Safe Speed Forums

Are these actual legal limits ? Reason i ask is that I've spotted A group of ( from a newspaper article i believe to be PCSO) ,uniforms yesterday acting as if they were enforcing. Visible distance for drivers to be aware -from Google satelite & Autoroute approx 80 yds . Time - round about lunch time . Article in paper did mention that concers had been raised about speed on certain roads . I'd suggest that this one would have problems about 8.30 in morning. Problem is that I've never seen any reports in the past few years about speeding/accidents in this area .Years ago we( local RA) were asked by mothers to try and get a pedestrian crossing in that area . Result- no sufficient problem reported by county council . Meanwhile whilst a group of about six PCSO were prancing about and blocking a footpath ,we had a sighting of a rare animal in this area -a PC ( stab vest over HI VIZ said "POLICE") walking the beat . Meanwhile i keep getting NHW reports of burglaries in this area . Peter E 's avature says it all .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

My own initial thought is yes. From the Highway Code which I last read about 30 years ago, to my shame, I remember the red circle to mean prohibitive.

Therefore, this being the case, I would say it simply comes down to if the will is there you can be done. No doubt once they see rich pickings to be had they will start setting traps in these places too; all in the name of safety of course.

20 is plenty don’t ya know. Next year “only a fool breaks the 10mph rule” followed by “doing 5 will keep all alive”. I don’t know why they don’t they just cut to the chase with ”keep death off the road, stay in your abode”.

There was a young man from Kent
Who drove with malicious intent
So don’t tell a fib
It was you killed a kid
He’s round your bumper all twisted and bent.

But it wasn’t my dastardly deed
You can’t blame it all on my speed
He should have been taught
Or so you’d have thought
The Green Cross Code is a need

So an inquest was held and they found
That the driver’s reasoning was sound
But they jailed him the same
It's a political game
And all drivers are easy to hound

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

Tone- love that ryhme . Just seen a bit in local rag. Was al done "as a response to local safety complaints" . Six reports, a few other letters sent out. But as a response to my complaints to PCC hoastings - nil points . Drug dealer still gets customers. And as said ,when we asked for a crossing- "NO need ,there's no cause ".

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

And over here we have a city centre wide 20 limit to compliment the shared space junctions

(Both of which I think are actually for the most part reasonable but I did wonder if the 20 is enforcible)

Let's be clear about this. Are we talking about LIMITS imposed for a limited distance via the usual roundel signage or 20mph ZONES which only have entry gate signage and are intended to be self-enforcing?

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

Limits (don't know about the paperwork side of it) with entry and exit roundels ( , ) over a distance of about 1mile, with speed humps . ( For Ed - it's from the cock & bear bridfge to Lamb & flag) . From an article in a local paper it seems that complaints, on speeding issues , from the public have been made . I know that complaints have been made of pavement obstruction about another hundred yards further on ,but I've never seen any action to remove obstructions .( Clearasnce left between cars and terraced houses means that prams must be taken on to the road ).

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

What do you think the response would be if I put in a complaint to the council about speeds being far too low on local roads? Or is this just a one way street?

My rationale would be that the persistent low speeds cause a continuous stream of cars with no breaks to allow pedestrians to cross.

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

They’d want proof Malcolm and even then they wouldn’t believe you; such is the obsession with slowing everything down.

Actually, here’s an interesting question I think.. Has anyone known any road where the limit has been increased instead?

I can think of only one, a long time ago, a duel cabbageway near me. I’ve mentioned it on SS before. I got done on it in 1975/6 for doing something just over 40mph in what was then a 30 limit. A year or more after that, the limit was changed up to 40mph, which peed me off for obvious reasons (My earliest memory of stupid law enforcement and feeling of persecution).

