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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 12:41 
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Daily Mirror

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30 May 2006
FURY AT 'JOKE FINE' FOR KILLER DRIVER
By Patrick Mulchrone And Jason Green
THE family of road victim Edna Gibbons last night told of their disgust after the speeding driver who killed her escaped with a mere £250 fine.

Relatives branded the sentence "a joke" and demanded tougher laws to stop motorists walking free after death crashes.

They were furious prosecutors refused to charge Keith Horne with causing death by dangerous driving, despite the fact he was tailgating a car which he overtook on the inside at 50mph in a 40mph zone before ploughing into 78-year-old gran Edna as she left a bingo hall.

He could have faced up to 14 years in jail. But he was hit with the lesser charge of careless driving which carries a maximum fine of £2,500 - and officials believe there is more chance of getting a conviction for.

Edna's son-in-law Robert Hurst said he was astounded 26-year-old Horne was not locked up.

He added: "This is the kind of punishment for not paying your TV licence, not killing someone. It's a joke."

And her son Jeff told of his anger that Horne did not even get the maximum fine and was only banned from driving for 18 months.

The 47-year-old warehouseman said: "They have valued my mother's life at just £250. The family is disgusted and we feel cheated.

"Is that all she was worth? He should have gone to prison for what he did, instead he'll be on the road again in less than two years. It beggars belief this ratbag walked away from court with hardly a slap on the wrist. My family is devastated. I wish those who sentence these thugs would think about the effects on families.

"I'm sick to death of these crazy drivers hurting and killing innocent people. And the magistrates should be ashamed of themselves. Horne has not even written to say sorry."

Edna, who had two grandchildren Andrew, 15, and Adam, nine, died last November in Kensington, Liverpool, when she tried to cross the road to catch a bus.

The retired cleaner was hit so hard by Horne's Volkswagen Bora her leg was torn off and found later in a nearby garden.

Horne, of Huyton, admitted careless driving when he appeared before Liverpool magistrates.

Road safety campaigners blasted the sentence.

Roadpeace said: "For a fine of just £250 to be imposed on a person whose actions led to such tragic consequences, is unacceptable.

"This case highlights the need for reform of penalties for people who cause death and serious injury on our roads."

The Crown Prosecution Service defended its decision not to charge Horne with dangerous driving - and even claimed widow Edna contributed to the collision. Liverpool district prosecutor Norman Larkin said: "There was a combination of factors.

"Mrs Gibbons walked out on to the road when witnesses say it was not safe to do so. Mr Horne was in the middle lane and his view would have been blocked by traffic."

A new offence of causing death by careless driving - which carries up to five years in prison - has been introduced by the Government but will not be in force until next July.

It comes after a string of killer drivers walked free from court because they were charged only with careless driving.

Among them was Shane Farrell, 31 - fined just £750 after 13-year-old Amber Lok died when she was hit by his car in Salford.

And teacher Stephen O'Donnell got a £500 fine when he killed a cyclist policeman.

LAW MUST END THIS DISGRACE
By Mary Williams of road safety charity Brake

FOR families whose loved ones have been killed, the law hinges on a tiny difference in legal definitions.

With death by dangerous driving the Crown must prove the standard fell "far below ... a careful and competent driver" and the culprit can get 14 years.

With careless driving it has only to fall "below the standard" and the most punishment is a pathetic fine. The Road Safety Bill going through Parliament proposes a new charge of death by careless driving with a jail sentence.

But the definition of careless driving will remain so it is a bodge that will help only in some cases. What is desperately needed, as well as charges for killer drivers, is charges for drivers who maim - there is no equivalent of grievous bodily harm behind the wheel.

We need much clearer, tougher laws. We need judges to impose tougher sentences on high risk drivers, often young men who think - rightly in this case - they can get away with it.

A £250 fine for breaking the speed limit by 10mph and performing an illegal manoeuvre is a national disgrace.


