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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2006 09:59 
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Ernest Marsh wrote:
I have never had to perform the Heimlich manouvre on somebody that was choking, yet Iv've seen it happen (choking) lots of times - I hope I will know how when I need to!

well unless medical advice has change in the few years since I did my first aid course they no longer recommend doing that as it removes any remaining air from the patients lungs and doesn't guarantee removing the blockage.
Now, poor analogies aside, can someone please explain how putting hazard lights on when going through what is effectively a four way stop sign actually helps anybody?


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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 00:12 
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I think the Mad Doc has a photo of the junction concerned and may post it up - he was down "in the 'burbs" as he calls it - visiting one of his own sisters. Think the youngest was only about a week old at the time too. He don't take chances. Was the East Lancs A580 he was crossing - and not far from where the child he posted about was killed.

As for "legality" - I think I (and my colleagues) would apply discretion. :wink: Rule 96 of the Highway Code simply say you MUST NOT use whilst driving unless on a motorway or to warn of a hazard.

In this case - as I understand from the Mad Doc - he was crossing a busy - 60 mph speed limited dual carriagway with right lane filters on the fast road and a very wide crossing. He would have had them on long enough to warn something approaching at speed that he was there.

No doubt he'll post up a photo - think his sister took some photos for him to illustrate the dodgy light sequences on the busy A580 anyway, :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 00:41 
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In case folks wondering - CW is a bumper issue this week as they - er - repeated the same mag ... last week :rotfl:

Anyway today's edition sees the star letter attacking the bloke whose letter I posted a couple of pages ago! :roll:

Ooops George wrote a "personal and cmpassionate argument for the lid" and Graham is complaiing about it ... tsssst! :roll:

George rides 300 km per week

Quote:

This put him in a minority! He does not potter to the off -licence then!


Sory :rotfl:

Quote:

He spends much more time on his bike than other riders and is more likely to experience an accident within teh design perimeter of his helmet


:? Eh?

ooohhhh :rotfl: Graham vents his spleen on this bit :hehe: Aye - tis better than watching any soap opera to read these letters :lol:


Oooh fsstttt" and hisss!

Quote:

When he rides I bet he has a shower and a change of clothes at his destination


How do you know he does? He did not say so. Though I think he was in Oz ....

Quote:

Consequently the cost of helmet wearing is relatively much less than it is for a commuter, who in addition to messing up their hair on their ride to the station, also has the problem of what to do with the helmet for the rest of the day


:rotfl: :rotfl:

Gasp!


Er - what about the wind in yer 'air then? :wink:

As for what to do with a helmet.. :rotfl:

Well - no better not say what I've done with helmets in the past.. and I'm not necessarily talking of cycling ones :wink:

(They did come in pretty handy once for a stash of doughnuts once - when I were but a bit of a lad and directing traffic! Doh! That#s why it got in a bit of a jam! :wink: :hehe:

:boxedin: :popcorn:

Sorry - just could not resist it!


Seriously


But what about just putting it on the coat stand - with your coat/kagoul whatever... :wink:


Our Graham continues in much the same "vain" about his hair do and the measures the cost of this against NHS costs to treat head injuries .. :roll:

:idea: Wonder if he'll use his prize of a turbo charged air pump to blw dry his hair :hehe:

Sorry - but this letter has really "tickled me" as me Mam used to say! :lol:

If Graham chances on this site and read this - cheers for the letter - I am sure it was tongue in cheek! I enjoyed reading it!

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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 00:51 
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Another chap writes that he's been riding for 62 years and had 3 serious accidents - but no head injuries

He says he's never worn a helmet but would like some body armour as he has broken his arm, leg and collar bone in the three incidents.

He reckons the only time a helmet may have helped was when he fell off a ladder when cleaning out a gutter.

I fell off a ladder once doing that job - sprained my ankle. :shock:

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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 10:51 
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In Gear wrote:
In case folks wondering - CW is a bumper issue this week as they - er - repeated the same mag ... last week :rotfl:

Anyway today's edition sees the star letter attacking the bloke whose letter I posted a couple of pages ago! :roll:

Ooops George wrote a "personal and cmpassionate argument for the lid" and Graham is complaiing about it ... tsssst! :roll:

George rides 300 km per week

Quote:

This put him in a minority! He does not potter to the off -licence then!


Sory :rotfl:

Quote:

He spends much more time on his bike than other riders and is more likely to experience an accident within teh design perimeter of his helmet


:? Eh?

ooohhhh :rotfl: Graham vents his spleen on this bit :hehe: Aye - tis better than watching any soap opera to read these letters :lol:


Oooh fsstttt" and hisss!

