Safe Speed Forums

You need to get back to reality. This campaign will never succeed given the overwhelming body of evidence in support of safety cameras. Knock it on the head and convert it to a 'Government Watch' style of forum, then it would be more relevant at least.

Im perfectly in tune with this particular reality, its speed camera supporters who arent of this world.



I beg to differ. The so called "overwhelming" body of "evidence" you make much off is mostly spun stats put together by liars and cheats to prop up their flawed perspectives.
Youre still referring to them as "safety" cameras despite them having absolutely no safety function, thats a prime example of the spin im referring to.



No, why should anyone? You havent proven your position, in fact, the longer you continue , the more illogical and exposed youre becoming.
No one with an ounce of common sense actually believes, really believes that getting a £60 fine two weeks after the event is anything to do with "safety", so why pretend it is?
The days of speed cameras are numbered, believe that or not but they are and i for one will never accept them, never stop fighting them, subverting their functions and beating them.
You cant win, thats something you can really believe in.

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

Nah, I'm in the position of victory as I support cameras, which if you hadn't noticed are quite numerous and supported by RoSPA et al. It's you who has to prove otherwise.

Slower is safer.

If what you say is true, I should imagine the road safety groups are coming under pressure as a result of government propaganda on the general public and therefore the general public would not trust the road safety groups if they didn't support speed cams.

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Currently undergoing training with the I.A.M.

Huh? Thats the daftest argument ive ever heard!
I win cos i like cameras? lmao!

You need something a little more substantial than that surely?



Which is why the campaign will go on. So youll eventually lose.



Youll excuse me if i dont share your optimism regarding slowness when you shout the command "rotate" before shouting "Mayday! Mayday!" shortly thereafter as you stall, "captain".
Speed is safest when its matched to the conditions in the locality at the time. I win!

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

This sounds similar to the overwhelming body of evidence that the Sun revolves around the Earth which view was popular at one time.

All the same elements are there. Quasi-religious fervour, refusal to accept that received ideas are wrong...

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

[quote="DeltaF
Youll excuse me if i dont share your optimism regarding slowness when you shout the command "rotate" before shouting "Mayday! Mayday!" shortly thereafter as you stall, "captain".
Speed is safest when its matched to the conditions in the locality at the time. I win! [/quote]

Brilliant -DeltaF --
My contribution was going to be --


[murray walker mode] - And in the Troll race mpatton2008 is surging ahead of the rest of the trolls [/murray walker mode]

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

What a preposterous set of idiots.

Jesus!
Don't you have anything better to do?
You have been spouting the same shit for as long as I can remember.

Yes, I had noticed they were quite numerous.
I also noticed that the road deaths had not been falling very fast, in fact they are falling very slowly....while the speed camera network was being "rolled-out" rapidly the road deaths were falling very slowly. While others are explaining that speed cameras are responsible for the fall in deaths and injuries (deaths down, injuries up) others are pointing to the rapid implementation of safety technology in vehicles. Then there is the role that traffic congestion plays in death reduction, slow traffic almost certainly equals lower deaths. Not to mention the GREATLY improved trauma care.
And we don't have to prove otherwise, while the DfT are happily crowing about road deaths falling [due to cameras] others are pointing out irritating little facts....such as the DfT figures showing that 95% of accidents do not feature speeds in excess of the posted limit.
Another funny little figure....around half of accidents happen at road junctions. Many featuring pedestrian deaths occur near road junctions.

Not to worry, my satnav continues to feature updated speed camera warnings and my eyes work very well. Other drivers continue to flash lights to warn of s/vans and the police are required to wear high-viz gear when operating hand-held speed equipment. The specs system continues to be one of lifes all-time failures (change lanes between each one) (and then back...and back...and back) (shame about all the muck and mud on the road).
I find the whole speed camera system to be quite entertaining. When the law told me my vehicle didn't show-up on the insurers database I took to passing an anpr and then turning off for a detour....apart from the threats to "impound my vehicle" .... pointless, but fun.
Yep, the speed camera revenue gathering system is doing what it was designed for, making life difficult for drivers (part1).
No problems.
Another irritating little fact (for the Df [preventing private] T) ............... most drivers said that they would stop having holidays, and other personal treats, rather than give their car up.
Oh, and a large majority of women said their preferred vehicle was a BIG 4X4....because there was less risk to passengers in an accident.
Let's see....next election Neulabour will be down the road and we will see what the next elected gov will do....the congestion charge people are fighting like hell to avoid any referendums.....but they are getting slung out anyway, by the unavoidable local elections. What we need now is for senior civil servants to get slung out as well....
Oh yes, and the revenue from cameras no longer goes to the "safety pratnerships".....they get a "stipend" to cover costs....maybe the Df[PP]T got fed-up with the continual stories about the plasma tvs' the SCPs' spent their protection money on ?
Maybe we need some more publicity about the "partnerships" ?
Such as "how can a conspiracy between councils, police and courts possibly be construed as a system of justice"

_________________
The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Id just like to thank Mpaton for just giving me a huge attack of the giggles with that retort, its made my day! Cheers mate.

Nothing says "ive lost my cool and the argument" better than that.

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

Nah, it's not. We're talking about road safety and we have numptys going on about aircraft stalling on takeoff. What relevance has that got?

what have cameras got to do with road safety? they are just tax collectors.
Cameras do not stop drink driving, un licenced drivers, suicidal cyclists or pedestrians or unroadworthy forign trucks.
all they do is measure speed at on moment in time.

