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PeterE
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 15:22 
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Seen on another forum, posted by someone I would regard as very unlikely to be making it up:

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According to details my colleagues have recieved, ACPO have changed there thresholds and have got approval from Central Government as Government want to reduce costs for the CPO (floowing the CSR) , involved in taking speeding offences through court. This is a national approach and the police will be responsible for all speed enforcement come April 1st as the Road SAfety Partnerships go, following the withdrawalal of funding. Thames Valley Road Safety Partnership will be no more come April 1st.

The new guidelines will be Speed Limit + 10% + 3mph, ie up to 80mph in a 70mph, 36mph in a 30mph.

Then between this thresehold and (Speed Limit + 10% + 3mph) + 10% , ie 88mph in a 70mph and 40mph in a 30mph, no fixed penalty or points will be issued, but the driver can a take a driver awareness course at a cost of £80. Above this 2nd threshold there are points and fine. The police will take all the revenue from the speed awareness courses, which will be used towards policing following obviouisly deducting the costs of the courses.

What is unclear is how many driver awareness courses you can attend before you get the points. In Thames Valley, currently, it is one driver awarness course, then your next offence is points, if the 2nd offence occurs within 3 years of the course, which is equilvent to how long points are valid for on your licence.

These new thresholds will come in to being in the new year.

If correct, I can't see the likes of BRAKE being too happy about that :twisted:

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theboxers
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 17:46 
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PeterE wrote:
PeterE wrote:
Seen on another forum

Then between this thresehold and (Speed Limit + 10% + 3mph) + 10% , ie 88mph in a 70mph and 40mph in a 30mph, no fixed penalty or points will be issued, but the driver can take a driver awareness course at a cost of £80.

If correct, I can't see the likes of BRAKE being too happy about that :twisted:

No penalty, no points and you are asked to attend a course. What happens if you choose to not do the course. :tumbleweed:
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jomukuk
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 18:38 
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Well, if you do the course some of the cash may be diverted to fund The Scamera Pratnerships....
If you don't you may well be fined and points dumped on your licence.
Either way they get your cash.

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Johnnytheboy
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 19:50 
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What if you drove through the same camera at the "course but no points" speed twice a day for a month?
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toonbarmy
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 20:15 
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the way i understand it 35mph - 39mph is currently a SAC, i have always wondered what would happen if i got done, say at 35mph offfered a SAC but did not go, i would have complied with the S172 requirement
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Pete317
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 20:44 
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Have they really now changed, "speed awareness courses" to "driver awareness courses"?
The name might have changed, but the content is probably the same. I hope I never have to attend one of those courses and listen to all that c**p, because I'd probably end up biting my lip right off. :(

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Mole
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 23:13 
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I'll believe it when I see it!

However, despite what everyone might think, I'm NOT actually that elated at the prospect! The problem is that they're STILL not focussing on the real issue. It's not about a particular number, limit or margin, it's about whether or not what you're doing is posing a danger! :headbash:

I'd be perfectly happy to see a copper pull someone for speeding at 75 or even less on the motorway, IF the conditions (e.g. snow like there was on the M6 yesterday or fog) warranted it, and I'd expect them to let someone get away with MORE than 88 in other more appropriate circumstances!
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Pete317
PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 23:58 
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Mole wrote:
However, despite what everyone might think, I'm NOT actually that elated at the prospect! The problem is that they're STILL not focussing on the real issue. It's not about a particular number, limit or margin, it's about whether or not what you're doing is posing a danger! :headbash:


Exactly. They're punishing people, not for posing any actual danger to anyone, but rather for being statistically marginally more likely to have an accident. I mean, it's not as if travelling any slower than one actually does is going to prevent any accident which actually happens from happening now, is it? Unless, I suppose, you've fallen down a rather deep rabbit hole :wink:

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malcolmw
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 09:02 
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Might this be seen as an admission that limits have been unnecessarily lowered so much now that enforcement needs to be changed?

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Big Tone
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:34 
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I don’t see it as particularly helpful lowering National Speed Limits to :40: while raising the ceiling of prosecution. :banghead:

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.
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Pete317
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 13:40 
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Big Tone wrote:
I don’t see it as particularly helpful lowering National Speed Limits to :40: while raising the ceiling of prosecution. :banghead:


They appear to have this misguided belief that people tend to drive at a certain amount above the speed limit, whatever the speed limit happens to be.
This is untrue. People will only exceed a limit in significant numbers if they perceive the limit as being too low, and, conversely, will tend to drive at below the limit if they perceive the limit as being on the high side - not that there's too many of those around nowadays.
You can't force people to comply with artificially low limits.

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Big Tone
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 16:53 
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Quite right Pete.

The next (il)logical step will be to lower each and every :30: to a :20: in the hope that drivers will only be about 8 mph over the limit. :banghead:

Someone should educate them about the 85th percentile.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.
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Toltec
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 18:39 
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Big Tone wrote:
Quite right Pete.

The next (il)logical step will be to lower each and every :30: to a :20: in the hope that drivers will only be about 8 mph over the limit. :banghead:

Someone should educate them about the 85th percentile.


I think 20 is plenty.


Well it was for the conditions on Wednesday evening, spent 45 minutes digging the car clear then 20 minutes getting into Bromley - which would be quick for that time of day in normal conditions. :D

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malcolmw
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 19:32 
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Funnily enough, while I was driving at lunchtime, I thought that the recently introduced 30mph limits in the previously NSL road outside our factory were, at last, appropriate for the conditions.

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Malcolm W.
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Pete317
PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 21:07 
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malcolmw wrote:
Funnily enough, while I was driving at lunchtime, I thought that the recently introduced 30mph limits in the previously NSL road outside our factory were, at last, appropriate for the conditions.


I'm assuming that very few, if any, people did anything close to 60mph while it was NSL.

Am I right?

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malcolmw
PostPosted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 14:01 
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Basically, yes. Few people would complain at a 40mph limit in this area as most used to drive (and, ignoring the limit, still do) at approximately 45mph. This is probably the 85th percentile speed.

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Malcolm W.
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