Safe Speed Forums

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=579437&nmt=Captain%20Gatso.

It would appear that PH is adopting a new line of censorship, with the Captain being barred by the moderators.
It is claimed that he broke forum rules, however a search of all his posts failed to turn up any that did.
When I challenged the moderator(s?) he claimed to have already deleted the offending posts - however, I find it surprising that nobody else appears to have seen the offending posts!!
Shades of Steve Callaghan and Paul's post and subsequent banning from the CSCP site.

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

Never seen the Cap'tn as breaking any rules - his posts on there were factual - perhaps ted & lot have sonmething to answer to - IF THEY WANT TO BE SEEN AS A SITE WITH ANY PRETENSE OF CREDIBILITY (The caps are meant as a derogarity comment on the PH site Mentality on censorship)

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Not so much disappointed as not surprised Ernest.

I too have found myself moderated by petty individuals with their own axes to grind.
On the PH site, i currently reside in the sinbin of all places, the moderators refuse to confirm the reason i am being held there.
I have not broken any site protocols, and i have not posted against the rules, yet they hold me in the sinbin because?
I feel because i spoke up in the Captains defence and posted a poll regarding his re-instatement, someone decided to yield to the redmist of authoritarianism and made a bad judgement call.
I then found myself sinbinned with no explanation as to why.
I have been assured by the head moderator that i am not being punished- so why am i being held?
The fact is clear; They made a big foul up and now hope it will go away- it wont, and neither will I.
They now have refused to communicate for the last 24+hours like the cowards they are.

They to my mind are of the same ilk as the petty, bin snooping, FPN obsessed traffic warden types that often wheedle their way into positions of power by much heavy licking of the (pardon the expression) "backside of authority ".
There is no place in a FREE society for their kind.

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

If you don't like the way a forum is run then it's simple. Don't go there.

Don't start a campaign to change the way it's run, don't go off to other forums and whinge.

You could instead set up your own forum with your own rules, moderate and manage it yourself.

I suspect it has much more to do with the BRAKE fall-out which had nothing to do with BRAKE .. but mostly the work of a notorious internet troll who has more in common with those nasty huge brown slugs of the autumn than Brake members.. Roadpeace members (including Mr Ramsay whose single-minded arguments pull apart like the jumper with the dropped stitch In fairness to Roadpeace - he not "representative" as he would be the" cycling "zealot" farty on his own agenda") )

Pistonheads .. now affilated to "Autocar" has a "brand image"to protect more than ever in its original set up.

Whilst we all privately nod an OH YES each time PC Gatso dies a nasty death.. und perhaps will delay the 999 call . until we out of way of flames und "find the layby to use Handy ist over a mile away - we should not condone basic vandalism as this akin to the muesli muncher kicking cars at traaffic lights

I put my real views in private though

I will say, from what I saw und read, that the Captain posted stuff seen in press... about BiB stupidity as reported in the press.. "decent result from a court case.

Along with his own opinions on such matters which some agreed with und some disagreed with. That ist normal life und we are not a nation of "yespeoples" .. YET!

I did not see anything which cause concern or anything which would have made me mail the bloke to question the wisdom of the thread initiated. Maybe these were deleted before I see them. I honestly do not know if the case,

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Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien!

With all due respect, until you know whats going on there you shoudlnt really comment.



Thats an illogical standpoint. You disagree with speed camera obsessions i take it? Then why bother to campaign against them?
Why not take your own advice and just get on with it? Makes no sense, does it?
Making a stand wherever opression raises its ugly head should be everyones aims, not ignoring it, thats what they rely on, your passive compliance.
Ignoring things gets you nowhere.
Its like buying a car from a dodgy dealer and then not saying anything about it when your wheels fell off, or having a pack of pikeys do your drive to find it all collapses in a week but end up recommending them...




Yes i could, but why bother? Theres a million and one other people doing precisely that, all pulling in opposite directions and going no place fast.
I prefer a different approach, the head -on one.


