Safe Speed Forums

The campaign for genuine road safety
It is currently Fri May 08, 2026 11:59

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 20:20 
Offline
Friend of Safe Speed
Friend of Safe Speed
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 10:16
Posts: 7986
Location: Moved to London
BBC.co.uk wrote:

Letter delay man wins speed case

A man charged with speeding has had his conviction quashed because a postal strike led to his notification letter being delivered too late.

Peter Gidden, 48, of Dodworth, South Yorkshire, received his letter two days late after a postal strike in 2007.

The law states that police must send notice of intention to prosecute within 14 days of an alleged offence.

On Thursday the High Court ruled that the conviction was not legal because the time limit had not been met.

Mr Gidden was caught on a speed camera doing 85mph (137km/h) on the M180 in Lincolnshire in October 2007.

But a backlog of mail caused by a postal strike at the time held up the letter sent by police.

'Matter of principle'

He received it after 16 days had passed.

Following his decision, Lord Justice Elias said the case was relevant to the current postal strikes and said the law may have to be revised to avoid similar issues in the future.

He said: "The authorities must adopt other means of warning, if they are to avoid the risk of late delivery.

"Alternatively, the remedy lies in the hands of Parliament by amending...the 1988 [Road Traffic Offenders] Act."


Mr Gidden had previously appealed against the conviction at Grimsby Crown Court and Scunthorpe Magistrates' Court.

The High Court quashed his conviction and set aside fines and legal costs totalling £680. They also wiped three penalty points from his licence.

His legal fees of £8,000 will be paid for from public funds.

"In a way this is a matter of principle", Mr Gidden said.

"Law enforcers have to work within the law to gain the respect of the general public."


Note the part I've highlighted....

_________________
Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 20:34 
Offline
Gold Member
Gold Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 14:26
Posts: 4364
Location: Hampshire/Wiltshire Border
The Government will, of course, make the changing of this law the highest priority. :roll:

_________________
Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 20:51 
Offline
Friend of Safe Speed
Friend of Safe Speed
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:19
Posts: 1795
They could so easily send out NIPs via recorded delivery. Personally I think it is scandalous that such important mail is sent out in ordinary post. If for example your insurance company were to send out a policy cancellation they have to send several letters and one of them has to be recorded delivery to abide by the GISC rules as was. I don't think any court or police documentation should be sent out by anything other than recorded delivery. If it is signed for at the other end it reduces the opportunity for people to claim it hasn't arrived too.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 01:59 
Offline
Friend of Safe Speed
Friend of Safe Speed
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 23:09
Posts: 6737
Location: Stockport, Cheshire
I thought the evidence of posting was considered sufficient.

If not, this drives a coach and horses through the law, especially in the content of the current postal strikes.

I agree with teabelly that if these communications are so important, they should send them by recorded delivery.

Arguably, since this is supposedly a criminal offence, the law should require the personal service of a summons by a police officer.

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:48 
Offline
Life Member
Life Member
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 21:17
Posts: 3734
Location: Dorset/Somerset border
Nice to see he had his legal fees paid.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 04:49 
Offline
Member
Member

Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 14:04
Posts: 2325
Location: The interweb
PeterE wrote:
I thought the evidence of posting was considered sufficient.


I thought it had to be posted "to arrive" no later than 14 days after? In which case the postal strikes would be relevant as they would have known there was a good chance of it being delayed.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 07:49 
Offline
Supporter
Supporter
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 13:45
Posts: 4042
Location: Near Buxton, Derbyshire
Quote:
I don't think any court or police documentation should be sent out by anything other than recorded delivery. If it is signed for at the other end it reduces the opportunity for people to claim it hasn't arrived too.


But what if the recipient refused to take delivery? Or what if it were signed by some one else at the address who didn't pass it on?

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:54 
Offline
User

Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 04:10
Posts: 3244
http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=87

What USUALLY happens (and has happened to me) is that the police will send the NIP to the PREVIOUS keeper of the vehicle stating that the dvla had that as the address of the present keeper. You then notify them that it is not the case and they send the nip to the right person....the "14 day rule" is satisfied by that....until you tell the new keeper and he/she tells you that they changed the details ages ago...and you ask the dvla and they say "errr..but the new keeper was notified ages ago...and you are not it"....I told the police that I had told the new keeper about the correct changes and also told him about the 14 day rule....case over.

_________________
The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 20:43 
Offline
User

Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2008 14:14
Posts: 131
PeterE wrote:
I thought the evidence of posting was considered sufficient.

If not, this drives a coach and horses through the law, especially in the content of the current postal strikes.

I agree with teabelly that if these communications are so important, they should send them by recorded delivery.

Arguably, since this is supposedly a criminal offence, the law should require the personal service of a summons by a police officer.


According to C/Constable Hughes SYP this is not considered to be a criminal offence. After contacting him on his latest NIP he stated that "this was an alternetive" and "was not a criminal offence". They come up with all kinds of sh-t when it is in their own interest. They are nothing more than hypercrits of the highest order,the lot of them.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 21:24 
Offline
User

Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 04:10
Posts: 3244
ABD story.

Quote:
The Postal Dispute gives the Crown Prosecution Service & speed camera partnerships no hiding place regarding NIP delivery
A Court decision (R v Gidden) has reinforced the precedent regarding the duty of care that the CPS & Speed Camera Partnerships must respect, regarding the delivery of NIPs (Notices of Intended Prosecution).

The verdict confirms that the CPS/Camera Partnership must ensure delivery of NIPs, for e.g., speed-related motoring offences, to registered keepers within 14 days of the alleged offence.

Industrial action, such as the current postal workers' intermittent strike actions, cannot be used as an excuse to extend this period beyond 14 days.

Those defendants/registered keepers who can demonstrate a failure on the part of the CPS/ Camera Partnership to effect NIP delivery within the 14-day period will be able to defend the allegation.
*************Be careful though because if you know who was driving you still need to name the driver. A defective NIP is only a defence to the original offence and not a defence to failing to name the driver***************

Those interested in, or potentially affected by, the above developments should contact Emma Patterson at Patterson Law solicitors:
http://www.pattersonlaw.co.uk
e.patterson@pattersonlaw.co.uk

_________________
The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 402 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
[ Time : 0.180s | 13 Queries | GZIP : Off ]