Safe Speed Forums

have there been any studies on this?

I expect most of the posters on here are in agreement that speeding laws are enforced the way they are for 3 main reasons; revenue, good police "offences dealt with" success rates and council commitments to meet government targets to show they are tackling road safety, (however ineffective this may be is another arguement). simarly menial parking offences are dealt with as a means of revenue. Consequently generally law-abiding motorists find themselves criminalised in a way disproportionate to the "crime" committed, when measured against most other offences.

What effect does this have on the psyche of a once innocent driver?

Apart from a due care & attention rap relating to a small incident not long after passing my test I have not been in trouble with the law, i boast 9 years no claims bonus on my car insurance and a clean licence. I try to adopt a professional & courteous attitude to driving. Yet in 2002 i spent six months working for a call-out concern (I'm an electrician) and amounted around £1000's worth of parking tickets, about 75% of which were for being 1 minute over on a meter. Now i drive around london, every day I see people making illegal left/right turns, people ignoring pedestrians at crossings, people jumping lights, people blocking yellow boxes, and so on. All of whom seem to get away with it. I know people who drink drive all the time and get away with it. And gradually, a distinction between whats illegal and whats actually enforced becomes apparant. And as any animal adapts to it's enviroment, surely drivers react to the way traffic laws are enforced.

for instance, you see a shop on a main road and you want a pack of fags. you have two choices.

option 1: Stop right outside the shop on the main road, possibly on zig-zags, double yellows, blocking traffic etc for 30 seconds whilst you pop in & out. chances of getting a ticket are very low cos you're in & out before one can be written and the vans in view all the time

option 2: find a sensible parking space a couple on minutes away on a side road and walk back to the shop. however this happens to be permit-only, or P&D machines aren't working, and the van will be left for 5 minutes. chances of getting a ticket: in london, very high.

so in effect you are forced to take the dangerous, ignorant and inconsiderate approach as doing the sensible thing will get you penalised by parking-revenue officers.

in time all respect for law enforcement and the highway code must surely diminish as once you commit one offence, it's a smaller step to the next offence and so on. same with getting a speeding ticket, now you are no longer a proud safe driver with a clean licence, you're already a criminal with reduced respect for the law and those that enfore it.

so am i just paranoid or is anyone getting my drift? i'd love to know what those trained in psychology make of this view.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

My original beef with speed cameras and it's enforcement was because, as you put it the punishment is "dispropotionate" to the crime commited. It angers me to see burglars and shoplifters given pathetic punishments that don't mean anything to them, but whereas a driver getting even just 3 points can have a massive effect on their life. That can mean the difference between being able to apply for a new job and not.

However, others may disagree but I haven't personallly lost respect for the 'average policeman' many of whom probably don't agree with the enforcement policies anyway. However I view Safety Camera Partnerships as not proper policemen, afterall they have a vested interest in keeping their jobs rather then safety. I view them like I view privatised parking enforcement - it's a business. I know not to expect common sense when it comes to parking attendants now, though clearly I don't agree with them most of the time. Sure some people park inconsideratly and I have no sympathy with them, but the underhand tactics some parking attendants use is pathetic.

However I have not lost respect for ordinary police who deserve our support and can exercise common sense. I have parked on double yellow lines right in front of a policeman for a very good reason I can't go into. He could see I wasn't causing an obstruction and simply told said to me "Don't be long". I was once followed(innocently) by a Policeman about 30miles along a SC road, and I overtook many times, and each time I was more concerned with executing a safe overtake then watching my speed. Did he pull me over? Did he buggery, and when safe overtook himself before eventually turning off.

respect for police officers though is a knock-on effect because if you don't comply with said fines, they'll be the ones knocking on your door, whatever their personal viewpoint and however much they're "doing their job" they're still the ones representing the "other side" as it were.

personally speaking I've always had a lot of respect for our police and have always dealt with them in a courteous manner, recieved courtesy in return and stuck up for them in many arguements with friends and peers. (being part of the alternative music community I get a lot of chance to argue this) however several recent incidents have eroded that and I think I'll be a little more subdued in my defence in the future.

This, however, is besides the point.... my arguement isn't about respect for the police themselves (although that follows suit) but our road laws in general. Many psychologists will argue that rehabilitation and leniancy is a better option for many first time offenders in instances such as drug use, shoplifting etc as jail simply turns them into criminals in their own minds wheras a lot of youngsters are still finding their way in life; surely the same is true for drivers, once you draw that line and say "you're now on that side of the law" you detramentally affect the way they view themselves and giving them a more jaded outlook on compliance with highway laws?

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

Yes, I'm quite sure it happens, and sometimes in very subtle ways. While the effect on most individuals will be small, I'm sure that the average behaviours are shifting (inexorably) in the wrong direction.

I'm especially worried about motor insurance. We have an estimated 1.4m uninsured drivers, and once you're driving uninsured, what price bald tyres, no MoT or worse?

We have to get a grip on the problem(s), and crushing uninsured vehicles won't make the slightest dent. The police don't have the resources to seize enough vehicles (even assuming that such actions are legitimate).

The Safe Speed Manifesto proposes sticking a 3rd party insurance premium on motor fuel; mainly to 'reinclude' unisured drivers in legal driving.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety