Safe Speed Forums

As i was driving back from college the other day i managed to jump a red light by accident and think i may have been caught on camera. Firstly i must say it is a road i know has a traffic light camera and as i approached the green light i slowed down considerably as i thought it woz going to change, yet by the time i reached it, it just turned orange and i deemed i should carry on instead of stop in the middle of the junction, i noticed it turn red so it must have changed to red as i went through. Anyway there woz a traffic light camera at the other side of the junction (there was also cctv like cameras on top of the traffic lights i went through are these just sensors or can they catch me aswell) facing towards me on the other side of the road, i didnt notice it flash it was daytime, so i woz wonderin whether i will hav been caught or not? Also do these traffic light cameras take pictures of both sides of the road fronts and backs of cars, or is it there to catch people coming from the other side of the junction and photograph it from the rear. It is on the B6053, rotherham road at main street, swallownest in sheffield

i know this is a rather long post but as im a new driver ive got rather worried about it so any advice will be greatly appreciated

Oh dear. Sounds like your timing went a bit pear shaped. If you're lucky you might have crossed the line on amber and seen the light on the far side just as it turned red. If so I think you might be okay. If you do get a ticket and want to fight it you should visit the forums at http://www.pepipoo.com where they can give you advice on the lgeal side of things. I wouldn't get your hopes up though - I'd have thought the red light cams are pretty cut and dried.

The camera on the far side is almost certainly going to be there for light jumpers coming the other way. AFAIK these cameras only ever photograph the rear of vehicles. The things on top of the lights are likely to be sensors to enable the lights on the junction to operate automatically.

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Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler - Einstein

there was no camera on my side of the road to take a picture from behind though, just the other side of the road so unless they take pictures of the front too i should be safe?

Not if you don't improve your technique.

You should be asking how you managed to go through so late, especially since you say you slowed and were expecting the lights to change.

Going through on amber is bad but sometimes excuseable but you should not be seeing the lights turn red after you have crossed the line and before you clear the junction.

As i've been taught on the driving courses i've attended, as i approach solid green traffic lights....

"Plan to stop, look to go..."

You need to start paying more attention as a 'new' driver, otherwise you could come unstuck big time at a juction.

Good advice. I like it better as 'Planning to stop but looking to go'.

If we plan never to brake harder than '50%' or 0.45g (which is a good idea if we don't want to scare our passengers, then maximum safe approach speed to a green light is 44mph. (calculated from 0.75 sec reaction time, 3.0 second amber and 0.45 g braking effort.) If we also allow for acceleration we might risk a few mph more.

I don't believe we should have traffic lights on roads with a higher speed limit than 40mph.

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Paul Smith
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If they want to put traffic lights on a NSL road, they do so and then impose a 40mph limit for a couple of miles either side. They've done this in several places I know of.

IMO it would be better, if they absolutely have to put in lights, to leave the speed limit at NSL and rather extend the amber phase to suit the speed.

Cheers
Peter

We have discussed this before - and, as you say, if we had a policy of no traffic lights on roads with speed limits above 40 mph, then all that would happen is that 40 mph zones would be imposed around all traffic lights.

I think Paul living where he does underestimates the number of traffic lights on NSL roads - they seem particularly common in Lancashire and Cheshire. Quite a few of them are in locations where the road configuration means that approach speeds tend to be 40 mph or below anyway, such as this one at Four Lane Ends near Tarporley in Cheshire.

You wouldn't design a new-build NSL road with traffic lights, but in practice I really don't think the ones that exist pose a significant safety problem.

I can even think of at least one place with a Pelican crossing in an NSL.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

There's quite a few round the south east as well. Off the top of my head I can think of at least two local NSL dual carriageways with light controlled junctions. I don't recall ever seeing an accident on either from anyone crossing on red, though I have seen a couple of near misses due to blatant intentional jumpers rather than those caught out by the phasing. Is this perhaps just a theoretical danger that's seems greater than it really is?

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Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler - Einstein

Quite a few in our patch too.

However, with The Man on this - approach lights expecting them to change and always look to go as well.

I think the OP should be OK on this occasion from his description - sometimes they only enforce the more "dangerous" side of the lights and not both. However, it it's a wide crossing - then there is every chance the red will appear before you reach the other side. Think the mad Lad has a video recording of some dodgy lights somewhere in his "collection" which he took to teach his son hazard perception...

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A driving instructor once told me that traffic lights are at their most dangerous when they're at green. I believe that the
Highway Code says that you should stop at a red light only if you can do so safely.

Fair enough, i agree completely with this and have asked myself how i managed to go through so late, but what i need to know is whether the camera will have caught me (due to it being facing me, do they take pictures of the front of your vehicle or only from the rear) not because then i will have 'got away with it' but because i need to know whether to expect a fine through the door as im saving up to do the pass plus course to improve my driving.

As others have said, you should be in the clear as far as the camera is concerned.

Size 9s in gob - there was a crash on one last night. Not one of the NSL dual carriageway junctions though. This one is single carriageway east-west (30 except over the crossroads itself) and a single carriageway NSL going north-south. A lot of jumping seems to happen on the east-west road, especially eastbound. I think maybe this is because drivers in the 30 limit see the de-restriction sign and the crossroads and think they need to floor it to get across the lights, as a result of which there are some that are caught close to the lights trying to build up speed when they change. Strangely it's the main north-south road that has red light cams fitted, and in both directions.

What's the solution? Moving the cams might have an effect, but I think it might be simpler just to have slightly longer red phases in all directions so that they overlap. In other words, every time the lights change there should be a couple or three seconds when it's red for all traffic. You may still get the odd one going through on the light that's just gone red, but at least no one else will have started moving yet.

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Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler - Einstein

Perhaps they could be re-phased so that traffic approaching at the speed limit having cleared the previous light will get through? That might prevent the traffic from speeding up when they know that is necessary to get through them without being trapped.

I am convinced that many of the lights are programmed to trap you and that a lot of drivers speed because of this.