Safe Speed Forums

The campaign for genuine road safety
It is currently Fri Apr 10, 2020 03:03

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 26 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 00:12 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 23:42
Posts: 3820
CW has one extremely important piece in this special and i I recall giving this same advice in the past. But for the benefit of the more mitlitant - I shall spell out more or less what a CYCLING magazine says as they seem to take more noe of this than anything else :wink:

All road users - cyclists, motorcyclists and vehicle drivers are requied to follow much the same set of regulations and all have the same rights to use the roads.

The Highway Code requires al cyclists to follow traffic rules, signals and signs. :wink: Cyclists can be pulled over and prosecuted by the police for running a red light, breaking a traffic law or cycling carelessly :yeyes: We do pull in our patch. We treat all equally! :wink:

Cyclists cannot be charged with speeding :roll: as they do not have to have a speedo :?

There are times - I swear I'd love to :wink: In any case I am sure this would be case if we all cycled and did not drive. Our militants should be careful about what they wish for :wink:

But the piece confirms we can charge with "pedalling furiously" :lol: :lol:

The piece states that cyclists must signal when changing lanes or indicate a change of position and must give a fair warning.

The peicve states that a bike must have decent brakes.

Tehy touch on COAST in this bit :lol: :lol: :wink: :wink: :lol:

Quote:

a big part of riding defensively is being able to anticipate what others are doing or are going to do. You must concentrate, obsserve, antiicipate and plan by giving space and time


Sounds like COAST to me. :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Lurkers and critics take note! You heard it FIRST on this site and then by my cousin Krissi. and the Mad Cats on PH and here :lol:

Knew it! They lurk on here and have noted. :wink: Phew! We are getting it across! :wink: Despite the critics. :wink:

CW stresses the importance of this: good brakes, observation and anticipation make all the difference when a pedestrian steps out; when a vehicle does the unexepected. (sounds a bit familiar to me :wink: )

CW says that all bikes must have front/rear reflectors and front and rear lights in good working order

And cyclists please note this

[quote ="Cycling Weekly Speciall"]

Simply havng good working front and rear lights may be enough to satisfy the police. but it may not be enough to satisfy in case of legal action following a collision [/quote]

And on this I would urge to buy the best you can afford and to really read revies on lights. The ones in CW's review - are sound lights. Please purchase the best you can afford!

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!


Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 08:17 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2004 09:16
Posts: 3655
In Gear wrote:
Cyclists cannot be charged with speeding :roll: as they do not have to have a speedo :?


Bike speedos are so cheap these days. What is wrong with making them mandatory for road bikes.

Seems to me they get away with avoiding any kind of safety related legislation (helmets, lights, speed) not to mention legalised cycling on the pavement.

_________________
Speed camera policy Kills


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 08:54 
Offline
Member
Member

Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 14:04
Posts: 2325
Location: The interweb
Gizmo wrote:
In Gear wrote:
Cyclists cannot be charged with speeding :roll: as they do not have to have a speedo :?


Bike speedos are so cheap these days. What is wrong with making them mandatory for road bikes.


One good reason - they are a distraction.

If we have them removed from cars can we get rid of speed limits?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 10:03 
Offline
Gold Member
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 00:04
Posts: 2311
Gizmo wrote:
Bike speedos are so cheap these days. What is wrong with making them mandatory for road bikes.

as most cyclists couldn't break the speed limit if they tried, what would be the point?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 10:17 
Offline
Friend of Safe Speed
Friend of Safe Speed
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 23:09
Posts: 6735
Location: Stockport, Cheshire
johnsher wrote:
Gizmo wrote:
Bike speedos are so cheap these days. What is wrong with making them mandatory for road bikes.

as most cyclists couldn't break the speed limit if they tried, what would be the point?

Surely it would be fairly easy in a downhill 30 limit. And many residential streets now have 20 limits.

I remember Guy Chapman once bragging about exceeding the speed limit on his pushbike.

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 01:10 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 00:15
Posts: 5232
Location: Windermere
Windermere to Bowness, you can break the 30 limit easily, but you'd better have good breaks at the bottom of the hill! :lol: :lol:

Also some drivers are looking for guesthouses with vacancies, and when they see one which takes their fancy, they dont like the driver (or rider) behind to get a look at it!! :o :lol:

_________________
Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 12:03 
Offline
Gold Member
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 00:04
Posts: 2311
PeterE wrote:
Surely it would be fairly easy in a downhill 30 limit. And many residential streets now have 20 limits.

You'll find that only road bikes really have the gearing to be pushed over 30mph so you'll need a fairly steep hill to hit that without pedalling. When you are pedalling 30mph isn't exactly what I'd call an easy speed to do and given the prosecution limit is 35 then I think you'll find even fewer getting there - even on a downhill.

20 is easy enough to do but the roads I've seen 20 limits on have been in such a bad state of repair that you'd be crazy to try it.


Quote:
I remember Guy Chapman once bragging about exceeding the speed limit on his pushbike.

