Safe Speed Forums

According to the Police these are becoming more common. You know the ones, HGV "loses" the car to the right in the blind spot all LHD HGV's have pulls out and turns the car into a Banana. My Sons teacher had it happen to him last thursday. The Police believe this is due to more LHD HGV's on the Motorway. Could the fact that most drivers now cruise up alongside at 70 be another factor? The driver of the car now will not go over 70 and the "time at risk" is increased especially with any other overtaking vehicles alongside doing exactly the same? If it is (and I have seen many examples) then its another triumph for this Governments Tax policy.

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Life in the Air Age isn't all the Brochures Say...

I'm not too sure , but I'm more inclined to switch my lights on to pass a foreign plated HGV before passing, in the interests of being seen more clearly.

I'm also more inclined to check whether any up coming bridge has scameras attached to it, too.

Tiff Needell demonstrated just this type of incident and the resulting carnage just a few weeks ago on 5th Gear.
The intelligent VB-H declined to drive the car and demanded that it be radio controlled.

This type of accident IS becoming more common, as was quite rightly said, by the increase of left hookers coming into the country.

Do, please, make your way smartly past these guys, it is so easy to dissapear out of their vision.
You may have noticed that a number of left hookers now have an extra mirror fitted on their blind side, this is to try and alleviate the obvious problems.

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Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.

I drive up and down the M1 every day. More and more often I see trucks with Eastern European countries on our roads.

I wonder what the driving standards are like in those countries...

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Speed camera policy Kills

Yes. I keep hearing about these crashes too.

Assuming we're the passing vehicle, the general advice we need to stay out of danger is:

* Be aware of other's blind spots and stay out of them when possible.

* When you do have to pass through someone else's blind spot, plan your move and clear the blind spot as fast as safely possible.

* If you are in someone else's blind spot, watch them for any early indictions of a move in your direction and be ready with the horn. The lights won't help if they can't see you!

* In "quiet enough" circumstances, leave a full free lane when passing L1 vehicles (i.e. pass in L3) if you can do so without obstructing anyone else.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Poland entering the EU, created a big in flux, as they can now complete UK trunking, only leaving the UK to take a load out & refill their long range tanks with cheap diesal.

UK transport companies cannot compete, as EU drivers have:

Cheap Fuel

Cheap Road Tax

Cheap Insurance

This is seeing a number of UK based transport companies going to the wall.

However UK based companies that run International routes, will purchase Left hookers, as they spend so much time abroad.

There is no real differance to the blind spots, the only improvement to be had from R Hooker is if the driver takes a look over his shoulder with the window open, which really is not going to happen on the m/way at 56 mph.

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Steve

I had an accident as described in the first post. 15 Apr 2002. LH drive italian. A50 (Dual carriageway) approaching Stoke. LH lane predominantly filled with trucks (funnily enough doing 56 MPH) L2 busy, travelling at about 60 - 65. It was wet but little spray and visibilty was good. I was keeping a good distance from the car in front, probably 3 or 4 seconds. Almost passed the truck when he moved out without warning, in fact so far passed were we that I didn't even see him move. The first I knew was the whack which sent us sideways into a slide; witness marks on the car showed a dent above the rear wheel arch (Volvo 240 estate.) Imagine my horror as we are sliding sideways to look past my wife in the passenger seat to see the truck bearing down on us. I screemed and was convinced we were about to be crushed. Fortunately the wet road allowed us to slide, the truck hit us again but only lightly. We finished up backwards against the nearside armco.

Thoughts:

1. Yes passing speed is an issue but that is difficult when the surrounding traffic dictates your speed. I have learnt from it though, and not only spot foreign trucks a mile off but will also hang back slightly and then pass quickly.

2. Volvo 240's are a great car to have an accident in, needed a new wheel and tyre where it mounted the kerb other than that it was driveable.

3. One of the few journeys have ever done where the kids weren't in the car.

4. I had taken over the driving from my wife only five miles earlier, it would have terminally affected her confidence (even more than it has) had she been driving.

5. Insurance takes for ever to cough up.

6. You still keep having to mention it at renewal time even though it's non fault.

Max

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Tailgaters - Please Pass
You have an Accident to go to!

It is the maximum speed of any truck (LGV)

Your hitting position is bang on the blind spot, where your vehicle is just passing the cab.

