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 Post subject: "Cycle deaths rise"
PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 13:26 
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Cycle deaths rise as more beginners climb into the saddle.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0, ... 23,00.html

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 14:10 
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I bet mandatory helmet law will be next on the agenda.... :roll:

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 17:29 
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What's required is a systematic persecution of cyclists with cycle unfriendly roads and taxes to drive them off the roads and on to public transport.

If it works for cars and motorcycles it should work for bicycles too.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 17:59 
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Quote:
Mary Williams, Brake’s chief executive, said: “It is no surprise that cyclists, one of the most vulnerable groups of road users, are dying in increasing numbers. Britain’s roads are still plagued by speeding drivers, as well as law-breaking uninsured, unlicensed, drunk and drugged drivers


Like a record with the needle stuck!

By the way Motorcyclists are the most vulnerable road users Mary-"rant"-Williams. But then you are too stupid to know that.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 18:07 
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Our increasingly authoritarian government will be thinking of banning cycling (and motorcycling, come to that) for our own good and because it'll instantly improve the statistics and reduce the drain on the NHS.

They will find it easier and cheaper to deal with the symptoms not the underlying causes.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 18:11 
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This underlines the point that "modal shift" does not necessarily improve safety, and often may work against it.

I remember in 2000 the then Transport Minister Lord (Gus) MacDonald caused some controversy by warning that plans to increase the use of pedal cycles might jeopardise the government's aim of cutting road deaths by 40% by 2010.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 18:26 
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Most of the cycle paths around here are idiotic. You can really only mix pedestrians and cyclists. It makes more sense to improve pedestrian routes so they can double up as cycling routes. There are cycle routes which end abruptly because the road is too narrow to have them :roll:


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 21:38 
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PeterE wrote:
This underlines the point that "modal shift" does not necessarily improve safety, and often may work against it.

I remember in 2000 the then Transport Minister Lord (Gus) MacDonald caused some controversy by warning that plans to increase the use of pedal cycles might jeopardise the government's aim of cutting road deaths by 40% by 2010.


Unless you train people properly they will create a danger to themselves and others. Let's not lose sight of the fact that bikes today can reach faster speeds without too much muscle from the pedaller. Traffic changes daily and if you are riding, biking, driving ..each day . to some extent you are working with it and changing your style and strategy accordingly.

However, my sister-in-law, Kriss decided to spend a holiday in China. Her video footage of millions cycling all at once.. jostling and riding over anyone who had the audacity or bad luck to fall was a very sickening viewing to be honest. I have asked Kriss and Mike to upload for me to link for viewing as I think there's much to learn from these scenes from Beijing in any case. I did suggest they edit out the comments and the footage showing Kriss herself looking unusually flustered when she joined the flow of riders to assess potential danger for herself.

One thing I will always respect my sister-in-law for.. she will not just watch and take a few "memory photos" - she does try stuff out to experience it all for herself.

More urbanised .. the busier .. the more prone to mishap and misfortune as we are all rather at the mercy of the other numpty. :wink: We just have to be " lessn numpty than thee!"

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 08:43 
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teabelly wrote:
Most of the cycle paths around here are idiotic. You can really only mix pedestrians and cyclists. It makes more sense to improve pedestrian routes so they can double up as cycling routes. There are cycle routes which end abruptly because the road is too narrow to have them :roll:

Tell me about it! Some roads around here are barely wise enough for traffic, and rocky verges make widening almost an impossible dream!

There was a plan to put a cycle path over Lake Windermere on a causway, to bypass some dodgy bends which follow the waters edge from about 4 feet.
Trouble is (apart from maintaining it, and preventing cyclists ending up in the lake in winter) was nobody has either the money, or the plans - the planning aplication was thrown out because they wanted approval of a potential scheme, but nobody had made any drawings, let alone plans!

The Daily Wail said inexperienced cyclists, and the behaviour of Lycra Louts was to blame, and called for a hardcore of arrogant cyclists to join motorists in the dock. :(

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 09:51 
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Quote:
Britain’s roads are still plagued by speeding drivers, as well as law-breaking uninsured, unlicensed, drunk and drugged drivers.

every day I see at least 5 cyclists cycling any direction they fancy, crossing roads or junctions without looking, on red, or in an unpridictable mannor.

