Safe Speed Forums

Hello I am new

On Tuesday I had a little collision.

On my way to work The village I pass through has a road that has parked cars all the way down the road until you reach the pub and a few junctions.

The parked cars were on my side of the road, so i understand the rule if there are other cars coming you should wait behind the parked cars to let them past.

Now I decided to overtake the cars as it was clear for me to do so. by the time I had reached the pub and the last few parked cars a little silver car comes straight towards me trying to force his way past, yes it is his right of way but I had overtook all of the cars well before je was in sight I only had two or three cars to pass I slowed down thinking he was going to move over which he had room to do so and be courtious so we could pass each other and we colided wing mirrors.

As I had parked cars at the side of me no where to move or even reverse it would have been dangerous to reverse all the way back up the road. He could clearly see this where was I supposed to go? he also had other cars quite close behind him who were going to follow him.

He then reverses back up the road which i thought was very dangerous to where I had stopped just after the pub and says you cant go crashing into people you were on the wrong side of the road and I had damaged his wing mirror and that it is electric there was no damage to my mirror and a few scuff marks on his.

I said lets exchange details he said it was not worth it he was very arrogant he seemed to be in a hurry.

Yes I was on the wrong side of the road as I had already overtook all of the cars because he wasn't is sight and it was clear for me to go.

Advice please who was is in the wrong

What you've said is all good common sense, but I don't think any of it is law. I don't think it's even law to drive on the left.

From the sounds of things it would have been easier for them to have given way.

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Andrew.

Always exchange details even for a mirror hit. My door mirror cost £450 to replace when it was swiped.

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

Interesting. Driving on the left was introduced as a convention in 1773 and since then our traffic system has developed with the custom of driving on the left embedded. The HC only says you should drive on the left unless otherwise instructed.
So, if you are invloved in a head-on collision (and survive) because you were driving on the right on a normal road where you should be on the left, what do you get done for - because you will won't you! It probably won't be 'for driving on the right', but more like 'dangerous driving'.
But you can't just drive headlong into a situation even though, tehcinically, you may have right of way. In the situation described the oncoming driver was simply being obstructive and it was more reasonable for him to wait than for the OP to reverse back until they found somewhere they could pass each other and the parked cars. As no injury occured in the collision I supposed it wouldn't come down to who was driving illegally, merely a question of the insurance companies establishing any culpability. Priobably end up as a knock for a knock claim.
If someone does get injured in such a situation perhaps the oncoming driver, again acting unreasonably, might get done for DWDCA?

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Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Yes, I think that's what I was trying to say, there seems not to be any specific illegalness to easily say "that was illegal and therefore wrong".

As well as who could have sorted out the situation easiest, the person who was driving the fastest (comparative to the road) might come into it too.

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Andrew.

Found that locally if you drive through the sort of gap mentioned leaving any sort of gap on one side that might tempt one of these "get anywhere in a hurry " merchants to push through -they will and the casualty is usually a wing mirror - regarded by the police (from experience ) as a 50/50 job-but sometimes expensive )
WhaT I have found does stop them in their tracks is to stop in the middle of the road - (being prepared to get out of the way if they don't look like stopping )Then again - you've stopped -they haven't - can only pray that insurance (and police ) take the view that moving vehicle was at fault )

As I've said previously - notice that the practice of pushing on is becoming more prevalent ,and more so with learners ,not stopped by their instructors - is this a by product of the examiners thinking ????

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

To the best of my knowledge the notion that the driver on the clear side of the road has right of way over the driver on the blocked side of the road is an urban myth. If there is one parked car then you are overtaking it, but if there is a continuous row of them then it doesn't matter which side of the road they are on, it simply becomes a narrow road and, like any other single track road it is up to drivers to co-operate to pass each other.

As far as I see it the other driver would be in the wrong here for deliberately driving into a constriction too narrow to pass through, assuming of course that the other car were stationary before he hit them.

As a practical way of learning from this I would echo the advice given above about moving further out, indeed I'd go further: if I don't believe the gap is wide enough for two cars then I'll deliberately occupy a central position whether anything is coming or not. My reasoning for this is:

1. It improves my vision in the case of something emerging from the row of parked cars, as well as giving me more space and time if a car should move out or a pedestrian emerge from between them,
2. It improves the chances of people in the parked cars seeing me, so less likely to pull into my path
3. If someone should come the other way then they are clearly faced with a blocked road, rather than the possibility of making an ill-judged attempt to squeeze through.