I could post you up the entire transcript of the last 48hours over in the "sin" bin,(the one theyve now conveniently erased to hide the evidence) maybe youd see things differently then?
Probably not.
Pistonheads used to be a good place run with common sense, its now run by people of the same ilk as SCP who rely on the tools of the bully.
If thats not something to fight against, then what is?

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

I went there because I LIKED the way it was run - it is the recent change which concerns me, since it is not catered for in the rules of membership, OR the guide to posting!

I have not yet started a campaign to change the way it is run. I have merely reported the fact here that the way the PH forum is run, has been changed - seemingly at the whim of one of the moderators, AND I am warning of the dishonesty which appears to surround this particular instance, so that visitors who also post here are forewarned.

I dont intend to start a forum in competition, I intend to continue posting on PistonHeads under the EXISTING rules - I am merely mindful that by speaking out in Captain Gatso's defence, my posts or membership might be similarly deleted in the same manner as his, or now it seems, DeltaF's!!

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

I have to wonder whether or not the stance taken by PH has much to do with certain "notoriety" associated with "necklacing the scams" I gather Paul was trying to persuade the Captain to fight in less "extreme" way. We did chat over the phone on odd occasions as Paul used to ask me for a little advice over this and that to do with road safety issues off-line and whilst few will lament over a vandalised Gatso in quite the same way as other vandalised public property - - Paul was anxious that the campaign did not get sullied by "violence" as he knew/strongly thought that lobbing the counter stats and reasoned approaches to road safety would work out more constructively long term. You see that was the difference. Paul was fighting his corner from a legal and reasoned stance. The captain was running around with tyres and petrol.



I sometimes wonder if the captain chaining himself to those scams, swallowing the key and refusing to let them get the photos might have worked in the same way as it did for the suffragettes



Now I guess PH will be concerned with presenting a reasoned driver's approach - and whilst one can agree up to a certain point or even "limit point"with Captain G that a rather "curdled" road safety policy based on speed cams and little other means of catching dodgy drivers as a result of over-egging the pudding - they may have had some wariness over some posts which they may have perceived as "extreme" - but which, when read properly in cooler train of thought, could be tackled "head on" - allowed for a bit of "boxing in" - and even have the corners "straightened out" if you understand what I am trying to say without offending the "Captain" whom I suspect lurks or even posts on here on odd occasion..

Just my tuppence worth of thoughts on the matter. I note the thinks it has as much to do with the great "scandal" of late 2003. I think I can understand why PH will be wish to remain careful of its brand image on some issues.

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Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

does knowing the identity of an offender spring to mind

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now retired

Might be another factor. Captain G jhas always kept a low profile because he knows that vandalising the cams is illegal - even though at least 75% of society are not exactly too disturbed at his antics. That said .. I think many a scam pratnership manager would like to more than press a throttle about it all ..

He does not bother us. We only have the one cam. Or do we Lot of cars.. lots of toys. .. but fair objective judgement all the same

Do I condone his antics?

No .. of course not.

I do understand what has led him to such antics all the same - and it is another reason perhaps why society always ends up returning to "tried , tested and true" methods.. but re-packages them into somthing they can con folk into thinking as "new". Such as the method used to teach me how to read - more years ago now than I like to think - even though to me it seems like "the other week" :wink;

But that method of teaching my generation to read led to literacy within my age group of the baby=boom period. The innovative years too

Somehow we always return to our grandparent's way of doing things..

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

I can only assume that in posting and campaigning on PistonHeads, that the Captain had followed Paul's advice, and was using words rather than enforced redundancy of cameras to bring this about!
If they were concerned at association, then they would or should have acted sooner.