Quote:

When he rides I bet he has a shower and a change of clothes at his destination


How do you know he does? He did not say so. Though I think he was in Oz ....

Quote:

Consequently the cost of helmet wearing is relatively much less than it is for a commuter, who in addition to messing up their hair on their ride to the station, also has the problem of what to do with the helmet for the rest of the day


:rotfl: :rotfl:

Gasp!


Er - what about the wind in yer 'air then? :wink:

As for what to do with a helmet.. :rotfl:

Well - no better not say what I've done with helmets in the past.. and I'm not necessarily talking of cycling ones :wink:

(They did come in pretty handy once for a stash of doughnuts once - when I were but a bit of a lad and directing traffic! Doh! That#s why it got in a bit of a jam! :wink: :hehe:

:boxedin: :popcorn:

Sorry - just could not resist it!


Seriously


But what about just putting it on the coat stand - with your coat/kagoul whatever... :wink:


Our Graham continues in much the same "vain" about his hair do and the measures the cost of this against NHS costs to treat head injuries .. :roll:

:idea: Wonder if he'll use his prize of a turbo charged air pump to blw dry his hair :hehe:

Sorry - but this letter has really "tickled me" as me Mam used to say! :lol:

If Graham chances on this site and read this - cheers for the letter - I am sure it was tongue in cheek! I enjoyed reading it!


I'll have a glass of whatever you were on when you posted this, IG! :D :D :o :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 21:16 
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Methinks Horlicks or Ovaltine :lol: :lol: :lol:

Though he did once have a "set the world straight" discussion once in a place called Stuben over the border from Appenzell .. over an "Apfelkorn" - Apfel Schnaps - it's a bit like Normandy Calvados!.. on the topic of "Warum ist die Banane krumm" (Why is a banana bent? ) Don't ask - he never got the the bottom of it all with this Austrian he was sort of practising his German on... My wife and her "not very tame" sister were for once lost for words.. :lol: :lol: :lol: Brother-in law Mike ( a most "feral feline" :wink: ) and self had the "Paxman jaw look!" :lol:

I think this Austrian geezer, another of the Swiss mob called Andreas and IG all decided - eventually - that if it were n't bent - then it wouldn't be a .... :wink:



Now there's a topic to discuss when all goes quiet in the "snug" :lol:


PS - we all know IG likes a decent red with his roast beef. 8-), and either one glass of a decent port or one snifter of brandy after a large meal. :lol:

But nowt in excess .. hasten to add. :wink:

But admit - Wildy :neko: and self buy CW every other week and alternate C+ with other monthlies - such as various Mountain Biking mags, Cyclo Sport and a few foreign ones. We thus have one different cycling magazine each month. Kriss and Mike take C+ and one foreign one each month and IG reads CW every week and C+ every month.

Rest of family alternate between the rest and we pass on the best bits between us. Same with motoring mags .. :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 21:43 
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Actually - these really belong in the thread I posted up with regard to a teenager called Lauren who died.

One of my sisters lives in this area and she took some photos of the A580.

These were the lights which failed on me once. A wide crossing and a dangerously fast road. I was visiting my sister and I had my children in the car. My family mean a great deal to me..

Image

Wide juinction and there are red light cams... these lights had FAILED that day.

Image

This is the other direction. About 500 yards after this bend - another set of traffic lights which had also failed that day.


Image


My sister says she took this shot .....
Image

And this shot was as she hit the shutter on a reflex. She says she was shocked at the quick light change.

A 14 year old called Lauren died here. No one was to blame and my heart and sincerest feelings are with Lauren's family and the persons who collided with her by sheer unlucky accident.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 10:17 
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Just thought I'd give you an idea of the sort of idiot mentality present in London. Riding in this morning I'm stopped at a pedestrian crossing when crazy woman rides past close and fast enough for me to feel the breeze. She's dressed in work clothes and not hanging around so given the 25C temps at the time I'm sure her work colleagues are going to be really happy if they have to sit anywhere near her... but I digress.
As I ride past her I say "you know, we normally stop at red lights".
At the next set of lights she pulls up and asks what I said.
"I said we normally stop at reds and you're acting like an idiot if you insist on running them."
"well what's it to you?"
"err, how about a large percentage of motorists wanting to kill ME because people like you insist on running reds?"
"don't be stupid, they don't mind if you don't get in their way." :shock:

and we ride off.

