Safe Speed Forums

So do I, but you've got to play along.

Humour the trolls you mean....

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

That isn't necessarily true. Many motorists take rat-runs merely to save a few hundred yards of distance and perhaps avoid a perfectly correctly timed set of traffic lights. I live on a road that used to be used in that way but, fortunately we were able to have it designated as "access only" which, with the occasional police presence, seems to have done the trick. And, contrary to what is often stated (vide MM), it wasn't the locals who used to travel too quickly on this road, it was always .the short cutters. We never resorted to the extreme tactics discussed above but most locals did adopt the tactic of never backing up if they encountered a short-cutter on the single track road.

I do think that the idea being pursued by some motorists on this thread - that, having paid their road tax, they are entitled to drive on any road, at a speed of their choosing, blowing their horn if they dislike the trees - whilst strictly legal is extremely anti-social and is the kind of attitude that is bringing increasing legislation and restrictiona on motoring

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

I believe it was more a case of not being needlessly held up ("15-20 minute hold ups") as opposed to driving as fast as one likes (legal or otherwise).

Deliberately causing 15-20 minute hold ups- whilst strictly legal is extremely anti-social and is the kind of attitude that is bringing increasing legislation and restrictions on road use and general freedoms.

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

Just for the record, not all drivers use these so-called rat runs as a short cut to shorten travel time.

When I drive to work, instead of my usual cycle, I always use a short or long cut which residents may perceive as a needless rat run but I do so because it avoids doing a very nasty right turn onto a busy main road. (The sort which always has broken indicator lenses and debris on the junction). Instead it brings me to a point futher up the main road where I do a much safer left turn followed by a right.

When I pass through the side roads, (my rat run), I do it both slowly and responsibly - which is more than I can say for some mothers' I see dropping their lazy kids off at times. These same people are probably amongst the ones who are complaining that I am making their road more unsafe by taking a rat run past their home.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

We (being a mainly rural area), find that many "city people", who move into the countryside for an "idylic retreat" (they never learn do they), consider anything that isn't an A road to be a "rat run", they don't realise that aprrox. 90% of the countryside is made up of B roads or lesser classified. They seem to think that because they can drive a mile or so to the nearest A road and then 4-5 miles and get on a motorway or dual to get back to wherever they (really) belong, that everyone living in the countryside wants to go to, Birmingham, wolverhampton, Shrewsbury etc. They don't appreciate that when mrs Smith's daughter wants to visit old Mrs Smith two villages away that Mrs Smith's Daughter HAS to use lesser classified roads (rat runs to those not inthe know)...

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

I quite agree. A couple of minute hold up two or three times is quite enough to deter most short-cutters

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

They obviously never met someone like me, I can be very patient if I think it's my right of way! I once met a woman so incapable of reversing six feet (when I would have had to go 50 plus in a big van) that eventually she and hubby swapped places and he did the deed.
Joking apart, as I suggested to GDS, how could you tell someone was a rat-runner and not a local, or a visitor to a local? Could end up annoying your neighbour's mother-in-law for example! At this point GDS would say his village had an elaborate notification bulletin system of imminent visitors or something.



While I would say that trying to curtail legal use of the roads for your own ends is anti-social in extremis, but then it takes all sorts.
I'm just really glad I've never encountered this kind of nimbylantism, but I suspect I never will as I'm not sure it really exists. Maybe I have and haven't realised; I've always ascribed really bad parking, failing to reverse etc. to stupidity.

I once read the Indy from cover to cover whilst waiting for someone to backup. It was only when I got our of the car and walked home to get a copy of War and Peace that she got the message

[quote]While

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Well done that man! I just stare at them and smile like an idiot.

We usually find that the COAST system actually does help keep a speed down to the safest for the road conditions ... and yep - it usually means "legal or just below" most of the time. (It's why those posting 24/7 to a different hoon site - hated our constant nagging ) But back to COAST? Errr... we've already posted up the mark assessment sheet for SAC/DIS "clientele" We found they marked to this acronym Hence - it's "offishull"




Sorry .. but you cannot take things into your own hands. You can only resolve by going through the righ procedures - which I think my wife the wildish already mentioned. Approach your Ward Councillor to get this problem before the relevant committee.

