Safe Speed Forums

You think? Most everyone I meet (and I'm not talking about on Safe Speed business) has a grumble over speed cameras.

The real problem seems to be that you can't harness grumble.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

In an other thread I referd to "Pournell Axis" (Google it) And yes, indeed, all the major parties *are* all the same!

The only way you are going to have any possibility of change is to vote for somebody who is occupying a different area of the box (IYSWIM)

Of course this got on to a debate on the pros and cons of the BNP but the big point is this.

Staying at home and not voting is *not* an option. *they* just LOVE opponants who stay at home!

You hate them all, they *know* you hate them all but they dont give a Flying Fcuk what you think because they know you are not going to do a damn thing about it! Abstention is a positive vote for the system you hate!

As for the reasons for My "Sig"

The first tranche of legislation brought in when the NAZI's took controll of Germany were H&S laws and Gun controll.

Hitler had attempted a Coup some years earlier and wanted to dis-arm the people to prevent the same happening to him! Also H&S legislation can be used to impose an ever increacing amount of controll over the people in a way that is very dificult to object too (How can you object to laws that are (Puportedly) meant to make people safer!)


Ring any bells?!?

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"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

They'd have a bigger grumble if Big Brother suddenly disappeared before their eyes



Can you channel it perhaps?

Bloody good question!

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Bloody great alarm bells, some of the worst workplaces I have the misfortune to see outside the construction industry are local authorities. And the guise of EHO's they are suppossed to be part of H&S enforcement, they would do well to lead by example !!

I have seen a lot of things banned under the H&S banner that make no sense and have no safety standing. I do safety for an amatuer drama group and a community theatre company, and it is great fun when the local District Council try to ban some thing (allegedly) on safety grounds and I throw back at them as bullshit. Of the five I deal with on a regular basis I'm more qalified than all of them and two have no qual at all.

Arrgh yes council baiting always fun....

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Gordon Brown saying I got the country into it's current economic mess so I'll get us out of it is the same as Bomber Harris nipping over to Dresden and offering to repair a few windows.

Chaos, panic and disorder - my work here is done.

http://www.wildcrafts.co.uk

Rest assured the government is quite capable of mucking things up by itself and then blaming the likes of EDS when years of indecision and micro-management don't get the results they want.

It's the same problem everywhere - a government that won't let individuals, or their own contractors, do what they're best at without interference in the tiniest aspects of their lives.

I was brought up in a time when people used the phrase "Why not, it's a free country?". Well, it isn't a free country anymore.

Personally, I blame Thatcher and her alter ego Blairoman

We once had a guy with a lorry pull one down in Carlisle a bit back.

I recall story at the time. He received NIP und returned to "scene of his most heinous crime of century - driving past a cam on emptiest road at 6 mph above the lolly"

Ist broad daylight! Traffic around .. He lassoes the Gatso und then revs up to max power .. und Gatso resemble leaning tower of Pisa...

Only.. he does this in front of everyone - including a policeman und a CCTV cam which ist guarding this scamera. Und he ended up in court .... I think he got whopping fine for "vandalism"

Was circa 2003 as I recall when this occurred.

Sadly - sub-marinated one mended the scamera und ist still there....

Of course - there ist always manure und sugar und... Ist good job the Swiss are good little boys really

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Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

Not so long ago - we had excellent series on BBC ...

"NIGHTMARE POLITICS"

Und it was about how you control by fear. Hitler formed the model ... His legislation und control was all about instilling a fear into the minds of people.

The Bolshevik to the East.. The Jew with the power of money .. academic race....financial whizzes... perceived as "controlling the banks und blamed for the recession" which crippled USA und Europe following the Wall Street Collapse und General Strikes of the 20s/early 30s. You blame someone.. you feed that paranoia .. you scare into submission und blind obedience.

Model continues .. Cold War.. Reds under the Beds...but then Communism topples. People in Leipzig rumbled this control by fear und threats of constant arrest und disappearance for simplest comment from "cost of bread has gone up.. tut .. to Honecker ist a fool" (I lived there for a few months... was not a pleasant atmosphere.)

But - this fall of Berlin Wall und end of Cold War.. this ist a real nightmare to the West. For instance - economy built on Arms Racing..at the time...(Enviro-brigade (Greenpeace ) were not just tree hugging at Twyford bye-pass or wherever... - they were pitched at Greenham Common und so on at the time) .

You could see the colour drain from politicians of the day.. no "menace to instil fear und build policies on"

So what do you replace it with? You have to make people terrified of doing anything und questionning..

Ach! Of course!