He was critical of certain police officer's behaviour, and highlighted the hypocrisy of running scamming operations, preaching obeying the law, and abusing their position - as I am and have been on PH!
However a search of his posts (the few I missed) showed nothing untoward.
I even defended his position when he was accused of starting threads, then not posting further in them by pointing out that (a) he HAD posted in them later, and (b) we all have occasional commitments which keep us away from the keyboard for short periods!

The thing which amuses me most is the assumption by many that one person could actually be responsible for ALL the cameras which have been destroyed on the simple basis that the press seek him out for a comment when it happens!

My favourite story was the GATSO speed camera found submerged in a ditch by a farmer in Lincolnshire, near the border with Cambridgeshire. The police were quoted as saying they were making enquiries to see if it was connected with one which had disappeared 15 miles away in Cambridgeshire!
How many do they lose every month that there was any doubt??

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

Pistonheads has certainly not been the site that it was since PT sold it....that's a fact.

Mystifying.
Or is it?
I am now released, no explanations and no apologies.

Despite their suggestions that i had broken the rules ( enough to ban me i suspect) a thorough check has revealed no such breach.

Maybe they should now re-instate the Captain too?

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

The plot thickens yet again.

One minute im free to peruse the forums, now i get the "youve been banned" banner and the reason?
Still i have no clue.
What the heck are they playing at?
They really must be trying to force business away from themselves.
Recidivists.

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"Safety" Scamera Partnerships;
Profitting from death and misery since 1993.

Believe nothing- Question everything.

Sure I spotted the Captain on earlier - Earnest will know if it's right -the post is the one on the row at the MET.

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

I understand that since PT "sold up" .... the new owners are of American origin. You will therefore expect a different outlook on the posts. ..and do bear in mind that all these sites are information gathering operations..

There is no such thing as a "free lunch" or indeed...."free speech" these days.....and if you don't fit in you will be dropped.

I know what is going on here, that's enough.


Because speed cameras are run by people who are supposed to do what we want, an internet forum is more like visiting someone's house. Mounting a campaign against an internet forum is like going to someones house then campaigning to get the wallpaper changed.


Don't like it then leave, what's passive about that? Staying and accepting the rules would be compliance.


Leaving is not ignoring it, what is a forum without members?


It's nothing of the sort.


You are right there.



Used to be. Not any more, so leave.



Is it?

It's just another forum. As you say, there's a million others doing the same thing.

Homer, you have not commented on my post so I have re-quoted it here, with some emboldening.
I like to think I am a reasonable and well mannered poster, and my reason for mentioning this here, is so that Safespeed posters who also post on PH are aware of the changes which are taking place.
I dont know what your problem is with that, unless you have a dislike of PistonHeads?

The crux of the matter is that the rules and guides which they show for the users of that forum are not being adhered to - by the site admin staff, so a timely warning here will (I hope) help others.

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

I have not commented because I see nothing to comment on.

I made my initial comment because I felt the thread was degenerating into the age old whinge at how another site runs things thread.

I hate to say it, but you don't really have any rights to tell PH how to run their site. Ultimately it comes down to "their server... their rules", for you or anyone else to use it is a privilege not a right. It is not a democracy and never was. You are of course, perfectly entitled to criticise their decisions.

Whilst I too would be unlikely to report someone vandalising a Gatso it is ultimately true that under current laws Captain Gatso is a criminal and it's reasonable for the owners of PH to decide that they don''t want to be the official mouthpiece of a known criminal. I suspect SafeSpeed would be unwilling to publish his press releases either.

Maybe at some point in the future Captain Gatso will be recognised as a hero and his actions no-longer considered criminal (like what happened to Nelson Mandella) but for now anyone trying to stay within the law is probably best off not associating with him.

It's always the case that as forums get bigger, they have to go down this route. Usually it starts with preventing people posting unsubstantiated complains about companies, basically the bigger the forum gets the bigger a target it is for someone suing or prosecuting them.


If you want a completely unmoderated forum, the closest you're ever going to get is usenet. Is uk.rec.driving still active these days?