tax-paying members of the community can all provide detailed, expansive witness statements yet the CPS can’t be bothered to put the matter before the court.
They are, these days, only interested in supporting jobs that are guaranteed to succeed at court. They are led entirely by performance figures, but that does a dis-service to the community."In the first incident, on Sunday, May 10, at about 11.45am, some 10 members of Port Sunlight Wheelers had left the Saighton circuit, and were making their way to a well-known cafe, The Cream Factory when a carpassed the group at an "horrendous speed with only inches to spare" - with no warning.
The driver then slammed on and reversed towards the cyclists, stopping inches from them.
All were forced to brake heavily and one of the riders, Roy Sumner, club captain, and TLI champion blew out his front tub! The driver of the Clio then gave them two fingers before wheel-spinning away!
The cyclists rang the police from the side of the road. The second incident occurred on Thursday, June 11, at about 8pm, again in the Saighton area, this time after a club 10-mile time trial. "The group included Andy Wilkinson. We were a couple of miles from the course, again riding two abreast on a wide road, when the same Renault Clio came at speed from behind us and then veered towards our group, causing a couple of us to fall off.
The driver was beeping his horn wildly. The Clio then veered into the opposite carriage-way and attempted to make off at speed. The car then veered back towards the kerb, slammed on the brakes before eventually making off."
All the riders were left stunned, shocked.
This time they dailed 999."To my mind, the second incident was a clear attempt by the driver of the vehicle to cause harm to some of our group and the fact that he did not was only through the grace of God," said Doolan. "Had he hit the group at the speed he was traveling, their would almost certainly have been fatalities."
From Doolan's point of view, he finds it beyond belief that the CPS will not sanction a charge against this driver "for the outrageously, pre-determined dangerous manner of his driving. I understand from the Cheshire police officer that there is only one registered keeper of the vehicle and he is the only insured driver."
"I believe, therefore, that this driver should be placed before a court for the court to make a decision."



A follow up is in this week's mag.

There are 4 witness statements all identifying this person. (who refused to comment to Cheshire colleagues who DID go to interview this driver.) :banghead:

OK .. his right under the law. but all the same - that intelligence provided by 4 people should count. I would like to think colleagues in Cheshire are keeping this fool on a database and watching out for any more serious nonsense on his part. That, unfortunately is the only reassurance I can give on this messageboard to the public at large .. that we police do take complaints as serious as this one very .. very seriously and try to help esolve the matter.

(Aside - but related comment mode)
===
I know some will think "FOB OFF" :roll; But I would like to say .. we do try our best and are often "squished" by CPS who tell us "we ain't got quite enough evidence for them to go for it" .. Geting absolute proof then is essential and it perhaps explains why we (or rather our accident investigation teams) will close off roads to get evidence or reconstruct in some cases :popcorn: We treat them as we would a murder scene to protect the evidence in situ in some very serious cases as you all are aware from the hold ups and road closures on occasion :roll: I will stress that this is done to establish the truth and not to be a kind of "witch hunt" I know the public get upset at the hold ups etc.. but those involved need fair facts for justice.

====


\back to the mag.. which has a slightly different version to the one I linked to here. :popcorn:

CW since contacte the CPS to ask what planet they are on here :popcorn:

CPS :banghead:

CPS to CW questions" wrote:

In relation to the first incident - it would seem that prosecution could not prove that the police had served a notice of intended prosecution on the relevant driver. In hte second case the requirement to be able to prove service of documents on the suspect, which again is undertaken by the police, was not met


Ahhh., cop out on the "procedure then.


I think the problem was down to actual proof even though 4 folk gave statements, I know folk . or rather the cycling contingent will hate me again for saying this ,, but I have to.. SORRY - and I do understand spindrift etc even if I do not agree with him on one or umpteen things in life :roll: .. but sometimes if the witnesses are linked . not objective nor 100% independent of each other (and I think this may have been part of the problem here) - and if procedures have not been followed to the letter.. :banghead: . then a defence lawyer can rip us all to shreds on the stand - even if the accused is actually guilty. We have to be meticulous at each stage., I think we are here, Yes.. in some areas we have to bide time and get the evidence "watertight" and I am aware that this may not seem right to the public - most especially to the very critical and demanding types like well .. I admit my cousin - Wildy - at times.. :roil: But these types do get their come uppance and I am also a firm believer in these sayings

my mum to me as a teenager in love wrote:

The truth will always out



and

my mum again to me as a teenager in love wrote:

What goes around .. comes around with a sharp flash fired sting


:yikes:


But her advice stretched beyond my then "puppy love" .. and I am am proud to say in public here that I took her wise words to heart into my manhood and general outlook on life. :bow:

I have to admit he sayings have been proven right too many times :popcorn: So cyclists in Cheshire . have faith here.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 18:59 
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Think it clearly states in the RTA you have to have a minimum of two independent witnesses. Seems odd that two witnesses were policeman but that didn't seem to make their witness statements carry more weight.

Why don't they just do a line up?? Stick chummy in with a load of others and see if the 4 witnesses independently pick him out. If not then they can't be sure enough and they'll just have to start wearing helmet cams or organise some sort of plain clothes escort to keep an eye on them while they're out riding. If they all pick him out then there must be a case to answer.

What is the position on cycling. Do cyclists have to be single file at all times?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 23:08 
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teabelly wrote:
Think it clearly states in the RTA you have to have a minimum of two independent witnesses. Seems odd that two witnesses were policeman but that didn't seem to make their witness statements carry more weight.



Aye.. That's what seems so odd about this story

Quote:
Why don't they just do a line up?? Stick chummy in with a load of others and see if the 4 witnesses independently pick him out. If not then they can't be sure enough and they'll just have to start wearing helmet cams or organise some sort of plain clothes escort to keep an eye on them while they're out riding. If they all pick him out then there must be a case to answer.


Ah.. the escort .. ummm .. sigh.. resources. :roll: Daresay the helmet cams might help support their case. :scratchchin:

Quote:
What is the position on cycling. Do cyclists have to be single file at all times?

[/quot]

Rule 66 (not in red ... nor as a MUST NOT) says a cyclist should never ride more than two abreast and should revrt to single file on narrow roads/bends and other busy roads. Common sense consderation to others applies basically :popcorn:

Does not excuse a thug's menacing behaviour all the same :roll:

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Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!


Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 08:30 
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surely even if they cant id the driver they can and have id'd the car... and could put an antisocial on it.. or seize ?


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 06, 2009 21:07 
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Am I missing something here but FOUR witnesses all should be able to say 'At (day date time and place I was riding ....) ' They can also say what effect the incident had on them. As non professional witnesses their statements should be taken from them independantly of course.

Suspect vehicle is traced reg keeper is given a s172 Notice to id driver at time. Now where is the problem if reg keeper does not id driver he is prosecuted for that offence. If he ids' the driver he or she is prosecuted for careless driving at the very least. Or how about s5 Public Order Act alarm and distress caused to four cyclists going about their lawful occasions?


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