Yes there are drawbacks. I will quote my sister's rant over the phone to me from a bit back




So Good Driver Sam? I'd get "mingling" and knock on some doors. You can get a list of all councillors contacts from your local town hall/civic centre/local political party HQs/local library/press.




But that's surely ALL the more reason to cut down the shrubbery as full vision helps decision making. Sure you slow it down on approach. Read IG's and IanH's pieces on Cornering (this section of this forum about 2005 - plus all the other useful advice. At no point do they suggest "speeding into a bend.

We got into an argument with a police officer and his little clique on PH. (He has since been disciplined by the way .. someone finally reported his posts to his bosses! ) Two police officers were being done for "causing death by dangerous driving" .. at 105 mph. Plod and the hoons on there defended them to the death. Me , Wildy and Ernest Marsh .. plus a few others stood up to these arrogant twats -pointing out that the road in question had dips and bends and concealed exits which should have made them "train still at above the NSL perhaps - but not at over the ton for duration" Lancs Plod apparently did agree with our point of view .. as they stripped them of Advanced Status and banned them from driving for the police for longer than their court given bans.

Thus .. I think it's fair to say that whilst we deplore speed cams .. most on here do not actually advocate driving like a loony hoony! In other words mate - safespeed means .. err .. "safe speed for the conditions at all times .. which may be marginally below and even marginally above at times if a situation dmands (as can be the case in the real world ) .. but not ever dangerous

Use of the horn Our COAST would usually nd normally as routine spot a horse rider. We may give a very light tap to another type of road user who seems unaware of approach at legal or speed compliant to conditions. At a hump back bridge or brow in daylight - the Highway Code rule 112 allows us to do this to warn of presence.




Then perhaps we need to examine why these drivers apparently take no notice of the VAS? Are they positioned properly? Are they followed up with signs such as THINK? Bike" as we've seen in some areas - including France, Germany and Switzerland?


[quote=GoodDruver?Sam"]
We are not doing anything that is illegal – but make no mistake everything we do is designed to make life difficult and inconvenient for passing motorists who wish to break the law. You could say that everyone is suffering because of those who speed.

There are no parking restrictions on the lanes – we park our cars there even if we have off road parking. We do NOT park near blind bends or on the brow of hills[/quote]

Personally - I'd rather keep my cars safe from idiots if they are as dangerous as you say. Repairs are expensive. The hassle of having a car fixed and this being recorded on its history and maybe affecting any residual value on resale is also a cost to think about ;scratchchin:.



Roads suffer wear and tear. If you tarmac and do not use the road .. weeds and general subsidence break up the roads. If any water freezes in any pothole/surface crack which cn include normal "polish from everday use" - this also breaks up the road even more. No one is suggesting your gritting is illegal by the way and shows you are trying to keep things safe in this aspect.



On the contrary - we home owners do have a duty of care to others and a council can order us to dig up or trim foliage. Failure to comply can result in council doing the job and sending you the bill We know of a case where this has happened in the Lancs Hills...


Two wrongs do not make a right and you may find that insurers may not pay for repairs to your property if they conclude this contributed to the outcome of any incident. We know .. we had the epic from hell in the past over a non-fault.


So my advice - go through the proper channels and do nothing which can add to the dangers you describe. You could be held to be creating some of them if you deliberately block vision.

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If you want to get to heaven - you have to raise a little hell!

Smilies are contagious
They are just like the flu
We use our smilies on YOU today
Now Good Causes are smiling too!

KEEP SMILING
It makes folk wonder just what you REALLY got up to last night!

Smily to penny.. penny to pound
safespeed prospers-smiles all round! !
But the real message? SMILE.. GO ON ! DO IT! and the world will smile with you!
Enjoy life! You only have the one bite at it.

Note to self .. Keep copy of "War and Peace" in car kit. Wave it around in such situation

_________________
If you want to get to heaven - you have to raise a little hell!

Smilies are contagious
They are just like the flu
We use our smilies on YOU today
Now Good Causes are smiling too!

KEEP SMILING
It makes folk wonder just what you REALLY got up to last night!