In the worst case, if they insist on coming into the gap then you simply stop, still in the middle of the gap. If you do then have to reverse it's much easier if you are further away from the parked cars. And yes, in this situation I would be the one to reverse as (a) it puts me in control of things, and (b) it places me on the moral high ground when the other car eventually passes - by reversing I demonstrate that I wasn't being bolshie by stopping in the middle of the road - and therefore less chance of a road rage incident.

The best case is that the other driver simply waits a moment and you pass on the wider section with a cheery acknowledgement. Either option is infinitely preferable to squeezing past mirror to mirror, probably at speed, placing total trust in the other driver's (already proven bad) judgement, and with absolutely no options left should a pedestrian step out or one of the parked cars start to move off without looking.

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CSCP Latin for beginners...
Ticketo ergo sum : I scam therefore I am!

Thanks JT-something I found out from single track roads,tried out in a van and adapted in my car - only problem is idiot not prepared to stop .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Be careful on this one.
I went to court on what I considered to be a clear case of driving on the wrong side of the road ( Dangerous Driving)- witnesses are the key here- I had none- but an admission and later a statement of events which bore no relevance to the facts.

It is often classed as knock for knock (50/50). My situation was pulled over to the left. Stationary, as this other car clicpped the car in front of me on the mirror; then he went down the side of my car!

The obstruction ( parked vehicles) were on his side and despite the "rules" of the highway code rule 162
162
Before overtaking you should make sure

the road is sufficiently clear ahead
road users are not beginning to overtake you
there is a suitable gap in front of the road user you plan to overtake

and the insurance company protestating that "he couldnt be expected to wait all day"

It was settled on 50/50- I was livid, but learnt a valuable lesson as an IAM biker/car driver- get witnesses

My advice- no witnesses?- leave it

I just looked this up on the Highway Code

give way to oncoming vehicles before passing parked vehicles or other obstructions on your side of the road

I know exactly what you mean though as I travel a road every day that has this problem of parked vehicles. One section of the road they are parked on just one side - further up they are parked on both sides!

I am currently trying to pass my HGV and failed one test due to being taken down a road with cars parked, willy, nilly all over the place (due to a school fete). I stopped to let traffic through, however that meant that traffic was bumper to bumper behind me. A vehicle, having passed me wanted to turn right into an entrance but it was blocked by other traffic and nowhere for them to go. Finally, a vehicle further down the road realised what was happening and flashed his lights for me to proceed, which I did. Then, God there are some real morons on the road, a van, some 4 or 5 cars further back pulled out and came straight for me. All I could do was stop and basically let him sort out the problem. Bear in mind here that I am in a 16 tonne, 14 feet high and 33 feet long rigid vehicle, with cars right up behind me! There were also trees lining this road. No way was I in a position to manouvre anywhere.

The examiner said, on return to the test centre, that just because I am in a bigger vehicle does not mean I can be a bully! I was furious and explained the situation that I could see in my mirror, but which he could not see from the passenger side, but he would not have it. Consequently it will now cost me a further £350 to retake my test as I obviously have to pay for the use of the vehicle for the day!

It has surprised me the number of people who have failed their HGV tests due to bad behaviour and total inconsideration of other road users. It seems that whichever way we handle the situation and whatever the outcome, we cannot win and it is a very expensive test to keep taking!

Anyway, according the Highway Code there is a right and wrong and as the road was clear when you started to overtake the parked traffic you had right of way to finish your manouvre - he was definitely in the wrong!

This to me is a symptom of a system which is over reliant on rules.

If you were walking down a corridor and half of it was blocked (probably in an A&E ward, blocked with patients on trolleys ), would this person have barged past as you were oncoming?

While I am sympathetic to the OP, and believe he was unfortunate to come up against an unyielding prick on this occasion, I have found more and mroe often recently that people seem very poor at judging width, both of their own vehicles and of the gaps they are driving through. There are several roads around the town in which I live which are regularly narrowed by parked vehicles along one side. Almost without exception, these roads are still wide enough to accommodate two vehicles, albeit with reduced clearance. On an increasing number of occasions, I find people more concerned with leaving a massive gap between their nearside and the parked vehicles than between themselves and oncoming traffic! I've yet to hit a wing-mirror, but only because I am able to judge the positions of the corners of my own vehicle, and make the required allowances early for their poor driving.

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Regulation without education merely creates more criminals.

Some great points in the posts above

I would add a little point (I know you said about visual aids), that the 'out' position, when passing the parked vehicles, also helps you to clearly see the drivers and any passengers (all potential hazards).
Also the potential 'feet' (of people), between the parked vehicles, and indicators for the 'about to move' cars, and also from every direction.