I've pushed 40 in a 30 zone (wide road, no left side access, no pedestrians, so safe to do so) but that doesn't make me or Guy Chapman most cyclists. Nor does it mean that we are capable of doing it everywhere we go, unlike a motor vehicle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 14:34 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 23:28
Posts: 1940
johnsher wrote:
PeterE wrote:
Surely it would be fairly easy in a downhill 30 limit. And many residential streets now have 20 limits.

You'll find that only road bikes really have the gearing to be pushed over 30mph so you'll need a fairly steep hill to hit that without pedalling. When you are pedalling 30mph isn't exactly what I'd call an easy speed to do and given the prosecution limit is 35 then I think you'll find even fewer getting there - even on a downhill.


Liebchen - even I have managed to pedal above 30 mph around here on a :yikes: downhill... und there ist also my liebe sister's little aventure in the Dales. One minute she was there chatting to us und the next she had hurtled off down a steepest perpendicular slope :rotfl: with :rotfl: more twists than a set of government statistics :rotfl: At least you could hear as she was shouting all the way down! :rotfl: Und all credit - she got down without mishap 8-) :lol:

lieber johnsher wrote:
20 is easy enough to do but the roads I've seen 20 limits on have been in such a bad state of repair that you'd be crazy to try it.



In Ambleside und in some of our villages with the 20 mph limit ist very easy to exceed 20 mph on bike. Und daft cycle lane apart - roads are in good state of repair. Und have driven past schools in the sticks with 20mph limit at school site - und road ist in good repair und cyclists have always gained on me with useful gadget's speedo reading 18mph :wink:

Quote:
Quote:
I remember Guy Chapman once bragging about exceeding the speed limit on his pushbike.

I've pushed 40 in a 30 zone (wide road, no left side access, no pedestrians, so safe to do so) but that doesn't make me or Guy Chapman most cyclists.


Ist a thread on C+ per my liebe sister und lieber Observer also gave a link where they all blather on about fast times on commutes :wink:

liebr johnsher wrote:
Nor does it mean that we are capable of doing it everywhere we go, unlike a motor vehicle.


I do get out of puff quickly on up hills but can maintain a steady speed on my push bike on a flat. Und with the gears on the roady ist not that great an effort to keep a steady 17-18 mph -ish for a few mile or so :wink: Und on downhills - very easy to push out the old envelope :yesyes: :twisted:

But the danger ist the cyclist will do this speed where not appropriate nor using COAST as well. Und has happened on odd occasions in past. Lieber :bib: on the other PH channel mentioned some cases he has dealt with in his longest career as a :bib: :wink:

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien
!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 17:21 
Offline
User

Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 00:08
Posts: 748
Location: Grimsby
Hmmmm, reminds me of my lunatic younger days, I managed to exceed the limit coming down Rushup Edge near Castleton in Derbyshire, including overtaking cars on the outside.
Once I had pedalled up to as fast as I could, I let gravity take over, the very thought of my having done some of the things I did as a youngster makes me cringe nowadays.

_________________
Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 22:20 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 21:27
Posts: 247
Location: Near Stockport
Quote:
The Highway Code requires al cyclists to follow traffic rules, signals and signs. Cyclists can be pulled over and prosecuted by the police for running a red light, breaking a traffic law or cycling carelessly :yeyes: We do pull in our patch. We treat all equally!


Recently we had a few days in Amsterdam. Cyclists routinely ignore red lights. This is considered quite normal. And if a car hits a cyclist, it's almost always considered to be the car driver's fault. Maybe just maybe they have their priorities right over there.

Now I don't condone cyclists jumping red lights in general, but there are situations where it is pointless for the cyclist to stop. One example is a junction with a road entering from the right where the main road has a cycle lane - provided of course that the cyclist gives way to any pedestrians crossing the road. And you should remember that it takes effort for a cyclist to stop and then get going again, and - entirely naturally - cyclists try to avoid having to stop wherever possible.

I speak as an ex-commuting cyclist who managed to survive cycling to Manchester and back for 20 years.

Brian


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 22:36 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 21:27
Posts: 247
Location: Near Stockport
johnsher wrote:
Gizmo wrote:
Bike speedos are so cheap these days. What is wrong with making them mandatory for road bikes.

as most cyclists couldn't break the speed limit if they tried, what would be the point?


In the days before they could only have cameras at specific locations, this BiB pointed a speed gun at me as I cycled past and pronounced "16". We were both suitably amused by that. At least it shows that real police officers can be human and have a sense of humour. :lol:

But believe me, cyclists can - and often do - break speed limits. Not geriatric types like me though. :roll:

Brian


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 22:45 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 21:27
Posts: 247
Location: Near Stockport
Dratsabasti wrote:
Hmmmm, reminds me of my lunatic younger days, I managed to exceed the limit coming down Rushup Edge near Castleton in Derbyshire, including overtaking cars on the outside.
Once I had pedalled up to as fast as I could, I let gravity take over, the very thought of my having done some of the things I did as a youngster makes me cringe nowadays.