Smily to penny.. penny to pound
safespeed prospers-smiles all round! !
But the real message? SMILE.. GO ON ! DO IT! and the world will smile with you!
Enjoy life! You only have the one bite at it.

I'm currently reading Shirer: "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" which makes Tolstoy look like a page-turner, I can tell you. Perhaps I need to put that in my car!

Hang on, have I just triggered Godwin's Law?

Blimey .. that's one heavy read Yep .. will put that into tool kit too.

_________________
If you want to get to heaven - you have to raise a little hell!

Smilies are contagious
They are just like the flu
We use our smilies on YOU today
Now Good Causes are smiling too!

KEEP SMILING
It makes folk wonder just what you REALLY got up to last night!

Smily to penny.. penny to pound
safespeed prospers-smiles all round! !
But the real message? SMILE.. GO ON ! DO IT! and the world will smile with you!
Enjoy life! You only have the one bite at it.

Steve – We are not afraid of traffic police. But we are aware that petty drivers who discover our methods may deliberately try to disrupt them, for example, by use of the horn at every blind bend, by using the route more frequently or indeed by speeding at every opportunity. We have had off the record police advice which was wholly sympathetic – apparently parked cars are recognised in high places as having desirable traffic calming properties.

You write: “people have a habit of conveniently convoluting idiotic, highly dangerous, highly noticeable, and waaaaay too fast joyriders and boy racers, with safe, considerate and relatively inconspicuous commuters”

And why would this be? Maybe it is because the majority of the 28,000+ killed and seriously injured on the roads each year are not the victims of “boy racers” but the victims of those who think they are good drivers and that because they have paid their tax/insurance can drive in whatever way they like. Official figures show that middle aged drivers are the worst… and for the record, I am a middle aged driver. Our village does not have any problems with the kind of drivers you describe who are thankfully rare – our problems are with “otherwise law-abiding” drivers who pick and choose what laws they obey. I would add that whilst walking in our village we would prefer to be passed by illegal unlicensed / uninsured / untaxed drivers within the speed limit than by fully legal drivers who speed.

re: cameras – What could be fairer than speed limits having to be signed by law and repeated on roads where there are no street lights in 30mph areas or street lights in NSL areas or at any other speed? What could be fairer than cameras being signed and painted bright yellow? What could be fairer than having a 10% + 2mph leeway, particularly when speedometers tend to over read? I believe that speeding is unique in that it is the only criminal offence where you can get away with a fixed penalty without going to court. Talk about being soft on speeders. Anyway cameras clearly detect offences and save the police having to do it themselves therefore freeing up their time for other work. Personally we look forward the fast approaching day when all roads are covered by average speed cameras.

If speed limits are not, IN YOUR OPINION, set appropriately then you should take the advice that has been given to me and go through the proper channels in order to seek change rather than flout the law. Anyone genuinely concerned about the safety of the roads welcomes both traffic police and cameras. The bottom line is that if cameras were got rid of there would be no more police around than there are now – but a lot more speeders.

Re: “it (Safe Speed) also encourages limits to be set appropriately, as well as enforced fairly. It does not encourage anyone to act illegally.”

By stealth that’s exactly what this site does and the deeper I delve into it the more I realise this. One example is a posting from the late Mr Smith in which he boasts about travelling in a car at 90mph in a 30mph limit. Just what kind of message do you think this sends out? Boy racers do not set out to kill and believe that they do no harm – just like the “inconspicuous commuters” you refer to and the majority of drivers who frequent this site.

When it became clear that VAS were useless, we did indeed contact the LA. Only after years of getting nowhere did we start to take our own action. Wildcat, note - they are properly placed.

Anyway thank you Steve – you illustrate perfectly what we are up against. Drivers that they think everyone is at fault but themselves who refuse to believe that their own behaviour is dangerous. In these days of frustration about laws being unenforced and people literally getting away with murder you can be sure that our methods will be repeated. There is a reason why no one in power anywhere has ever taken any notice of this so-called safe speed campaign, it is no surprise that it appears to be on its knees? Meanwhile, we have solved the problem of lawbreaking in our village and will continue with our methods as long as it takes.