Walking in the countryside... soo-ooH dangerous - what if they hit by branch or something. Well - we got to legislate und insist on Risk Assessment und insurance....

That swing in play park which has been on that old oak tree since before Good Queen Bess (Tudor) was in nappies .. no known accidents recorded - but now far too dangerous und so we cut down part of British history und custom/

Conkers? Tsssk! Way to dangerous. Won't someone please think of the conkers....

Riding a bicycle ... well - those campaigning for their use keep saying that this ist really ever so dangerous because people drive at the speed limit on the fast roads they want to ride on..

...so we reduce the speed limit on these busy roads.. put up a forest of scameras ... und still have accidents because these roads are busy und people are driving with one eye on dash und one looking out for the scam.

So-oh busy making people scared of their own shadow that they fail to realise that the human being survived only because of the desire to learn more.. und that this exploratory spirit developed an instinct for self -preservation und avoidance of danger.

I hope they repeat the series. It was one of the BBC's finest hours.

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

WildCat, I agree with most of that.

Unfortunately, the rapidly expanding legal "profession" has to do something to justify their existence. Hence prosecutions on "health and safety" grounds when a kid falls off a swing, etc.etc.

Personally, I distrust anything that comes from "government" sources. We need more folks like Paul Smith to debunk the rubbish coming from Govt., and Paul & Co need more media attention!

Sorry for dragging up an old thread, but it's the first time I've been back since I posted my original reply.

CLIMATE CHANGE

....to the extent that it is happening (!) is mostly being caused by industrial activity generally, rather than road vehicles, and what about the huge amount of air travel now, and the destruction of the rain forests etc.?

There must be quite a few aspects to this - it's not all my fault.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

There are things we can do, quite legally, too!

It's limited by factors such as time or money, but we can start off by not simply rolling over and filling in the S172 form every time the local scammers send us a NIP. If a substatial majority of us made the SCPs take us to court, the system would grind to a complete halt. It does cost a little more, potentially, but what I am learning from here, Pepipoo, and my own personal experience is that, quite often, the SCP or CPS will cock up like they did in my case, and you end up avoiding conviction altogether. OK, maybe the odds aren't that brilliant, but I think it's worth a go, especially if it's also striking a bit of a blow against the system.

Reading that Clarkson article, they struggle to make a profit on the whole thing: it wouldn't take much of a concerted effort to reduce that profitability even more - my guess is that my case cost them £1-2k, which represents a lot of tickets, especially if their profit margin on each ticket is only about 20% (on Clarkson's figures) - by my calculation, they'll have to write about 83 tickets for every £1k court cases cost them to recover that loss. OK, so that's probably only a morning's work for one camera van, but the principle remains. And if more of us took cases all the way (or at least part of the way - the bigger the admin burden on the SCP, the less profitable they are, and the more likely they are to cock things up to our advantage), then they'd struggle ever to show a profit, and 5 years down the line we'll have MPs asking Questions In The House about why we're paying out millions for a speed enforcement regime that isn't making the govt any money OR saving lives (I suspect the fact that it clearly isn't saving lives is conveniently forgotten in the light of the profitability angle).

Well, that's my take on it, anyway...

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For your comfort and convenience, please stop reading now.

Well, if your calculations are correct then 83 would be the magic number. If 1 in every 83 people fought their NIP in court then the system would fall apart.

Quite probably it is none of your fault. Climate change is, as CE suggests, another bogeyman the politicians are using to srighten us.
Climate change has always happened. A warming trend has been going on for the last 18,000 years, ever since the depths of the last ice age. Most of this warming took place long before motor cars or heavy industry, and must have had entirely natural causes.
But about 150 years ago, we are told, the cause of this warming suddenly changed, and now it is the evil motorist who is to blame.
ATM, according to climatologists at East Anglia University, there has been no global climatic warming since 1998. According to the greenhouse gas theory of global warming this should no have happened.
An alternative climate change theory, based on variations in the energy output of the sun, seems to fit the facts much better, and can explain known hostoric global temperature fluctuations much more accurately that the greenhouse theory. This also predicts major cooling in the next few years.
I read a paper the other day that claims that the upper part of our oceans, after many years of warming has been cooling since 2003.
Needles to say this research is not widely reported in the mdia, and is ignored by the Global Warming industry and governments who want to keep us frightened, and willing to pay then extra taxes and give them extra control, for as long as possible. But if this theory is correct, it cannot be too long before the chickens come home to roost.
So they carry on with Kyoto, causing damage to the world economy for the sake of a possible 0.1 degree reduction in global temperature in 100 years time!
Sorry this it OT, but I had to say it.