See a similar accident only 2 weeks ago, Right hooker though. Came through contra flow, truck in lane 2 at 40 mph (as reduced limit). As teh truck exited the contra flow, it moved over to lane 1 to regain normal driving mode. A car which had exited the contraflow at the same time, could not be seen, as the boot was level with the cab.

Even if the the truck driver looked in the mirror's, their would of been no way of seeing the car.

However if the car driver had responded to the speed & lane change, the car would of been out of harms way.


The Car ended up being spun around the front of the cab, facing the wrong way, in the lane beside me, could of been very nasty

Their really should be more awareness made to car drivers, of the blind spots on trucks.

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Steve

Artificially created by governors. The actual legal limit is 60 is it not.

Agreed on the blind spot issue. I would question the observation skills of the LGV driver though. The car didn't just appear there, it must have either slowed to that position or accelerated into that position. At some stage it will have been in the LGV driver's view. The mirrors on trucks are poor though and require (I imagine) an increased level of awareness to avoid such accidents. So many times we find ouselves beside a truck at similar speed to them and have to rely heavily on them knowing we are there.

Max

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Tailgaters - Please Pass
You have an Accident to go to!

The actual speed limit for a HGV Is 60mph, limited down to 56mph, but on the A50, the speed limit for a HGV is 50mph, not 56 or 60mph.
However, I really don't think the 6mph difference would have meant much.
The problem that does exist, is that foriegn trucks, even if gatso'd will not get done, it is too expensive, time consuming, and just plain not worth while.
The police cannot fine on the spot, I believe there may well be a change in this in the near future.
Yet, in France, if you get pulled for speeding, not only do you get fined, but you will also get the points on your licence from this country, yet French drivers in this country get away scot free.
Theres community spirit for you.

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Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.

Ah 50MPH, I didn't realise that the limit for trucks on a dual carriageway was 50. But like you say wouldn't have made much difference. Do trucks get done for doing 56 in a 50? Because as we all know the two position throttle doesn't stop at 50

I agree on the discreapncy between here and the continent, needs addressing.

Max

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Tailgaters - Please Pass
You have an Accident to go to!

...and foreign trucks don't have limiters!

Yes, they do, quite often.
The A1 in Northumberland is 60mph for cars and 40mph for Trucks, it used to be that the Police would turn a blind eye to trucks doing 50mph, but now that they have a scamera pratnership, they get done over 40mph.
It has done wonderful things for road safety and congestion, by increasing it.
I would be interested to see the accident stats of before and after the scameras.

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Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.

Oh yes they do, its just that they don't seem to work in the UK, same with the irish racing trucks.
I had 2 overtake me on the M6 just north of Brum, doing 65-70mph in lane three.

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Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.

Actually there's quite a big difference. As the mirror is moved further from your eye the field of view in the mirror narrows. Since the nearside mirror on a RHD truck may well be 3 or 4 times the offside mirror distance from the driver's eye, the difference can be quite marked. Obviously we can compensate for this effect with a suitably convex mirror - up to point. We're frequently using similarly convex mirrors on both sides of vehicles to extend the field of view, and now we're back to where we started - the far side convex mirror sees less than the near convex morror.

Then there's the side window view. The angle between the driver's eye and the lower edge of the side window is much steeper on the near window.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

In the Highway code, it is 60 MPH

All trucks are legally required to be limited to 56 mph

It is more a fact of conflict of laws.

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Steve

It is not as big as you think, i get the exact same view of anything behind the mirrors on both sides. I have more dash as an obstacle on the passenger side, which is the only differance.

My right side pillar, blocks out alot more of the road directley in front my mirrors than you think

Then their is the stupid manner in which car drivers manouvre about trucks. They accelerate hard and cut across, if we are checking mirrors before checking the view of where the car comes from, we just do not have enough time.

Today, i was making a delivery to a residential address, which was a dead end OFF a busy, main road.

So i have to reverse off a busy road, 65 yards before arriving at the junction , put the hazards on, place my truck in the middle of both ways of traffic, which should be a pretty good indication to other road users.

You know, BIG truck blocking both ways of traffic, hazards flashing, i personally would think it was time for me to stop, and wait for the truck to complete it's manouvre.

Anyway, just started reversing, and hey presto, up roars a woman who thinks she can get up my nearside, I only just see her exiting my blindspot, and stopped just before i put 40 T on top of her little car.

A majority of car drivers need to wake up, and certainley we should have some mandatory LGV awareness put in the theory test.

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Steve