Finally, in response to your question: “What do your horse riders think of you sending them out amongst greatly frustrated “manics” on “blind bends”?

They have no idea what is going on. The official reason club riding times were changed from 3:00pm to 4:30pm was to acommodate for younger members after school. Anyhow, due entirely to our action traffic density at 4:30 is now similar to what it is at 3:00.

And to dear old graball…
As is normally the case, I have no idea what you are talking about. But your posts always amuse me… ha ha ha ha…. I wonder how many speeding tickets you have had…. ha ha ha ha…. And thanks for the lesson in salt!

And to Widlcat...
Thak you for your well intentioned advice. I can assure you that we did go through the local council for a solution and they didn't seen to care. The only reason we have been taking this action is because we really were at our wits end. We simply could not tollerate the danger and unpleasantness any longer. But the bottom line is our actions have worked. Of course if the council asked for shrubbery to be removed we would do so, but the overgrown shrubbery actually compliments the rural nature of the roads - so far no one has been asked to remove anything.

And finally, re turning into drives/reversing. You have given us a fantastic idea of advising all in our campaign to reverse into their drives from now on whenever there is a following car. Thanks - this should cause some hold ups!

Careful GOOD driver sam, you fit into this category. I hope that you enjoy your Dodo barbeque in the "village" tonight, don't forget to put lots of salt on it..... Just for your record, I have no speeding tickets ever, but if you want any lessons in "real life experiences" I will ask my neighbour's two small children to come round to give you some lessons in chemistry and other real life experiences that you may be lacking in...

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Hi Good Driver Sam .. I was going ot eply earlier but saw the Mad Lad had already posted up some stuff which, knowing him in the flesh. he hopes will help. I guess you may see some of his comments as a bit "lad-like" - but he's really "playing" .. trying to make you smile - et at the same time - asking the things which may make you think! He's a right devious devil in the real world too

Anyway - first of all. Can I congratulate you on salting the road in the winter. And can I reassure you that your salting is not causing the road surface to break. Ice, as you know, swells when solid. A bit like a bocked drain pipe in your kitchen or bathroom It places pressure on the road around it (or in the case of the drain .. the piping - and causes a rupture. By salting the road - you are perhaps preventing some further damage as you are probably treating this before the frozen moisture/water has a chance to undermine the road surface. I thus think any wear on the surface will be down to "normal wear and tear" which you can do nothing other than notify your local borough highways department over. I know from the CTC website that the general response will be "painting a yellow circle around it and no further action taken for months on end"




We admit to using the parked up plod car If the bend is dodgy though .. then as the Mad Lad says - Rule 112 of the Highway Code would permit a light tootle. At night - this does not apply as much as a driver normally sees dipped headlamps to alert him or her. However, the Mad Lad above does raise an important concern over foliage. If you block the view - a court (clever defence lawyer) will pounce on that. My advice wopuld be as the Mad Lad's . to prune things down.

Both me and the Mad Cats (Mad Moggie and Wildy Cat and the Torkshire based "felines") often holiday in Brittany . We noted a sign around the Rose Granite Coast which showed a kid on a bike . asking drivers to just think about him. This was repeated along the coastal road. We did not note anyone driving at high speeds there. You could as a community collective get planning permission for similar signage. Over there .. I think they did not need it. Over here .. red tape means you do It's why the person who erected "WPC Hairdrier" had to remove her. She did not have "planning permission" I admit to finding it odd that I do not need planning permission for a single storey extension .. but would need it to tarmac part of the front lawn (if I so wish .. but I happen to like and enjoy tending a garden :wink) and apparently would need similar to erect a "large straw scarecrow" which was basically what the WPC in question was BUT.. We were already auditing the road in question - and the Speed cam wielding scarecrow rather undermined the results. "She" was very lifelike But we wanted to establish whether or not we needed to deploy the cam van or a "chancer lurk" and this scarecrow seemed to show a "slow for the perceived threat" but no overall increased courtesy/awareness beyond her. She thus "had to go" For record - van does its rounds there now ..




