Safe Speed Forums

In the news today is the suggestion that the Government want to allow civil servants (without any recourse to courts) to suspend the driving licence or passport of people who default on child support payments. This is pretty typical of current thinking to bypass the court system which is thought to "let people off".

The Government have arrived at this point by passing lots of new laws which people ignore as they are perceived as pointless. This may be similar to the anti-speed camera argument that justice is brought into disrepute by criminalising people for perfectly safe and normal behaviour.

In a desperate attempt to "control" the public they introduce administrative justice. It just proves to me that the decline in educational standards has finally bankrupted the intelligence of the people who supposedly run the country.

Don't they see that removing someone's driving licence does not stop them driving - it just makes them drive without one. Suppose someone struggling to pay child maintenance loses their job because they no longer have a licence. How does this make them pay up?

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

Typical of this government......"Er let's see now, something seems to be wrong with the country. We've got a credit crunch/reccession, high energy prices, people losing their jobs, obesity, etc.,etc.... Who'se fault is all this......of course, the motorist!!!"

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Driving licences can already be revoked without recourse to courts.
All they are doing is expanding the range of reasons for revocation.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

if you need a car for work and arn't paying your child support, how is not being able to get to work going to improve the situation? She might be a bitch and not deserve to get the child support

Tut, tut. I carefully worded my original post to be non-sexist.

Yes, I know that the sanction of revoking a driving licence is already a possible penalty for some non-motoring offences. This was daft when it was brought in and is just as daft now although I was under the impression that this penalty could only be imposed by a court.

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

It just kind of underlines the ridiculous notion our leaders have that driving is nothing more than a privilege, therefore a licence can be revoked as a punishment.

And of course, as you revoke driving licences in circumstance likely to be viewed as unjust the affected's view of the "necessity" of a licence, and of the law system wholesale will be further eroded.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

Upon being informed by a doctor (etc) that the person has an illness (either physical or mental) the dvla can revoke the licence. The new drivers act means that any new driver getting 6 points within two years of passing their test will have their licences revoked (not by the court).
LGV drivers can have their LGV licence revoked for various reasons, such as convictions for driver's hours, vehicle roadworthiness or loading.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

All the things which you list are characterised by being driving related.

- Physical or mental inability
- Points on license
- Roadworthiness

Failure to pay maintenance is not and thus falls into a different category.

I was under the impression that revocation of a licence for non-driving or non-vehicle related offences must be undertaken by a court. Is this not so?

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

What, your daugher?

This is a subject very close to my heart weepej: -

When I was taken to the cleaners by this country back in 1997, I was working myself into an early grave to support myself and help my daughter.

I worked my way into a job as Works Manager for a small company, often putting in 60+ hours a week. I had always had a tacit agreement whereby I paid my 'ex' cash in hand every week when I picked my daughter up on Saturday mornings.

At the time, my ex was getting £30 a week in benefit for two children, (only one was mine). After the CSA got involved, thanks to my lovely ex, eventually I had to ask my boss to let me go because I couldn't afford to work for him anymore. I was served a ‘deductions at earnings’ order for £78 per week.

Where was the £48 per week going and the £3000 they wanted in a lump sum do you suppose?

I was working for nothing and that is not an exaggeration! I couldn’t afford to keep my dilapidated old car to pick up my daughter at the weekends, or treat her like I always had. My ex wasn't getting a penny more than she ever had but now the Gov was getting richer while pushing the notion that all these errant fathers were suddenly being brought to justice.

Depressed and disillusioned with MY COUNTRY I left to go to America where I continued to transfer money back to a malicious ex wife taking advantage of a bent government hell-bent on getting money from whoever they could!

Some fathers even committed suicide during that dreadful and iniquitous time, but I don't expect many would remember that period if it didn't affect you or someone close to you It was supposed to get errant fathers. What bollocks!!! They found the honest while the errant remained just that...

Leaving my family behind was one of the hardest things I have ever had to do. The last day I saw my daughter before leaving to go abroad she was crying in my arms telling me "I don't want you to go daddy". (Imagine how that feels, if you or anyone else here can?)

I'm sorry weepej, I think I know you well enough to know you weren't being flippant or have meant your post to upset anyone. But just be aware that it touches a very raw nerve for some of us

My ex wife was a bitch and the Government does not always do what is right or fair and the sooner people recognise this, the better it will be for us all.

Don't underestimate what you are capable of if or when your country starts to legislate against you or rip you off!

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

Default on payment of child support - 3 points on your licence

Urinating in a public place – 3 points on your licence

Smoking in a designated non-smoking area – 3 points on your licence

Shop lifting – 3 points on your licence

Drug use, pimp, burglary, ABH....


I’m beginning to see a pattern here...


PS. Oh - Driving while banned under totting up... Let's hear it for the Gov lads

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

And how many points for illegal fox-hunting?

It's like this, if you are not responsible to drive, you get your licences taken away, and driving "equipment" (ie car) removed if you dont comply.

If you bring children into the world, and don't support them to the best of your financial ability, then you should have your "equipment" removed to prevent further non-compliance.

The Government does seem hell bent on meeting the 25% reduction in traffic on the UK roads that they committed to about 16 yrs ago !
This is yet another way to 'drive people off the roads' and never mind about the lives that are potentially ruined as a consequence.

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

The real injustice of using licence suspension or endorsement as a punishment is that it5is totally arbitrary. For a pro driver it is loss of livelihood; for a commuter it is a greater or lesser inconvenience.; for a non driver it is less than a slap on the wrist. A non driver might well consider that the suspension of his licence is a fair price to pay to avoid his CSA payments.

And what happens to the unlicensed miscreant? Is he obliged to obtain a licence so that it can be suspended? What is the difference between a suspended licence and a driving ban?

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

It surley would increase the number of unlicenced drivers on our roads. Also the UNINSURED drivers on our roads.

Even if you suport the penaltiers being imposed the consequences are much wider.

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

All the insurance policies I have held are phrased thus when stating who can drive: "anyone who holds a a licence to drive or who has held a licence to drive and is not disqualified from holding or applying for such a licence"

That is why I queried the distinction between suspension and disqualification. Perhaps Lucy could help on this?

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Exactly!

WTF has my driving licence got to do with anything non-driving related? Whatever happened to the punishment fitting the crime?

It’s a good job they’re not in control of our sex lives or they would penalise us that way too. Seriously, if they could I’m sure they would! Luckily I’ve still got that in hand.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

Interesting.

Any comments on the difference between:

- revocation
- disqualification
- suspension

in legal terms?

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

I wouldn't mention control over your sex life too happily.....
if you forget to close your curtains during your "happy Time" and someone sees you, you could end-up on the wrong side of 18 months....
And, of course, sex is now illegal in public lavatories (if you can ever find one, and you're that way inclined), even if you are a M/F couple.....a side effect of the sexual discrimination laws.
And the new coroners and justice bill enables the gov (clause 152) to share your data, without recourse to the data protection act (instituted immunity), with practically anyone they want to....
In fact many new bills contain clauses that have nothing to do with the bills main reason.....so you may well find, in a few months/years/weeks, that it will be illegal for you and your wife/partner to have sex anywhere (except in the house of commons....where apparently it is ok to shag where you like) (looking at some of the women, I suppose they have to have that) (and men) (and transgender) (and anyone) (non-discriminatory statement under the sex discrimination act).

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing