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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 13:29 
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Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.

Note from moderator: I've just deleted a double post of this message. Please don't make multiple posts of the same thing.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 13:31 
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Do you have any valid evidence to substanciate that claim?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 13:36 
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How would a 70mph speed limiter reduce this problem?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 13:55 
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I take it you're not smartly dressed and wear a suit then?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 14:04 
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It's lucky I'm scruffy then. I can go as fast as I want and I won't kill anybody.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 14:04 
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the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.


So how many children are killed by people in smart suits driving at 40 mph every year exactly....or are you talking out of you ass.

How many children are killed by parents with no responsibility to supervising their children playing near busy roads. Just blame the driver huh!

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 14:05 
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the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.

... and probably much more likely to be killed or hurt in a household accident. Statistically, traffic is a bigger risk than those "nightmares", and the home is an even bigger risk again. Your point is?

For that, I suspect that they are more likely to be killed or hurt by someone who religiously obeys the speed limit and travels everywhere at that limit <fe>in the knowledge that he is safe because that's what Government tells him</fe> even though the conditions suggest that speed is inappropriate than they are by the smartly-dressed man in the suit driving safely above the speed limit.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 14:29 
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Quote:
the smartly dressed man in the suit


Is that a trace of class warfare creeping in, btw?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 14:44 
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the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.


    On average, two women per week are killed by a male partner or former partner.
    One incident of domestic violence is reported to the police every minute.
    In 90% of domestic violence incidents, children were in the same or the next room. (British Crime Survey, 1992)
    In over 50% of known domestic violence cases, children were also directly abused - NSPCC (1997) found a 55% overlap; Farmer & Owen (1995) found 52% overlap.


Domestic violence means children are likely to be hurt and damaged for life (mental scars). There's a greater danger from this than of the "man in the suit", especially if this man is paying attention to where he is going. Why do you assume that he is more dangerous than the over-worked mother with 3 kids messing about in the back that she has to keep taking her eyes off the road to look at? Or the man / woman who's been up all night working a late shift at the hospital / factory?

And why is he "cutting through" and not just driving? Immotive language can make you think your argument is being supported, but it's not.

If the children weren't in the road they wouldn't get hit, either. I'm a primary school teacher so don't say I have an uncaring / irresponsible attitude to children. If they are taught to walk on the pavement, cross at appropriate places and not play by the road the accident rates would fall. I see problems outside the school gates everyday, caused not by speed but by poor driving. Numerous cars parking (often illegally) in places that block visibility so crossing the road is even more dangerous. Turning in the road where children are crossing. Mounting the pavement - forcing some to go into the road, as well as endangering anyone on the pavement. The list goes on. But it's safe, because there's a 20mph limit! Rubbish, as I can testify as I was hit by a reversing parent recently. Not hard, and no-one was hurt. But if my hip was a 6 year-old child's head instead things would be different.

Yes, someone travelling at 40 is more likely to kill a child than if they hit them at 20. Yes, they need longer to stop. No-one here'll deny that, but if the conditions are appropriate and the driver is paying attention then 40 is no more dangerous than 20. You could argue the opposite, as other road users won't be getting frustrated, tailgating and overtaking, leading to being distracted from other dangers. I drive according to the conditions and don't want to be in fear of fines and driving bans for a few MPH. Next time you're out in the car, try driving without looking at the speedometer. I do, and I find I'm far more aware of any dangers and whilst I may creep over the limit, I often find I drive under it too when there's a hazard because I'm not thinking "30's the limit therefore I'm safe".

Speed limiters won't help. As another poster said, the national limit on motorways is 70 so you'd still be able to speed in towns. If they were fitted with GPS speed limiters to control speeds in towns there's still problems. E.g. not all systems are accurate all of the time, in all of the places. Imagine pulling onto an urban DC with a 70 limit, trying to accelerate but your speed limiter stops you at 30 and the traffic you should be merging in with merges into your rear bumper and causes a pile-up?

Speed isn't the problem, it's inattentiveness, poorly maintained cars and roads, a lack of education for drivers and pedestrians alike.

I feel like I've wasted my time typing this in a way, as most people who view it will agree with the general point I'm making. I just hope "sensible majority" sees the sense in it. [/b]


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 14:49 
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from http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6798

the sensible majority wrote:
when on a motorway, doing say 75 MPH, why should I not be sticking to the middle lane after all nobody will be wanting to speed past wil they?


Gizmo wrote:
PeterE wrote:
Looks like the schools are on holiday at the moment :o :D


I bet it is a school project :roll:


r11co wrote:
:trolls:



If it is a school project, then get in touch with the site properly, and get a balanced and evidenced viewpoint from Paul. Schools are for educating, after all. An opportunity for grass-roots support perhaps?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 15:01 
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Last edited by FJSRiDER on Wed Oct 04, 2006 13:27, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 15:11 
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Pffft. Wannabe troll. :lol:

Instead of ranting on about "men in go-faster suits", teach the little [fecal deposits] that running / biking in front of moving cars because "we're not allowed to hit them" doesn't give them a magical force-field. I frequently have the little darlings run, jump or just stand defiantly like I must stop at their whim....I don't, they move.

Now this is ENTIRELY different to that excited child running out to fetch a ball or wobbling off the pavement - those are GENUINE hazards of motoring and we all take appropriate action through heightened observation & anticipation in residential areas.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 15:12 
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the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.

Just as well my chosen choice of clothing when out & about is oil stained Doc Martens, ripped up jeans, a leather jacket that saw better days 15 years ago, and a waistcoat that isn't doing much better.

If nothing else, your wildly innacurate statement is backed up by my 6 monthly CRB check that is required of my employer by law.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:17 
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[quote="Gizmo



How many children are killed by parents with no responsibility to supervising their children playing near busy roads. Just blame the driver huh![/quote]

And how many children are killed by parents who don't /won't /can't be bothered to make sure that their kids are strapped in correctly , in the right sort of seat.

KID + WINDSCREEN = 30 lb of minced kid.


NOT A NICE THOUGHT.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:21 
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the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.[/i]


It's also been proven* that children posting on a forum aimed at adults are far more likely to be annoying.

* each post by 'the sensible majority' adding to the evidence.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:21 
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the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.

I would say that children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt if their parents neglect to ensure they know how to cross the road and recognise the related dangers.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:32 
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.......In fact, I would go further to say that children are far far more likely to be killed by someone at the speed limit: tailgating or drunk or on a mobile or in a poorly maintained vehicle or joyriding or in poor conditions (visibility, traction) than someone observant and considerate who is applying a safespeed for the conditions - which could happen to be a few mph above the limit (especially a limit which is set artificially low for financial purposes)


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:40 
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Space Cowboy wrote:
It's also been proven* that children posting on a forum aimed at adults are far more likely to be annoying

* each post by 'the sensible majority' adding to the evidence.


SC - another good idea - but is the figure it's age or IQ??

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:42 
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Space Cowboy wrote:
the sensible majority wrote:
Your children are statistically far far more likely to be killed or hurt by the smartly dressed man in the suit, cutting through the nieghbourhood at 40mph in the 30mph limit that any of the people that give you nightmares.[/i]


It's also been proven* that children posting on a forum aimed at adults are far more likely to be annoying.

* each post by 'the sensible majority' adding to the evidence.


hmm- SC - sounds like some kids high on kiddies rights that i know - might be an idea.

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Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 20:42 
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botach wrote:
but is the figure it's age or IQ??


Why does it have to be one or the other? ;)


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