I agree too that the 'right' position is to wait, until you believe it to be clear, and I understand fully that you tried to do this. You are then in the psycological scenario. When you get the 'bolchy' driver, you are relying on your previous allowance of this possibility to act. The 'out' position gives you the control and as a first line of 'defense'. The second is to then chose to take control (as is also stated above), but before you do - try to make eye contact, and indicate by hand gesture - perhaps a single hand flat as a 'wait' gesture, and a brief smile, then reverse, may help defuse anyone.
Sometimes this simple 'control' of the road, and your 'space' around you, can emit 'confidence and control' and this can help others to be less 'bolchy', but you have to have an escape route planned - for the rogue driver who insists on testing your skills.

I agree with the stopping point too, as it is generally considered that the stopped driver may be a 'hazard' but by not moving you are inviting another to work around you, so if 'hit' they are more likely to be in error. However it leaves them moving about you, which does happen tons of times on the roads, and does work, but of course it needs everyone to drive very carefully, keep glancing eye contact helps keep you informed and the situation/s diffused.

The story of the prosecution without witnesses is interesting.
With the car hit down the side too, I would have thought that the car 'standing still', would have had a better chance of proving innocence - or less blame, but better skills and better controls, help prevent the incident one hopes - hence the post of course !
I call the control of the road, and your pace, 'stance' and that can give you an 'edge' in many areas of driving, but it is subtle.
For example someone creeping along maybe safe but tells the impatient driver waiting that he may be able to pass if they 'go for it', so they do. But by being out, go with care and progress and look to the driver waiting. Because you have shown control, they tend to wait in these circumstances as you took control in the first place.
This could also lead us down the 'depends on what you are driving' too but whilst true to a degree it is not totally true

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

[quote][he said it was not worth it he was very arrogant he seemed to be in a hurry./quote]

Sounds more likely he knew he was in the wrong!

Do folks on here really believe that the OP should have reversed the whole length of the road? I'd have sat there until t'other bugger reversed or until Hell froze over, whichever came first!

[quote="Oscar
Do folks on here really believe that the OP should have reversed the whole length of the road? I'd have sat there until t'other bugger reversed or until Hell froze over, whichever came first! [/quote]


Donethat too - b ut what seems to work is to phone cops (or pretend to )--suspected DD / no licence etc - fact that you're prepared to go that far gets them deciding that they can reverse a little bit .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

I was once in a similar situation, many years ago.

I had passed about 20 cars on "my" side of the road when Mr I. M. More-Important came the other way.

I had just picked up a pizza from the local takeaway, so I opened up the box and made sure he could see me starting to tuck in. Funny how quick he changed his mind about who had right of way.

Wouldn't happen these days of course, can't be seen eating something as unhealthy as pizza in public, might have the health gestapo round.

Most people fall foul of the eagerness of both insurers and even cops to brush it aside as 50/50. Most crashes anywhere anytime are not 50/50 in blame but it saves police a lot of work if involved and it saves insurers a packet. if you are brave enough to challenge it in court, you need good witnesses and scientific evidence to make any headway as to apportion blame accurately. having said that the situation you speak of is common, it is acknowledged that we drive on the left, by overtaking parked vehs you are changing position and driving partially on the oposite side of the road, like any overtake you then take a great deal of responsibility for your action, if during your overtake of a stream of parked vehs you then become confronted with oncomming veh you must take every action possible to avoid a collision including stopping if ness.The oncomming veh has a responsibility also and as we all do to drive safely and defensively in accordance with HC and the law in a manner not likely to cause a danger to others and we should be able to stop safely or avoid under control in any situation. If you did everything you could after commiting to the overtake that falls into that description and you could PROVE IT, you would have a good case. the only time Ive ever seen correct aportioning of blame is after serious crashes or fatalities(but not every time), the rest are usually luck of the draw.So unless you wish to fight in court in a civil case or fight your insurers, I should just accept it and move on.

Come to sunny Redcar! All the local chavs do it without being troubled by anyone!

[quote="Oscar
Come to sunny Redcar! All the local chavs do it without being troubled by anyone! [/quote]
Last time I was in Redcar - you could buy any sort of fish /shelfish straight of the beach (and that last lobster was nice - and to correct any readers -yes -they are blue when alive )

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

I have just joined SS after reading this discussion about passing parked cars. I am amazed at the amount of good advice, especially from JT. I am 56 and have been driving for 29 years but you can never stop learning