Safe Speed Forums

Hi All,

Great site, thanks to the admin for putting it together & keeping it going.

I would appreciate any comments from anyone out there.

Me or my brother have been lti 20/20ed 37 in 30mph. We wrote back explaining that we both use the car & asked for a photo/video to id the driver but got only one from the rear & front number plate. We wrote again and asked for a view from the front but got no reply only summons for Section 172 (2) (a) Failed to give such information as to identify the driver.

Will the police/CPS now give me the video/photo from front evidence if i request it so that i can id the driver?

What is the case if i can id the driver from the video, does the section 172 change to speeding prosecution or still stand?

What if i can't id the driver, is there anything else that i could have or still can do within my power to id the driver?

Any help would be greatly appreciated, i can post the full story (approx 500 words) if it will help.
Thanks, Mike

Mike, go to www.pepipoo.com and visit the forums. The FAQ will tell you everything you need to know about S172 and how to defend yourself. If you want further assistance post a thread in Judicial Process and the members will help you. Make sure you provide the info requested.

In a nutshell the law says that you have to use reasonable diligence to determine who was driving and name the driver as soon as you can. If you are diligent and still can't identify the driver then, as long as the Magistrates believe you, then they'll find you not guilty.

If the scammers do come across with the video as part of disclosure (very unlikely) or on the day in court and that allows you to name the driver then you do so there and then.

_________________
Less Kodak, more Kojak.
In times of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

Thanks, i have been digging through this site & pepipoo. Lots of great info, everything i needed to know.

All the best

One more thing ....

If i do recognise who it was and admit it to the court, what am i or my brother liable to be prosecuted for?

The way i read it, because it is 6 months after speeding (18/12/05) offence even if we do figure who it was and admit it then there is no case to answer re: speeding and for the s172 i would be found NG because of s172 (7) (supplied info soon as reasonably practical). And No summons could be served on my brother because of time out rule. Do i understand correctly?

Ta

Hi, just been through this myself.

If your brother will go to court (final trail) and be a witness in the stand, giving same full story if needed, and say don't know you could have a stronger case than me as I wasn't going to take my other possible driver to court (unsure if it was me or my mother).

Any way that didn't come as CPS dropped the case.

Your questions-
If the summons is 172(2) only and not speeding then only really 172(2) counts.
BUT I have read about a case where the prosecution swapped the 172 for speeding in court. Keep in mind they can't do that don't let them and fight it in court.
The photo will be the best frame grab from the video (supposed to be) the video will not help or they would have showed you that pic. Isaw my video in Pre-Trail Review (I went to plea summons and request to veiw at PTR, you can do this or try righting to court+CPS)
My video was much worse than I thought it would be, so I wouldn't worry about that to much. Your correct about 172(7) as you would give info as soon as you where able.

GET YOUR DOCUMENTS SORTED OUT.
have you got all the origonal letters you received,
copies you sent, postage proof.
have you checked that the letters where received by the Camera Partnership?? very important for the one giving named drivers, very important.

I sent a 25odd page pack to Cheif Prosecutor a week before trail, with 2 page letter detailing efforts to assertain driver (Pepipoo gives details) discused with drivers, retraced steps, used a map and took photos of site (take copies to court) check all types of written evidence of movements receipts bills bank statements. Explained all events on day, BE CAREFULL watch what you say as this could be used in evidence against you
Plus page listing documents all numbered and all documents.
Sent a week before trail.

CPS said no evidence.

Search pepipoo for 'unsure of driver' and 'welshy' for his day in court defending this.

Have copies of all documents x5 3 for bench, 1 clerk, 1, prosecution.

You'll frighten the life out of them, where's the solicitor, your supposed not to know any of this!
no gaurentees of course only telling you my true tale, be careful and ware a tie


Bests of luck

Well done, LoneRanger. tommy02, have a read of LR's thread here for an idea of what's to come.

Hope you can achieve the same result!

_________________
Less Kodak, more Kojak.
In times of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

thank MrsMiggins, is that for the length of the post or getting the case dropped? Anyway I've sent the court a bill for £211, sounds fair I think better than £100/hr if I'd got in a solicitor.

tommy02 you can look forward to that too! How's it going?

LoneRanger, Can you please let us know how you get on with your expenses.

I got my case discontinued and having sent my invoice for costs to the court I got a letter from the courts to say that “On the xx May xxx Justices made an order for payment of costs from central funds in your case, subject to taxation. Details of your claim will now be passed to a senior member of the Courts’ ‘Legal’ staff for taxation, and a cheque will be sent to you in due course. I expect this to be within the next two weeks.”

Today I got a letter to say, “I write in response to your recent letter to my colleague, Mr xx. I have arranged for a cheque to cover your legal costs to be sent direct to your Solicitors. I cannot however allow you any loss of earnings nor give you any costs based on a daily rate. What I can allow is the individual costs you have incurred eg processing photographic images. If you could forward me the invoices for your costs, I can consider the matter further.”

I have asked on what grounds, authority and statutes they have not allowed payment of the expenses against the order for payment of these costs made by the xx Justices, for which an invoice was provided. Hence I ask why they have not just settled the matter of taxation and sent me the appropriate cheque, as I was assured would happen by Mr xx

Helpful views on this are welcome.

I need to document a recent case of mine (some will be aware..). I have had a similar rebuttal of expenses, and will I think be taking the matter up with my MP, once I have had the cheque (which I will probably return).

I am waiting to see what response I get to my appeal for the court for the expenses and then, if necessary, I will be getting onto my MP, yet again, to get him to pursue the matter.

Roger, Trust you got my PM

I certainly will as yet they are wiggling a bit, I'll wait, and write letters, til there sick of me