Safe Speed Forums

True. Horse power and a wilful animal. Try to soothe ours by talking to them as we ride. They do sense your strength and how you rein in . Sister-in-law rides and cycles better than any of us though. Shall have to persuade her to sign up here so she can natter to you about horses.

Speaking of Krissi..

Latest from that site - one whole thread dedicated to "What Krissi said next!" in the admin section! Some are admitting defeat and want her banned and others appear to like her a bit. There are some sad people around! Could have been worse ... might have set Wildy on them! She is thinking about it!

Hehe, horses and motorbikes, thats my thing. Horses do respond well to soothing words, a couple of quietly spoken words in a soothing voice has averted many a disaster as far as my experiences have gone!

glad Krissi is givin 'em a run for their money!
Might just go and have alook myself.....

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

I put horse unpredictablity down to lead deficiency.

Walk behind a cow and they never bother you, the might pee or worse on you or worse still reverse over you. But only because they have more important thngs to do, like eating. Dad said, to make sure I aproach the bull from behind, because at least if he has a go you've got a few extra nano seconds to run while he scoots round. He did worry me abit (don't live/work at home) , but I'd sooner have 10 bulls than a horse, you know where you stand with a bull.

You saying about there is not much a rider can do about a horse bolting is exactly my point. That's too much weight and too many legs not to be in full control in public. Bolt all you like away from me. If my dog bite some one he gets put down, but a horse hurts some one, the owner starts blubbing and we have to forgive it. To hell with that.

So what would you want to do? Ban them from the roads?
As far as 'you know where you stand with a bull', you can honestly say you know whats going through its head? You can honestly say you know what its gonna do next? I think not....your own father has warned you otherwise and I quote your words, "Dad said, to make sure I aproach the bull from behind, because at least if he has a go you've got a few extra nano seconds to run while he scoots round." Obvious that they too can be unpredictable, they just give you more warning!
Done a fair few shows around the country with the stallions and breeding mares, some of the shows agricultural, and have seen a fair few accidents involving not just wayward horses, but other animals too, including bulls. ANY animal can be unpredictable, your cows too.
So I am still left wondering what your solution would be....but becareful... all horses can have their unpredictable moments, so saying restricting 'unpredictable' horses just wont work, you would be covering most of the horse population!

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

'So what would you want to do? Ban them from the roads?'

Yes. If a horse had the choice of being in a field or on a road filled with snorting, fast-moving beasts I think I know where it would rather be! It's only it's Master/Mistress (Ha,Ha) who force it onto a road. If so-called horse-lovers had any respect for these noble beasts, they would not allow them anywhere near a road. They only do so for purely selfish reasons
Every time we see one on the road, my wife always says "It's the horse I feel sorry for".

But if they could never be used on roads, there would be a lot fewer horses.

It's like those vegetarians who express sympathy for cows and pigs. If we didn't end up eating them, they would never have existed in the first place

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Um yes ok oscar whatever . What about exercise? As I have said, riders do not like being on the road either, but they have to very often go on the roads to get to bridlepaths. Horses also need to be stimulated. Being stuck in a field getting fat and subsequently developing ailments such as laminitus through too much grass and not enough exercise is what I would call suffering. They are not meant to be stuck in a field either remember.
If so called horse lovers had any respect for these noble beasts they will keep them stimulated, exercised and in top, fit condition! That means exercise, unfortunately too often on the roads to get to a place where they can exercise safely and keep their horse stimulated.

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

The present-day horse is not a creature that occurs naturally in the wild. It is bred to be ridden, and if it's not ridden and exercised its well-being is likely to suffer.

I would imagine any sensible rider would aim to minimise the distance ridden on the road, but sometimes it can't be avoided.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Thank you PeterE.

We do not exercise horses on roads through choice! It is hazardous, nerve wracking and generally an unpleasant experience most of the time. It is unfortunately unavoidable. Myself and a few others in my area are part of a group called TROT (set up by my mother). We are campaigning for more places to exercise horses where we need not go on the roads as much. We also campaign for better education on riders and drivers parts, crossings on roads where riding is unavoidable and are currently in talks with some of the larger land owners in the area to get permission to use their land. WE HATE RIDING ON THE ROADS AND AVOID WHERE POSSIBLE. If you would like to see horses stuck in fields, rotting away, bored senseless and suffering ill health, thats up to you but dont expect genuine horse lovers to see their companions suffer.

phew......rant over!

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

I'm most unfortunate. There are 3 riding schools within 4 miles of my home and there are convoys of horses everywhere!

One is on a farm with the entrance in a slight dip in the road in an NSL. Instead of leading a horse across the road at a spot where visibility is better, a woman rider crossed the road with her mount in this dip at dusk!
A biker acame over the brow and cut the horse virtually in two. Needless to say, biker and horse both died.

That is very unfortunate Oscar, but these riding schools are teaching people to ride and part of that is to ride on the roads. If these novice riders weren't taught to ride, then that would be cruel on the horses. We accept the dangers of the road, we accept other road users, we just wish other road users would be more tolerant of us and not preach to us about something they know little about.
As for the motorcylist and horse accident, very sad. I would never dream of riding a horse on the road in failing light or bad visibilty but it does happen. She was quite correct to be riding though rather than leading. Leading the horse would not have prevented the accident, if her visibilty was restricted whilst riding the horse, it would have been worse leading the horse for the simple reason that she was higher up riding it. Would crossing the road at earlier point have meant she would have been riding facing oncoming traffic?
As well as that, the biker should have been aware of the risks of horses if what you say is true and your area is heavily populated by riding schools, was he from outside the area? Do the roads round by you not have hazard signs warning of horses?

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

The answer is simple.

Rider must have had training before she (usually) can take a horse on the road.

She must also have public liability insurance and not having insurance means points on the old driving license just like driving uninsured would.

No one under the age of 16 can take a horse on the road.

Got nowhere to exercise a horse? Simply don't have a horse. I've not brought my dog to live with me 'cos he's not got the room here he has at home.

GSXR, when dealing with bulls, you carry a weapon and they often respect that. Makes sure he can see his women, keep calm and if you have to, hit him has hard as is possible with said weapon. If he does give you any trouble, he's beef burgers. If horsey types had a less emotional reaction to dangerous horses there would be less dangerous horses.

I asked the stable girl why, when her horse kicked her, he wasn't forming the major part of a BBQ, her reaction was ooh, can't do that. Quite the opposite of what her dad said.

I saw the other stable girl ejected from her mount in the middle of a field, that damn horse is unsafe an broke another girls arm, though I thought I heard an ant fart in northern Suffolk, which may have caused it.

If you bothered to read previous posts you would see that I agree wholeheartedly with profiecency testing riders, and with the insurance issue. I also think that children should not be allowed on the road unsupervised, I certainly wont allow mine to. But all these measures are for the riders, not the horses....... even an experienced, fully insured, over sixteen yearold who has past her/his proficiency test is really no match for a 600kg frightened, panicked and very strong horse who's instinct is 'fright and flight'!
As for 'nowhere to exercise horse', we have plenty of places to exercise horses, its just we have to get there by road . If we did as you suggest, no one or certainly very very few people would have horses, which I suppose would suit you down to the ground wouldn't it?

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

Oh, and we are emotionally attached to our horses because they are companions not 'working animals earning their keep' like your cows and bulls. Your animals are business, ours are pleasure.
And curiously you still dont say why the horses you speak of acted the way they did, you have just assumed it was without cause. Yet the possible causes are bountiful!

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

not sure what happened with the horse that broke the ribs. He was at some eventing thing and was tied up being brushed or summat and he kicker her with both feet. The other one I saw from 200 meters. I was on a tractor. She would not have even heard the engine, low idle, bottom gear. It just slammed the brakes on and sent her over his head. Than ran off at a high rate of speed. Not sure what the deal was when he broke the other one wrist.

The woman was leading the horse, (she's the owner of the school), bringing it in from a field opposite. If she had walked the horse ten yards up the hill before crossing, horse and biker would still be alive.

BTW, the coroner decided it was the biker's excessive speed that caused it! (Apparently going like a 'bat out of hell' 500 yards from a 30 limit.)

Firstly Oscar...my apologies, the way you explained it earlier in the post made it sound like she was out riding and in your opinion should have dismounted some way up the road and led the horse across...

"Instead of leading a horse across the road at a spot where visibility is better, a woman rider crossed the road with her mount in this dip at dusk!"

Usually when we say 'his/her mount' we usually mean the horse he/she is riding.
I will be perfectly honest with you here, I regularly break the speed limits on my bike, but only when I feel it is safe to do so. The situation you have described, I would not feel safe to do so. There must surely have been hazard signs warning of horses in the area. Another point regarding the bikers speed, the woman would have heard him coming unless of course she is deaf (even if he had the standard can on). If she had heard him coming, she would not have crossed. This points me to 2 scenarios.....(actually there are loads of scenarios but these are 2 most likely).......

1) His speed was indeed excessive and she didn't have time to do anything about it when she heard him coming.
2) She did indeed hear him, got out of the way, only for the horse to freak when it heard the noise and saw the light and attempt to bolt home.

Crossing the road further up would maybe have prevented the accident, if biker and horsewoman had both had their wits about them. Saying that, if she had just bought the horse out of the field and indeed hadn't started to cross and the horse had freaked, the accident would still have occured.
Either way, I fail to see how banning unpredictable horses from being ridden the road (which is what the origins of this thread are about) would have prevented the accident, as you say, the horse was being bought in for the night, not being ridden.

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

And Adam.L. ......

The horse at the show may have kicked out for loads of reasons......
Stung by a wasp, bee, bitten by a horse fly, startled by something going on behind, feeling threatened by another horse walking past its rear end. The horse was tied up, no option for flight, defense! The girl should realise now never to stand far enough behind a horse for it to have leverage if it does strike out for some reason. Stand right up against the horses quarters and the force of a strike just pushes you away, maybe a bruise but far better than a few cracked ribs.
Regarding the horse that just stopped for no apparent reason....thought you said he bucked her off? You have to understand that a horses sense of danger is far better than ours, they sense danger we cannot see, they have evolved that way. They dont have big claws and big teeth to fight predators off, they have to sense that danger and react accordingly.
You cannot ask the horse why it suddenly stopped so you can never fully understand. That is what makes them unpredictable!
And like I replied to Oscar, I fail to see how any legislation regarding horses or banning unpredictable horses from being ridden on the road would have prevented either incident you have pointed out either, as the horse that kicked out was at a show, the other being ridden in a field anyway!

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Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.

Whatever speed the biker was riding at, if he went over blind crest and couldn't stop safely when confronted with a horse on his side of road then he was travelling too fast.

Could just have easily been pedestrians, a broken down car, a fallen tree, etc

May not have been the best place to cross road with horse, but every bend or crest can hide an obstruction and we should drive/ride/cycle at a speed that we can stop safely.