By your thinking a Robin Relient traveling at 69mph is safer than a Porche at 71mph. a transit van is dangerous at 51mph but a transit minibus is safe

It's all mad.

I nearly posted a comment that would get 11%

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

The "campaign" had 1 central aim, as I understood it - dressed up with fine talk about road safety, but the core aim was a reduction in the number of enforcement cameras on the roads.

I suspect someone on here has the figures (but I don't) for the number of cameras at the time the "campaign" started, and the number of cameras now.

If the former is higher than the latter, then arguably the "campaign" could claim that it was working.

I think we all know the answer to that one.

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COAST Not just somewhere to keep a beach.

A young loner on a crusade to champion the cause of the innocent, the helpless, the powerless, in a world of criminals who operate above the law.

We'll see about that in due course, wont we?



Well ok ill admit to being a little naughty by baiting you with that, but you baited me first with your " slower is safer" comment on the end.
I was simply pointing out that such a blanket comment as that isnt true. It depends on the context in which the situation occurs.
Thats the relevance.
Its the same as saying "speed kills", its a simplistic message for the hard of thinking and the slow of realisation.

I seriously doubt you could claim that "speed kills" is a widely accepted and believable message given that most all drivers exceed the limits, because if they believed it, they simply wouldnt exceed the limits.
The campaign has succeeded in showing speed kills to be blather, as it will do so regarding the camera love proponents also.

Like i said, we win, you lose.

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

The "campaign" was never against speed cameras per-se, but against road safety policy relying on the mantra of "speed kills" and concentrating on the fining of speeding drivers.
It was also against the gross misuse of falsified statistics to "prove" that speed cameras would work.
http://www.safespeed.org.uk/pr132.html



And just in case you're interested:

I have a clean licence. It has been clean for 20 years. I drive every day, in various counties, in all weathers, in a variety of vehicles INCLUDING a high-power m/cycle.
If it was not for the advances in on-site trauma care, advances in treating accidents cases in A&E and the VERY major advances in vehicle safety systems the accidents rate/s would be much higher than they are now. That the stated advances are ignored by the speed-camera-as-a-saviour-of-the-world adherents, to safeguard their "careers" and provide their "speed camera salesman friends" with similar careers, is little short of immoral.

_________________
The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

So hang on, what do you think of the scp's "fine talk"? bearing in mind their hands are dripping and crimson?
Do you implicitly believe all THEIR claims?



A noble cause it is too. I dont like being spied upon and i dont like being threatened by cameras-of any type and neither do most normal and right thinking people.



Maybe so.



Good point. However you fail to address the ignorance and dogma shown by the DFT- i mean come on, at the start of their war on the terrorism of drivers, they were pumping out skewed "we think" stats like there was no tomorrow.
Have you so quickly forgotten the "one third lie"?
They pumped this out with regular monotony yet it was Proven, yes, PROVEN to be false, and yet you still stand by the scamera system?
Wheres the sense in that?

Just admit they got it wrong and founded this whole system on a lie, or if we are going to be gracious to them- a mistaken belief.
Blind faith dosent do your side of the argument any good at all Handy, theres good and valid points on both sides of this argument, its a just a case of doing the right thing not doing what you think is right.

Having said that though, ill never accept the speed camera system, ever. SCP's continue to play at road safety whilst ignoring majority causation factors and that cant ever be right or be allowed to go unchallenged.
Example, theyve just put a camera in down the road from me, based on some old guy reversing out into the traffic flow and getting himself killed. Despite the fact that speed was in no way the cause of the accident they put up a camera.....how odd that they think an accident of this nature has any correlation to the speed of the vehicles involved.
Thats what we are fighting, incorrect attribution of cause and the subsequent fixation on snapping people with a bloody scamera just so they can say "we are doing...erm...something."

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

Speed cameras do not stop speeding.
They do not stop road accidents.
5% of accidents feature speed in excess of the posted limit, note that that does not mean that the excess speed was responsible for the accident.
You should also note that CCTV cameras do not reduce crime (they move it elsewhere) and (in the majority of cases) do not lead to a person being convicted. They didn't stop the london tube bombings, even though the people involved in that were known...
In fact, in almost every case and with every statistic-laden statement from every politician, you should look BEHIND the words to understand the lie.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

It has been proven, it's just the political will and uneducated/biased sheeple, hypocrites and liars which are making it difficult.


Well, you know what they say about being careful what you wish for?

BTW - Give yourself a pat on the back for backing something already in place. Are you victorious at keeping dry in the rain because you support umbrellas too?

Maybe I should post on a forum about STDs and declare I'm in the position of victory because I don't have any so na na na na naaa

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I'll put it in again, in bold:



Point of clarification: AIUI the figures showed that c. 5% of accidents were caused by speed in excess of the posted limit, it does not mean that none of the ther 95% featured speed in excess of the posted limit.



So, let me get this straight, the proof offered that the "campaign" was still healthy and active and effective was what? And this proof was so good that no-one believes it, apart from the acolytes on here? Have the standards of proof fallen so far? Actually, don't answer that, I've seen what is regarded as proof on here before.

And, point of order, it looks very much like that you are accusing Mpaton2008 of being uneducated, biased, a "sheeple", a hypocrite or a liar. None of which are particularly pleasant, please bear in mind the forum rules on ad hominem.

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COAST Not just somewhere to keep a beach.

A young loner on a crusade to champion the cause of the innocent, the helpless, the powerless, in a world of criminals who operate above the law.