The blame cannot go all on drivers or cyclists. Thje highway code applies to alll road users and pedestrians.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2006 17:47 
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You can post your views on this BBC page, or read others.
BBC Forum page
Well worth a visit either way... I particularly liked this comment:
Quote:
Come to Cambridge and see why so many cyclists get injured. They simply don't understand how roads work (whilst cycling through red lights and texting on their mobiles at the same time, yes seriously).

and this comment is obviously pertinent in the area the poster lives:
Quote:
The real problem that no amount of education, traffic calming, cycle lanes or incentives are going to solve the simple fact that cyclists and motorists are not compatible on the road systems we have today. To be honest, I'm surprised the figures aren't much higher considering the poor driving I see on a daily basis from both groups, and the fact that the two modes just simply don't, shouldn't and can't mix.

I have to say cyclists jumping red lights is no so much a problem in my area, because we dont have many. Here it is not having lights, or ignoring lane/road markings which is their usual fault, and DRIVERS not giving cyclists enough room when passing on narrow twisty roads!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2006 19:07 
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Overall dwaths are down and the Government lauds its success, but look at the detail

Coach/bus deaths fell by 11 (thats over half of the total reduction) well we were lucky there was not the big coach crash that happened the year before

Motorcycle deaths are down again than the shite weather early on last year for that, this year the figures are awful already.

Everytime I see them take the credit for the "success" I do wonder if they will have the balls to take the blame when the figures bounce again.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2006 19:17 
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Patch wrote:
Overall dwaths are down and the Government lauds its success, but look at the detail

Coach/bus deaths fell by 11 (thats over half of the total reduction) well we were lucky there was not the big coach crash that happened the year before

Motorcycle deaths are down again than the shite weather early on last year for that, this year the figures are awful already.

Everytime I see them take the credit for the "success" I do wonder if they will have the balls to take the blame when the figures bounce again.


Gov stats are manipulated. On paper - NHS look good as does education and policing.

In reality - little change. I am amazed at the overall gullibilty. My death rate from lurgies is little changed. My way of recording has changed. As a result I can think I have some superhuman atributes. I do not - of course. :wink: But the government want to be seen to "deliver" and youy may be seen by Triage on entry to A&E .. you still wait similar lengths for treatment but being seen by "Triage" get counted in the stats on waiting times.

Gov stats? About as reliable as their reports on WMD in Iraq and a host of other issues :hissyfit:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 22:56 
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CTC insists thes figures should not be "doom and gloom"

OK - so it's an overall 14% rise and attirbuted to novice riders in the main. (I still say increased volume brings about extra danger and perhaps I should get Kriss to post her China film to either mine or Mad Doc's hosting account - showing her ride and her face sho ing some unusual (for her) fear by contrast with her cycling holidays in UK and Europe.)

CTC argues that in reality the numbers have declined for the eigthth year in a row and that child cycling deaths fell bt 20% in reality.

Paul - perhaps you could even argue some parallels when the CTC ask the very same questions and voice similar doubts about the official stats :wink:

Shades of the criticism against Durham in the infamous year when we recorded a massive increase and were still one third lower that average. :roll:

I note CTC say the same as the best guv I ever had in Paul Garvin :wink:

:shock: :shock: :shock: They more or less quote his statement regarding 2002 stats :shock: :?

CTC as quoted by CW on page 20 of this week's edition wrote:

It is important not to take a single year's in isolataion as fluctuations can happen when small numbers are concerned. Snce the mid 90s - the number of cyclists killed or seriously injured has fallen by 37% from 3732 to 2360 per year


Indeed.. I would love it to be less ..

But this does not reflect on speed cams. Durham recorded below average stats again and in which we can take some pride - but we still strive for lower. :wink:

However, I think we do undersestiamte the average Brit driver. Most are decent, caring and courteous and skilled enough. A handful are worrying and a further finger or so could be described as plain dangerous. The truly dangerous are those not legally qualified to drive .. and cams can only detect a registered keeper. :roll: Trafpol can obtain legailty/in of licence /insurance and MOT within seconds. I know we cannot be everywhere - but the right intelligence can direct us to the right result and I will say again - even if you think we take no notice of any report to us because we fail to reply .. please rest assured that we do act on intellligence received by any member of the public and that any formal lack of recognition does not mean we are ignoring the complaints.

please do tell your local police station and do try to give accurate details. We have to cop person in the illegal act and we do lurk once advised in our patch and I thinlk colleagues elsewhere will be on the alert as well

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