Safe Speed Forums

I was going over the changes to the Driving test found this here and noticed that it states that you will be forgiven for going up a curb! Now I find that quite worrying ... surely if you don't know where the curb is how can you be truly safe. Failing to get the curb right shows lack of spacial awareness, ability to observe and judge and even ignoring touching the curb and managing to go up onto it. That shows a lack of care is OK ans that cannot be right as that erodes independent ability.
I see for the independent part of the test too there can be directions and repeats too (fair enough), but this has happened with (mine certainly) bike test for years ... and at the expense of doing one of the manoeuvres like reversing round a corner or park .... as the test is still remaining at approx 40 mins.
Plus I notice that now only 1 in 3 will do the emergency stop ! That is also very worrying - isn't it?

Also see here : government here... and here ... and DVLA IT details here.
(and a related associated topic for making new policy here.)

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

Extremely worrying. I would have thought that, proving you have the ability to stop correctly and within a reasonable time, is the MOST important part of driving.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

The emergency stop, one-in-three, has been that way for years.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Has there been any advance in driving tuition to anticipate the need for an emergency stop,or teaching new drivers that the need for one requires an analysis of the events both perceived and missed that led up to the need for an emergency stop.
IMHO- the need for one means that I have failed in anticipation.

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

At least it still means, (I hope) that all pupils will still be taught how to do an emergency stop and hopefully it will be performed on a regular basis, during tuition and not one lesson in twenty or so.

Even though an "emergency stop" is something that you shouldn't have to do or at least not many times in a lifetime, it is still an important manouvere that needs to be experienced (as should driving on slippy surfaces really) for that moment when it may be needed. I love to ski and ski fast but anyone learning to ski, without learning a parallel stop as soon as possible, is a danger on the slopes.

if pupils aren't asked to perform one regularly when under tuition (and tested on it, ideally) , how are they expected to react correctly if a child was to run out in front of them, without warning, when they are left to their own devices.

I really can't think of any manouvere on the test, that is more important to be tested.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Is it just me though, or is the emergency stop one of the easiest to do? I found the left hand reverse much harder. I'd probably also find the paralell parking harder than an emergency stop if I took my test again today.

Agree with you 100%. No judgement need for the emergency stop on the test. The instructor won't order it unless it is absolutely safe to do one. S0 just stamp very hard with both feet and grip the wheel with white knuckles.

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

The "emergency stop" has been a 1-in-3 since 1999, I have not noticed that there has been a dramatic increase in rear-end shunts since then.
What the "instructor" orders is irrelevant, the EXAMINER will have been checking traffic and pedestrians and will not give the signal to stop the vehicle as in an emergency if there is any issue of safety.
The "emergency stop" will not be a "stab the pedal and hold on", since you will have to stop the vehicle under control during the maneuver.
Another thing to bear-in-mind is that there is a trade-off here.....the driver doing the e-stop will not be doing either the three-point-turn or the reverse-around-a-corner maneuver.
Consider that some part of your test will be on a dual carriageway, at which you will be expected to drive at, or near, the signed speed limit for that part of the test.
You would be surprised how many drivers fail the test for not being aware of what the speed limit is........you only have one mark allowed for that....do it twice and your test will fail.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

I agree with Mole and DCB, that an emergency stop is probably a lot easier than a reverse round corner but how many more people are going to be injured/inconvenienced or even killed, by someone unable to stop quickly and in control in an emergency, by comparison to people being injured by someone reversing round a corner untidely?

Personally I find reversing tidely round corners to be a pain, even now, compared to something (probably a lot more safety beneficial), like correcting a tail out skid on snow (and that's probably because I have done the latter far more times than the former) but for a novice driver to go around without the experience (and the skill to do it correctly),of doing several emergency stops, is asking for trouble when the time comes to do that emergency stop, in (what may be) a life or death scenario.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Emergency stop was a challenge in the days before ABS.

Now it's just a matter of hitting two pedals and holding the wheel straight.

That's ok if a) you assume everyone has good reactions and can appreciate what to do in that "once in a lifetime moment" or just pause and think, until it is too late
and b) doesn't ever drive a car without ABS

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

brings back fond memories of drum brakes/cross ply tyres etc .



FYI- last firm/s van and this car are first I've Driven in over 44 years with ABS .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

I bet you found the ABS a nuisance on snow then...

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Bloody awfull actually! All it seems to do is stop you stopping!

All very alarming if you are not expecting it!

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"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

not really -don't really rely on brakes too much,especially in snow - match engine speed to road speed is more effective , and if I brake ,I overcome any ABS problems with cadence .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Which is exactly why manufacturers had to invent all these new-fangled "brake assist" or "panic assist" systems!

As soon as the ABS starts doing the job it was designed to do, people who aren't used to it start cadence braking and end up stopping later than if they'd just kept their foot planted on the brakes! I'm going to be a bit provocative here and say that cadence braking these days is one of those skills (like stating an engine with a starting handle) that we just don't need any more.

Possibly-but I'm in control, and allow extra distance ,just n case .But it's very seldom that I've had ABS cut in on me .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

The reason ABS doesn't work well on snow or gravel, and this is not just my opinion but something that I have read as well as experienced, is that when braking on soft or fresh snow, the braking works best when a wedge of snow or gravel is formed under the wheels. ABS , by releasing the wheels when they lock, defeats the wedge effect and so it takes longer to stop on snow or gravel.

I've got two cars, one with and one without and no matter how gently I brake, the non ABS will always stop better on fresh snow.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

graball-similar thoughts, but I thought it was something I'd hear in passing . Another thought- ABS ,by design ,comes in when the wheels lock.Experience tells me when to release the brakes ,and I try to do it when I judge the wheels are close to ,but not locked .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

By "googling" around you can find reports of why ABS doesn't work too well on snow and gravel. The NHTSA in america, openly admits that the stopping distance on snow is greater using ABS. Apparently, it's not just the wedge effect that helps but the fact that a locked wheel will dig into the snow and find grip below the snow surface, whereas a non locked wheel , will remain on top of the snow where the friction is less.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.