Safe Speed Forums

Not half as much as it worries me, setting up for a nice left-hander and all of a sudden there's an oncoming 4x4 half on my side of the road!
Bottyburp- definitely do the Bikesafe day!

I would agree - except I have seen a Capri hit the wall at an acute angle, and the rear passengers ended up with a lap full of rocks which came through the side window.
The speed at impact was high, but seatbelts prevented what might otherwise have been a tragedy.

Armco at the same angle would have sent the vehicle along or back out into the road and not reduced the forward momentum in the same way.

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

Many years ago, a friend in deepest rural Somerset advised me:

"If you've got a choice between hitting a brick wall or hitting a tree- aim for the wall!"
Of course, if it's a BIG wall and a little tree that may not be the case, but in general terms I reckon he was right (in a car, anyhow; can't see it would make much difference on a bike, you're dead either way.)

I have seen this from the pointy end and its scary. Say you have to dip left to avoid said motorist, you then find what would have been an easy sweeper becoming tight and its like you turned in far to early, half way through the bend you are pointing at a wall and having to make a tighter turn than you intended.

One of the strengths of a bike is the way any given corner on a two way road can be considered 2M+ less tight, in terms of radius, on a bike if you use the full width of the road but it can really suck you in.

The left hand bend thing is most definately true, now don't get me wrong I still believe that "most" left hander bike accidents are down to the biker but I also believe that "many" of them are down to an approaching driver cutting the corner and some are down to other factors such as road surface.

A few true personal stories to make the point:

I am only still here because of luck; I had been back on a bike for just a few months and completly arsed up a left hander, well actually I was probably in really good shape but it was the first time the pegs had ever touched down and that made me jump, I backed off the throttle stood the bike up a bit and ran wide. My fault, definately down to my innappropriate speed but more for my own ability than the conditions. I was lucky nothing was coming the other way.

Three months later I was burying a friend who ran wide on a bend and wasn't so lucky.

Mrs Patch had just passed her bike test and we were out for our first ride together. Now what you must understand is that although Mrs patch rides an 800cc motorcycle she genuinely does not speed, she rides for her enjoyment and this is achieved at speeds well below the limit (actually well below my level of enjoyment). She also does not take an advanced for view line and whilst taking a left hander in her usual riding in the gutter position, with me following yelling at her in my helmet to pull out a bit so she could see, a truck came around the bend well over halfway across her lane. Now you could argue he'd have seen her if she'd been better placed but I was there and she'd have been scraping me off his radiator if I'd ben in fornt that day.

Just two months ago I was on my regular commute, it was early and although the raods were dry they had been gritted and I was well aware of the question of grip this winter as has been reported on these forums. I was on a left hander well within the safe speed and the front wheel lost all traction. I saved the slide but only by running well wide. I regained control got back on my side of the road just before I became a bonnet ornament. I went back and checked the road I can offer no explaination for the slide, there was no visible reason for the loss of grip. I have taken that bend a zillion times before and a few hundred times since all without incident.

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Former Military Police Officer and accident investigator

Don't knock it - it's an excellent excuse to operate closer to the racing line. You know you want to.

[just for complete clarity - I am joking - well 90% joking - I think]

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Now let's see what could be done to reduce some of those accidents:

1. Better road layouts. Some dangerous bends and junctions seemed to appear as a cause of an "unseen vehicle".

2. Regular re-testing, particularly of elderly drivers.

3. Clamp down on drunken driving. I'd like to see longer bans for those over the limit (particularly if over the limit by more than a certain margin). The problem is of course that the road is policed by cameras and they can't breathalyse.

4. New drivers: difficult to know how to handle the urge to take a risk. Speed delimiters aren't really the solution because they would have to adapt to the situation. (Even if set to say 60mph it would not stop the driver using that speed in town).

5. Driver hours: Taxis and minicabs should have similar driver hour restrictions as bus and lorry drivers. At present they have none, and in fact it can be worse because they are paid by the job so there is a tendency to want to drive more hours. Other professions that involve a lot of driving should have restrictions.