I keep and repeatedly advise all to never forget COAST Here? We have a mix. Durham has a good record compared to national average. We have a high DIS offer and Prosecution for Careless rate . and a very low prosecution rate for speeding compared to the national averal We have one fixed Gatso (somewhere We move it around SO it's not really "fixed"

However... we find middle aged "born again bikers" are our worst stats - followed by serious criminals who use our roads to get from our North to the South.. We also find we have pockets of boy racers who cause mayhem..


The average middle aged and middle classed driver? Most are complacent and thus very dangerous. They refute COAST. They become abusive to folk who remind about COAST too. You only need to look up archives on PH for replies to the Wild Cat and Mad Moggie for such examples. Those individuals perhaps fit your rather worrying real stereotype. Most posting on this site - thankfully - do not. I have been chattiing to the late Paul Smith on phone and on here since 2004. I chat via posts to all others here. I have never suggested "drive at an illegal speed" and usually alluded to the Highway Code/RTA 1988 and given an insight to good practice via my own training by the way. I have been sympathetic to those who want some advice when copped for whatever though. They are asking for comfort and I give them the truth with a dose of honey when I can I would be less than a human being if I did not


I do not give false hope .. but I hope I explain the situation without stripping of any dignity. I try to get them to learn COAST values from their mistakes. I hope I make the roads a bit safer by doing so. To me .. little point in "rubbing a nose into a mess", It achieves . what exactly? I've adopted the same attitude when faced with folk I've arrested who have actually attacked me with intent to do harm to me. Keep calm and never let yourself be fazed - never ever stoop to their level - that's the professionalism required.




Our real experience is that the illegal unlicenced has zero regard for any law


Who is doing the speeding here? We find it's usually locals in situations such as you describe. The Swiss have Kantonal referenda to resolve. Germans have local initiatives which put pressue on local councils to take action. Maybe the UK has to develop similar? Just to get the issues addressed by police and council? For record sam.. complain to us .. we audit it thoroughly and take action as required




Bad driving is bad driving and speed ain't the real problem. You can be dangerous and slow. We have examples of kids being killed in driveways.. pulling out in front of another vehicle.. One woman was jailed for performing a U-turn with scant regard for the biker she killed by pulling out in front of him from a lay-by at low speed.

DO an FOI on us. You find we have a high and successful prosecition and ban outcome rate for careless-dangerous. High DIS offers too. Lower than average porsecutions for speeding and record as constant the safest roads in UK - KSI stat-wise

You find we do not do fixed /SPEC cams .. but do do a van and have all cars in fleet equipped with all the toys available. As Garvin famously remarked in one of his many press interviews






We have a full RPU and officers applying for available places. We and N Yorks have RPU still at 1980 levels. We know others have culled their units. Oh y the way ,, we combined RPU with horses/dog and Armed Response Units. .. Err.. it means we have nasty dogs .. nice horses.. and .. umm ... guns


If as Swindon . you remove the fixed cam . you move to more cam van/RPU backing. Ummm .. more plod. As said .. we never went down that route .. but we have a reputation of "Hardline" and tougher than most Do not ever speed here. by the way. You will find we do as I post

But sam .. please get ward councillors to back you. Write to local RPU .. address to Chief Inspector. If no joy .. send copy to CC. Write to local press. Kick up stink of the smelliest you can here.

If you have VAS and it's being ignored... point this out. Identify the type who ignore those signs. Get police to do this for you.



















I refer to defences put by so-called plod on PH re Milton. PAH! For record .. no one here .. does such daftness.




Then why is no one taking any darned notice of them? For record// the Mad Cats do not actually speed. They are controlled and disciplined .. but can still "let rip in Germany and on track" I know.. I spent a day with Wildy in her car after she got the nod from her medics. Note ./. the girl refused to drive until judged fit to do so after a very nasty childbirth experience which "knocked her out" I took her out on track. She was on form. She wants me to assess her on public roads again before she hits the road to Staveley Her logic? She hit the rock bottom healthwise after giving birht to twin in her forties. She was quite ill in reality. Her medics told her not to drive. She followed their advice to the letter. That lady.. inisisted on driving lessons again after this enforced break. I think this shows up her calibre and character I am not saying this as a kinsman to her. She's unique and a model to follow in my objective opinion here.




Please prune your foliage. It adds to your problem.



Riding schools around here have flashng led lighs on their hi-viz jackets.



It may not be "established" yet then, Please keep the foliage to acceptable levels then and ignore my earlier comment Do not give up on council .. You need to keep on petitioning and as the mad lad suggested KNOCK ON DOORS there.

My advice ls like the mad doc and his wild wife .. well intentioned and hoping to help? We are NOT condoning stupid fools. - but simply thinking of how you may resolve your problem here. And ..yep .. we do see your problem. We accept it may not be as simple as we are reading it. But do expand. I would hate to think you think no one cares here. We do. Can you state problem without attacking the late Paul Smith and upsetting his widow? Paul and me? We agreed on some things.. agreed to disagree as pals on other "sundries" of varying significances .. and retained full respect as a result.


I support Claire as a pal and hope I soothe her grief. Sam . Your posts will hurt a woman who feels a very deep sense of loss of a loved one. The late Paul Smith made good points. There were a few things we plods could contest.. but overall.. he made valid points which merit respect. Now does that sound fair to you. The late Paul conceded the value of VOAST by the way His widow embraces its value. Me? I simply say how we mark DIS and SAC .. and I stand by that mark sheet 100%.

COAST [i[works[/i] You say you still have problems. That means you have to seriously go back to counci;/police and work out why. There must be some thing ..take a close llook at how your roads are engineered. Ask HARD questions in all lobbies to council.

AUDIT well. Keep logs.. records. photos. video evidence. But go through official channels .. and if this fails .. HIT local press and national tabloids.

\not .. I ma not without sympathey .. but you must get LA to see the problems here., SO make waves to locally elected ward councillors and local MP . Let us know how things progress for you here.

Yes .. despite the banter . tongue in cheek..to make you think of the devil's gremlin on shoulder - I know and understand you. But please do growl more at local council and police. Keep up the pressure. By doing so . you perhaps achieve? I hope I am bing fair to all in this post.


I would hope a following car would be keeping a normal 2 second response gap and able to stop safely on own side fo road in distance seen to be clear... which means they would not be speeding if that be the case But use COAST .. communicate with the other road users \by doing so . you communicate .. make it safer for you and them idiots too. Two wrongs do not make things right. Please keep this in mind in your campaign . which I understand . but stress to keep it all legal and make sure no person/insurer can wag fingers.

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

Any EXPERIENCED driver would know that it is always advisable to reverse into a drive way or parking space whenever possible. If you don't reverse in it means,that unless you have space to turn around, that you have to reverse OUT anyway which means a) you are reversing into traffic or possibly pedestrians, b)in the mornings your windows may be frozen or misted up giving less visibility, c) your engine will be cold and may be more likely to stall.

(just a public service tip for lesser experienced drivers)

_________________
My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Re gritting ...perhaps Good Driver Sam should read this thread

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=19933


I would park my car in my driveway ... I only reverse into the driveways if family live in the burbs, I have fairly longish driveway here as it used to be a farm.. and where we will be living in USA .. has a nice long driveway too

Had a thought though.. Ages ago .. I posted up about Lancs Plod Moggiemobile Now .. all they have to do is park her up and she's so drop dead gorgeous that everyone slows to have a right good drool

Sam - how's about buying a really heart stopping "harem" (not mine - not sellin' me toys just cos we're going to be living in USA for 3 years or more) - but you can get a couple of lovelies - and the nice thing is that some can appreciate in value as collectors will always bite. Just parking one up safely but "proudly marking her scent"? There sorted. You only need the one really!

_________________
If you want to get to heaven - you have to raise a little hell!

Smilies are contagious
They are just like the flu
We use our smilies on YOU today
Now Good Causes are smiling too!

KEEP SMILING
It makes folk wonder just what you REALLY got up to last night!

Smily to penny.. penny to pound
safespeed prospers-smiles all round! !
But the real message? SMILE.. GO ON ! DO IT! and the world will smile with you!
Enjoy life! You only have the one bite at it.

I never knew that, can you source that please? Seems at odds with insurance premiums being lowest for the middle-aged.