Safe Speed Forums

This has a due date of 18th Feb. Just a reminder if you want to fill in the online questionnaire then it's here:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/groups/dft_rdsafety/documents/page/dft_rdsafety_032879.hcsp

Yep. I've been working on a Safe Speed reply over the weekend.

The nature of the reply does NOT make it an easy clone job and I'm trying to figure out how to offer you guys a reply template.

I'm on it. You should see something tomorrow or Wednesday at the latest.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

I was just going to say something on the lines that the 85% method has worked for many years but councils have been ignoring it for their own ends. If you set limits unnaturally low then they are ignored so it is best to set them according to what feels right. People need to realise that a posted limit should be too fast for the conditions unless it is completely dry and there are no hazards around, otherwise you should not be driving that quickly. At the moment limits are being set for wet weather and arsehole drivers and it is not helping!

I was also going to say the limit should depend on the enforcement strategy. If it is going to be limit + 1 = firing squad then limits must be substantially higher than they are now eg all buillt up areas are 40, nsl is 80 and motorway = 100 so people aren't spending their entire time watching the speedo and can travel along at a safespeed that doesn't hold them up and gives them an indication of hazard density.

I was also going to suggest that perhaps there should be a standard that is stuck to and councils should not have the power to vary as they are getting money from ratcheting down limits.

1) road less than x metres wide, house density over y then limit = 30
2) house density y-a or road over x + b wide then limit = 40
3) urban dual carriageway 50 or 40 if high housing density or narrow roads
4) all other non dual roads 70
5) dual carriageway 80 if few slip roads or no cross overs otherwise 70 as now.
6) motorway 90 or 70 in the wet

I was also going to mention roads were completely derestricted in the 60s when most cars had drum brakes so I find it hard to believe that in these modern times limits should be lowered so much on good roads eg this stupid idea of making A roads 50. The only reason journey times won't be affected much is that everyone is stuck behind HGVs doing 40. I had the feeling they would be using that enforcement to justify further ratcheting down of limits.

I am also beginning to change my mind and think that having those long braking distances on the back of the highway code is bringing some of the limits into disrepute as people naturally feel that modern cars can travel faster, more safely so the limits should be higher and braking distances shorter. I'd suggest a 1996 fiesta, a vauxhall vectra 2000 & a land rover discovery 2000 as the 3 vehicles they should have on the back as a guide not an old anglia or whatever!

Alternatively have built up areas as 30 and everywhere else as 80 and pick off the morons

A particular problem is that the proposals are built upon false research.

It's the "one mph lie" see http://www.safespeed.org.uk/lie.html

A layer on top of the one mph lie is TRL PPR025. (discussed nearby somewhere).

The proposed document is yet another layer on top of PPR025.

It's the foundations that are broken, and we MUST find a way of pointing this out. I'm looking at options.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

The ABD have just published their official response to this consultation which can be seen at:

http://www.abd.org.uk/speed_limit_consultation.htm

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

I've sent off my response this morning.

You can read a copy here

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

I wonder if they have got confused with the mean speed and median speed? Setting the limit at what the most numbers of drivers choose isn't as daft as choosing the mean speed.

But again it takes no account of HGVs artificially lowering the limits.

Perhaps we should all stand for local councils and get the PC chumps out that want to set speed limits so low in the first place? I wonder how many get backhanders from SCPs for setting a limit way too low on a nice clear straight stretch Has anyone actually looked into these vested interests and connections between councils & SCPs?