The stupid thing is back then there wasn’t a single car parked along it which made the view all around very good; it was almost like being on a two lane motorway. Today, however, there are cars and vans parked almost all along that same stretch and more often than not I go less than the 40mph limit in places because I think it’s too fast when there are parked cars.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I've had a look at the road signs manual . The ones in place at two entry points to the 20 are similar to 674/5 (
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2002 ... 113_en_065)
.One other entry has been spray painted . Does this make the signs non standard and the limit unenforceable . ( The mention of political /advertising material being banned on the signs makes me wonder). Think I'll see what my local County councillor thinks ,but he's one of those who's under fire from the speed kils brigade .
I've never seen any limit raised ,although last time WCC officers tried to do a bit of cutting ,the police & councillors objected that much that a lot of reductiuomns got thrown out .
Same road( that was being enforced) has projections of the pavement and one has lost it's bollartds some time ago . It nearly caught me out and I can see it's been bit a few times by the tyre marks .But my request for new bollards got ignored till I sent in a reminder CC county councillor .

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Been for trip to Aldi (at the other end of the limit ) . The end of limit sign is almost obscured by a house end ,and the entry in the direction of the observed enforcement is a few yards after a bus stop .

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Not to forget that at 20- the pollution will be much worse than at 30/40/50...
But then, if pollution increases they will attempt to ban vehicles because of it...except buses of course...

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

I've had a look on Google at another set of limit signs in the same area . One sign ( exit) is half hidden by the gable end of a house .It entry sign is (approx) a bus length AFTER a bus stop ,and looks roughly the same height as the bus stop -so given that the service using that stop is advertised as every 10 min and I've seen the bus at that stop for a good few minutes makes visibility a joke .
What is so strange is that on the other side of town is a and down hill there's the usual .But uphill there's a side road where I'm told traffic cars sit .

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Yes absolutely 20 can be enforced, it sits in a red roundel with black lettering and white background and fits the right size and lighting if lit then yes. A policeman could stop you for 21 mph if they so wished. It would be unusual but possible. Last I read they were looking to add powers of traffic enforcement to PCSO's but can't say that I have seen that as confirmed - yet!

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

Interesting.
1) Does it need to have permanant lighting ?
2) Local press stated that PCSO were being trained to enforce . I'm certain from the back view of the HI Viz that these were PCSO(blue square onin the middle ,too large to contain just police)
3) Today I had drive past the other end of the limit. Outside a house was parked a Mondeo. with the front just past the entry limit sign, and I would "geustimate) that another would fill in the space back to the end of the bus layby .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Diagrams 674 and 675 only need to be reflectorised.

Solved one point -thanks .
What about the visibility aspect ,wrt the proximity of the bus stop and height of the limit sign ?

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

I thought speedos were only supposed to be accurate at 25 or over? Something i read somewhere, making any lower speed unenforceable.
See no.3 here:- http://forums.pepipoo.com/lofiversion/i ... t9405.html

From wikipedia -

The Motor Vehicles (Approval) Regulations 2001[12] permits single vehicles to be approved. As with the UNECE regulation and the EC Directives, the speedometer must never show an indicated speed less than the actual speed. However it differs slightly from them in specifying that for all actual speeds between 25 mph and 70 mph (or the vehicles' maximum speed if it is lower than this), the indicated speed must not exceed 110% of the actual speed, plus 6.25 mph.

But i seem to remember something else ( can't find any source) that the speedo lower limit was 10mph, below this it is considered innaccurate .
There was an old post on car parks with limits of 5mph ,and this cropped up .

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

From TSM Chapter 3:

"SITING

1.15 It is essential that drivers have an unobstructed view of traffic signs. The distance which should be kept clear of obstructions to the sight line, whether caused by vegetation, other signs or street furniture, is known as the clear visibility distance. The higher the prevailing traffic speeds, the greater this distance needs to be."

So possibly the bus stop sign could be a problem, I wouldn't have thought the bus itself would cause a great problem. The mounting height (assuming it's over a footway) should be a minimum of 2.3m with an absolute minimum of 2.1m

I'd be more concerned about the contractor who installed signs behind the gable end of a house!

Photo says it all
First an over all view



And a bit closer


The 20 limit starts at roughly the white van ( lamp post) . Note that the limit sign is lower than the bus stop , and the distance between the bus stop sifn and the limit can be estimated from the car in the first photo .

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on