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 Post subject: Cycle-awareness Training
PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 08:49 
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A good thing? Or is it the cyclists who should have awareness training?

http://lcc.org.uk/articles/no-more-lethal-lorries-campaign-ensures-thousands-more-london-hgv-drivers-more-likely-to-receive-cycle-training

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 10:31 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
A good thing? Or is it the cyclists who should have awareness training?

Why not Both!
IMO: from what I've seen with my own eyes, perhaps the latter more than the former.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 13:31 
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Both.

Most (if not all) road user groups would benefit from additional training if it's the right kind.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 15:40 
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Johnnytheboy wrote:
Both. Most (if not all) road user groups would benefit from additional training if it's the right kind.


Easier to set a truck driver to ride a bike than a cyclist to drive a truck though :D

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 22:55 
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Both. It is all very well training lorry drivers to be aware of cyclists (a good thing, imo), but cyclists can be suicidal and devoid of any of the basic survival skills that are necessary for all road users especially the most vulnerable. Cylists imo a lot of the time will not check before they change direction. So if an obsticle (parked car, for instance) is in their way they will just swing out into the road without checking and expect all the other road users to make way for them. Doesn't really help how well trained the lorry drivers are if a lemming on a pushbike swing out in front of him. Training cyclists or at least offering a course to those wishing to test their skills, learn and stay alive would be a good idea as far as I am concerned. I have pulled cyclists over myself and very politely (a rarity for me) explained the life saving virtues of the shoulder check to those who have decided they have no need to demonstrate any rear observations before changing direction. Having pushbiked it the last couple of days on busy roads - it is a nightmare. Your life is to a greater degree than other modes of transport in the hands of others and cars like to pass close! That is no excuse for leaving your life entirely in the hands of other motorists and expecting them to have looked out for you and psychically know what you are going to do next.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 07:47 
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Lorry Driver: requires training, testing and licensing; is generally experienced; job depends on avoiding incidents on the road.

Cyclist: no training required; may be young and inexperienced; couldn't give a damn for rules of ther road.

So, which one do you think most needs the training?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 12:29 
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Lorry Driver: job depends on avoiding incidents on the road.
Cyclist: life depends on avoiding incidents on road. :x

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 12:39 
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As someone who has thousands of miles cycling on the roads, in the past, I was a time trial rider in the 50's, yes that is 50's, have a best time for a 25ml time trial of 57.10, I find the cyclists of today arrogant and ignorant of the basic rules of the road.

The majority of cyclists ignore the rules of the road and have no consideretion for any other road users

Yet they pay no road tax, have no insurance and very little , if any, training.

The worst are not children but the older eco friendly ones, a lot who believe that motorists are non green people who spead evil fumes around the roads

I believe any cyclist, over the age of 16, should be made to carry third party insurance and helmet wearing made compulsery

They should also be prosecuted if they do not obey the traffic rules, ie One way street, no riding on the pavement, stop sign, traffic lights etc.

If cyclists want to be respected then they must earn that respect


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 13:34 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
Lorry Driver: job depends on avoiding incidents on the road.
Cyclist: life depends on avoiding incidents on road. :x

Yes, clearly it's the cyclists who have the imperative to be trained.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 21:27 
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timtjf wrote:
As someone who has thousands of miles cycling on the roads, in the past, I was a time trial rider in the 50's, yes that is 50's, have a best time for a 25ml time trial of 57.10, I find the cyclists of today arrogant and ignorant of the basic rules of the road.


I come from a similar background though I must be a little younger than you. I road TTs in the 60's though I never broke the hour for a 25.
The main difference between then and now is that in those far off times most cyclists came to the sport through a cycling club where we learned cycle craft, discipline, etiquette and respect for other road users from the older members of the club, particularly the Captain. New cyclists these days read the mags buy a bike and think they know it tall, though their ignorance of the subtleties of the craft can be profound.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 14:08 
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Cross-training helps to provide a useful alternative experience perspective, not otherwise obtained without (usually) time and cost investment.

I agree that the rules have become serious;y dis-respected and inconsiderate attitudes leading to fear, generating encouragement to segregrated road users for 'safety'.
All typically un-necessary if proper consideration and care is taken and given as required.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 16:10 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
timtjf wrote:
As someone who has thousands of miles cycling on the roads, in the past, I was a time trial rider in the 50's, yes that is 50's, have a best time for a 25ml time trial of 57.10, I find the cyclists of today arrogant and ignorant of the basic rules of the road.


I come from a similar background though I must be a little younger than you. I road TTs in the 60's though I never broke the hour for a 25.
The main difference between then and now is that in those far off times most cyclists came to the sport through a cycling club where we learned cycle craft, discipline, etiquette and respect for other road users from the older members of the club, particularly the Captain. New cyclists these days read the mags buy a bike and think they know it tall, though their ignorance of the subtleties of the craft can be profound.


It was 1959 on the old S1 course, no wind on the way out but as I turned a tail wind arrived so I decided to go for it.The last few mls were on adrenaline and sheer will power, but it was a course record at the time.

This as back in the days of a campag 10 and tubs


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 12:24 
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dcbwhaley wrote:
Lorry Driver: job depends on avoiding incidents on the road.
Cyclist: life depends on avoiding incidents on road. :x


Why is it then that a few individuals seem to seek out danger then immerse themselves in it?

I was cursed loudly by another cyclist last month, because I was apparently in his way on a bend as he hurtled down a hill on a narrow path.
I was cycling towards the setting sun, and was struggling to see anything not just in front of my bike - however he seemed oblivious of any potential difficulty on my part, and determined not to take any avoiding action such as covering the brakes!

Unfortunately, because of the sun, I would not be able to identify him if our paths should cross again, otherwise we would be having words, as part of his training regime!!!

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 12:42 
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Ernest Marsh wrote:
dcbwhaley wrote:
Lorry Driver: job depends on avoiding incidents on the road.
Cyclist: life depends on avoiding incidents on road. :x


Why is it then that a few individuals seem to seek out danger then immerse themselves in it?


For the same reason that other people engage in other dangerous sports - they get an adrenaline buzz out of it. And after surving a few expeditions they become convinced that they are invulnerable. Then they die. See it a lot in modern high altitude mountaineering.

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