Next set of lights... (note at least she's now stopping at the reds)
"how can you complain that it's illegal to run reds when you just rode down the wrong side of the road - that's certainly not legal."
"have you heard of overtaking? Perhaps a quick read of the highway code might refresh your memory." If people actually believe this it might explain why nobody wants to overtake any more.

next set of lights... (again she stops!!! success???)
"You know, the only reason you complain about me running red lights is because you're miserable and boring... and pedantic. Yes, miserable, boring and pedantic.... and you need to get out more."

so that's the sum total of the red light runners 'for' argument.

Hopefully Ken will get some cops on the intersections to deal with this lot some time soon.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 15:55 
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I have 23 sets of traffic lights on my commute (cycle) of which I stop at all 23 of them. It angers me to see cyclists jumping lights, but, the cars that jump them anger me even more!

Whenever I see a thread/discussion about RLJers, motorists are always taking the moral high ground. But I see very few of these people acknowledging the fact that a lot of cars also RLJ. I see it every day, I also see cars/lorries/vans drive down the one way road outside my work going the wrong way, using it as a shortcut. I was even told to "fukc off" when I pointed this out to a van that was driving towards me (Iwas going the correct way)

So......could I please have some recognition that cars/vans/lorries also fluant the same rules as cyclists. The "us an' them" mentality should be saved for the people who are in the wrong, and not for the mode of transport they choose.

Just to add, I have had on several occasions had motorists get irate with me for STOPPING at red lights.......what's that all about??

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 16:05 
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Bewildered wrote:
I have 23 sets of traffic lights on my commute (cycle) of which I stop at all 23 of them.


Are they all at red then?

I'll get my coat.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 16:17 
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LOL :lol:

Unfortunatley some days they are which is very frustrating. It's only 5 miles!!!!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 16:24 
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... a lot of cars also RLJ. I see it every day ...


Interesting, because I see very few cars or goods vehicles actually jump red lights. Now and again I see someone "amber gambling" and slipping through at the last minute but I never see drivers deliberately approach a red light (which has been red for some time) and then drive through like I see cyclists doing.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 16:36 
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malcolmw wrote:
Now and again I see someone "amber gambling" and slipping through at the last minute but I never see drivers deliberately approach a red light (which has been red for some time) and then drive through like I see cyclists doing.

well no problems there then...

If you never see motorists running lights then I suggest you sit at a busy intersection with a right turn and watch how many people cross the white line and turn AFTER the lights have changed.

edited to add: and I've even had people argue that it's ok to do this because "everyone does it" while at the same time arguing that cyclists who claim the same thing should be shot.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 16:58 
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In the "unofficial right filter" scenario you describe I don't think many motorists would object to a cyclist creeping through with them just after a light has gone red (even though this is bad and potentially dangerous practice). The objections come when you have been sitting at a red light for 30 seconds and a cyclist comes along on your inside and sails straight through.

I don't think I would call the situation you describe as "running lights". I would reserve this more emotive term for deliberately going through at high speed with no intention of stopping.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 17:00 
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Nope, I'm not talking about people going through on amber, I'm talking definite red. I see it every day. Maybe some motorists don't see them because they're not paying full attention!!

Try sitting at the traffic lights at Gypsy Corner on the A40 and then come back and tell me you've never seen a car going through a red light!!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 17:00 
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malcolmw wrote:
I would reserve this more emotive term for deliberately going through at high speed with no intention of stopping.

well if you want to try that argument then not many cyclists are running lights either as most of them stop or slow down to check that it's clear before proceeding through the intersection.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 17:03 
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Hmmm, so if a cyclist runs a red light that has been red for 30 seconds, he's more in the wrong than the car that runs it after 3/4 seconds. I thought the definition of running a red light was......errrr........running a red light!!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 17:15 
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That's 3 to 4 seconds!! not three quarters of a second!!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 18:09 
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An extract from the first post on this thread reads thus:

Quote:
Stopatred is a campaign to improve the status of cycling in the eyes of the public and policy-makers alike, and to tackle the attitudes of those cyclists whose behaviour perpetuates the image of cyclists as a low-status social 'out-group' on wheels.


My point is that although both jumping the lights by a few seconds and by, say, 30 seconds are equally illegal, the second infringement done in the full sight of motorists dutifully stopped at red is more likely to achieve the effect described in the last phrase of the quote above.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 11:19 
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I was thinking about this post on my cycle home last night. I came to crossroads, where 5 cars jumped the red by easily 3 or 4 seconds, enough time for the other lights to have turned green. All the motorist take off from the green light and next thing there's chaos, people leaning on there horns, shouting, swearing and threatening each another.

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