In my younger days, I was hurtling down the Macclesfield - Whaley Bridge road (towards the Todd Brook bridge for those who know the area) at (I would guess) about 50 when this hearse pulled out of a side road straight into my path. It hadn't occurred to the driver that a cyclist could do more than about 10 mph - even downhill. Well hearses don't do they unless (a) the funeral is finished (b) Brunstrom isn't a passenger. :lol:

Brian


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 23:26 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 13:55
Posts: 2247
Location: middlish
nedsram wrote:
Not geriatric types like me though. :roll:


all you need to do is stick the phrase "your honour" on the end and you have the perfect defence!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:27 
Offline
User

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 18:39
Posts: 346
Quote:
All road users - cyclists, motorcyclists and vehicle drivers are requied to follow much the same set of regulations and all have the same rights to use the roads.


I've always been under the impression that if a cyclist hands aver his Driving Licence as ID when stopped for an offence, it is treated as though commited in/on a motor vehicle. Or is this urban myth time?

Quote:
Simply havng good working front and rear lights may be enough to satisfy the police. but it may not be enough to satisfy in case of legal action following a collision


It is a legal requirement that all cycles SOLD in the UK must meet B.S. and have refectors fitted (or supplied if catalogue) where appropriate. It is not a requirement (yet), to keep them in place once you have left the shop.


Quote:
getting away with legalised cycling on the pavement


Unless Ye Olde Law has changed recently. The general ruling was cycles with under a 20" wheel were allowed pavement use under certain conditions. [could be wrong]
Presumably because before the advent of BMX etc. users of this size would normally have been for children.

Quote:
You'll find that only road bikes really have the gearing to be pushed over 30mph so you'll need a fairly steep hill to hit that without pedalling.

Quote:
as most cyclists couldn't break the speed limit if they tried, what would be the point?


Depends on your level of fitness!!
I used to do 30+ on a daily basis (MTB) round town. And my ultimate was 43.2mph ON THE FLAT. (26" rigid MTB running 1" slicks & 48Tx12T). Heart rate at 202bpm (was in early 20's) & cadence so high I totally burned out after a mile! Ah those were the days....
Some of the roadies I used to train with had been known to exceed 50 downhill.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: LAW AND CYCLISTS
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:27 
Offline
Gold Member
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 00:04
Posts: 2311
nedsram wrote:
But believe me, cyclists can - and often do - break speed limits. Not geriatric types like me though. :roll:

I'm just wondering which bit of 'MOST' people are having trouble with. I'd like you to try and find me some cyclists who can maintain 35mph on a flat road - even the pros struggle to do that. That's like saying motorists can - and often do - drive at 220mph because you've seen an F1 driver do it for 2 seconds.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:31 
Offline
Gold Member
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 00:04
Posts: 2311
hobbes wrote:
I used to do 30+ on a daily basis (MTB) round town. And my ultimate was 43.2mph ON THE FLAT. (26" rigid MTB running 1" slicks & 48Tx12T). Heart rate at 202bpm (was in early 20's) & cadence so high I totally burned out after a mile!

and I call bullshit! If you could hold 43mph over a mile - on a mountain bike!!! - then you should have signed up for the olympic kilo because you would have won by a significant margin.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:45 
Offline
User

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 18:39
Posts: 346
Quote:
and I call bullshit! If you could hold 43mph over a mile


Perhaps I should clarify my statement.

On a mile stretch I PEAKED at that speed. I was totally & utterly f'd when I stopped!

(Significant problem of wind resistance!)

I held that speed for probably no more than 3 or 4 seconds, but had 'burst' into it, giving everything I had. And using every available ounce of strength to get there.

I agree, if this was sustained, nobody would've heard of Lance Armstrong!

Just saying it is possible to PEAK at stupid speeds. After all, as you so eloquently put it, the 220mph F1 Driver may PEAK at that speed, he doesn't DRIVE at that speed for any distance.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 11:17 
Offline
Gold Member
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 00:04
Posts: 2311
hobbes wrote:
Just saying it is possible to PEAK at stupid speeds. After all, as you so eloquently put it, the 220mph F1 Driver may PEAK at that speed, he doesn't DRIVE at that speed for any distance.

yes it is possible to peak at silly speeds - but that doesn't exactly translate to cyclists having to have speedos because they can speed everywhere. It also doesn't translate to ALL cyclists or even MOST cyclists being able to do it. Even on a clubrun there aren't many who can manage a 40mph downhill sprint (not that I'd ever try such a thing).
The last few races I've done have only just gone over 30mph on the flat - and that's in a bunch, on a closed circuit, with cat 1 riders in the group.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 16:23 
Offline
Member
Member

Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 15:20
Posts: 37
Location: London NW10, UK
I'd like to see a 5mph speed limit for cyclists using the pavement.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 16:43 
Offline
User

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 18:39
Posts: 346
Dowlais wrote:
I'd like to see a 5mph speed limit for cyclists using the pavement.


5mph equates to a VERY fast walk (think 'speed walking' not quite a jog). There are some cyclists (less skilled) who couldn't maintain their balance at this low speed and would therefore present MORE of a hazard as they will be weaving around trying to stay upright.

Get in your car & try 5mph (if your speedo reads that low) - you'll barely be passing pedestrians!

But I would prefer NO cyclists on pavements & footpaths. That's what the road or cycle paths are for.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 26 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
[ Time : 0.581s | 13 Queries | GZIP : Off ]