Safe Speed Forums

RAC - Press Association Article - Here

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

And your point is?

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Perhaps if you miss the point, you might consider looking for advanced danger recognition training ,or you might just care to read the Highway code . Then again , perhaps you might like to take some advice from some one who's spent a lot of time working on track on LIVE railways -

1) -Trains have brakes ,but they do not stop as per the Highway code examples .
2) Trains do not ( as perceived by cyclists) have steering capacity .


But above all - on track ,the LAST thing to argue with is ,yep ,you've probably guessed - it's a TRAIN.I suspect that the advice for drivers on crossings was written as for rail workers , who respect trains , but not for drivers who don't want to give way ,unless the other vehicle is a lot bigger -well ,hey -news - a train is just that .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Ouch - the possible consequences don't bare thinking about! A sewage tanker cut in two by a train???

What on earth was he thinking of - the lights are 20 seconds ahead of the barriers, which are usually a similar time before the train on the Windermere / Oxenholme line. Hardly a long wait!

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

I cannot imagine - sun light blinded him ? Surely that would have been used in the defense though!
Just thought he could - the list is endless really ! Be good to get the Court papers - I must look into that ....

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

Blinded by the sun that was behind him ?
The event was shown to the court...recorded by the cctv that most crossings now have.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Gosh! I never realised that ignoring the warning lights at a train crossing could be dangerous. I have never been hit by a train so I thought it was safe. Bit like using a mobile telephone when driving.

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

...but ONLY a bit!

All those political promises going down the drain

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Nonsense surely, if they haven't got steering how do they get them round corners whilst keeping all the wheels on those thin rails?

You're kidding, right?

Or are you referring to the fact that train bogeys swivel? That doesn't really count as steering....

You're right. I'm quite sure there are a load of workers on each train who can rip up and replace the tracks such that that train can evade the obstacle

You might want to check the context of botach's post.

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

I always thought they cornered "like they were on rails"!

Sorry Steve, but you are wrong. You have been watching Wallace and Grommit in "The Wrong Trousers"!

In practice it takes years of planning inquiries to lay new track across areas not previously accessible by rail so by the time a decision had been made, I'm afraid the train would have hit the obstruction in it's path!

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

Exactly Weepej, that's why underground drivers get paid so much, they can do it in the dark

Spectacular, never though of that. I mean it must be hard enough keeping all those wheels on the rails when going in a straight line, let alone going round corners, and yes in the dark too!

The part of this that interests me most is the offence with which the driver was charged and that there has been no discussion about it. I would be interested to find out what the general opinion is about this particular case. Sensible and considered answers please as it will help me in the preparation of some training material. He was charged with fail to comply with a traffic signal. To help I will give a short definition of the possible charges he could have faced.

Fail to comply with a traffic signal carries a maximum sentence of a fine equal to half a weeks pay plus 3 points.

If he had been charged with DWDC, the sentencing starting point for an offence consisting of a "momentary lapse of concentration" is a fine equal to half a weeks pay plus 3 or 4 points. The starting point for an offence consisting of driving which "bordered on dangerous" is a fine equal to one and a half a weeks pay plus 7 to 9 points or a short disqualification.


If he had been charged with dangerous driving, the starting point for a "single incident where little or no damage or risk of personal injury" is a medium level community penalty (say 80 to 100 hours unpaid work) plus a 12 month ban and an extended re test.



DWDC is driving which "falls below of the standard expected of a careful and competent driver".

Dangerous driving is driving which "falls far below the standard expected of a careful and competent driver" AND "it would be obvious to a careful and competent driver that driving in that manner would be dangerous".

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I am not a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I do have experience of the day to day working of courts and use that knowledge to help where possible. I do not represent any official body and post as an individual.

I was surprised to see that he was not charged with DD as his actions certainly seem to meet those criteria. It could be that the driver argued that he knew that he had sufficient time to cross before the train arrived so that his action posed no danger, only inconvenience, to the train passengers. The signal offence is obviously cut and dried and the easy option for the prosecutor. Could he also be charge with criminal Damien to the gates?

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Isn't there also a charge called,"Careless driving"? Is this still a charge and how do you define this, if so?

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Sorry, I plead guilty to the use of jargon in a public place.

DWDC = driving without due care and attention, which includes what is sometimes called careless driving.

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I am not a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I do have experience of the day to day working of courts and use that knowledge to help where possible. I do not represent any official body and post as an individual.