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The Crown Prosecution Service defended its decision not to charge Horne with dangerous driving - and even claimed widow Edna contributed to the collision.


Quote:
"Mrs Gibbons walked out on to the road when witnesses say it was not safe to do so. Mr Horne was in the middle lane and his view would have been blocked by traffic."


I don't know the area, or the road where this accident happend. Nobody likes to hear of anyone being killed, but I don’t believe this accident was as cut and dry as people where making out. Where the crown prosecution right in this case?

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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 13:17 
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A £250 fine for breaking the speed limit by 10mph and performing an illegal manoeuvre is a national disgrace.


And in a single sentance, Brake have managed to undermine the whole case.

I agree Dixie that this doesn't seem to be entirely the driver's fault though.

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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 13:32 
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Mary Williams wrote:
A £250 fine for breaking the speed limit by and performing an illegal manoeuvre is a national disgrace.

Soon they’ll be saying “A £250 fine for breaking the speed limit by 10mph is a national disgrace:roll:


I would be interested to hear the Safespeed take on this tragedy.


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 13:40 
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Dixie wrote:
but I don’t believe this accident was as cut and dry as people where making out. Where the crown prosecution right in this case?

not at all. Yes the driver should have seen her and probably would have had he been paying attention, but likewise anyone standing in L1 of a busy 3 lane road is just asking for trouble.


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 13:51 
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To me, this demonstrates the problem of listening too much to people who are grieving and incapable of rational reasoning (perfectly understandably). We shouldn't confuse our sympathy for their loss with allowing them to do whatver they like in retaliation.

We always hear this stuff like '£250 fine for killing someone', and ultimately it's just emotional nonsense, brought on by overpowering grief at a tragic event.

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This is the kind of punishment for not paying your TV licence, not killing someone. It's a joke.


Exactly, that's because the court decided that his level of blame for the death was no higher than a very minor driving fault. The sentence is not for murder, it's for the smallest possible amount of driving error. Like it or not, the court has found that the pedestrian was largely responsible for her own death. It must be a terrible thing to hear when that person is a loved one, but changing the law so that someone is always punished severely regardless of their level of blame is not justice.

Their entire case to have him jailed revolves around only two things: 1) Name calling, and 2) Adverse consequences, neither of which proves he was to blame.

Mary Williams appears, unless she has been misquoted, to be calling for tough sentences just for being in a high risk group! No guilt needed! "Yes, I know the child ran in front of him and it wasn't his fault, but he's a high risk group, so it's 14 years prison."


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 14:45 
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On a wider point, the Government are considering passing legislation to allow victims of crime (or their representatives) become involved in sentencing of offenders. This might be in the guise of victim's statements to be read out in court and are supposed to give some idea of the effect of the crime on the victim. I can see a big problem with this. For example, a rape victim picks up her life and recovers well from her ordeal. Should her attacker get a lower sentence because of this?

The case in this thread shows you why allowing emotions to affect justice is a very bad idea.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 15:05 
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Sixty_the_red thanks for bringing this posting to my attention.

Daily Mail version at; http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewt ... 3469#83469


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 15:08 
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Dr L wrote:
Sixty_the_red thanks for bringing this posting to my attention.

Daily Mail version at; http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewt ... 3469#83469


n/p :)

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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 15:40 
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Very tragic events I think we can all agree but why must the media always latch on the grieving relatives and never on the driver.


I think it is clear that the driver is at fault but so is the pedestrian for failing to take due care and attention. In recent months I have started to really object to the crass stupidity of the general public when it comes to crossing the road every thing from just not looking where there going or attempting to cross the road a few feet from a safe crossing while placing themselves and other road users at danger.

Sadly this case will just be used to further the prosecution of the drivers without paying more to lip service to the reason this fatality happened witch is a pedestrian standing in the road instead of waiting till the road was clear to cross. Whatever the faults in the drivers driving if she wasn’t standing in the road she wouldn’t be dead.


Sobering thoughts but lost to the media in its quest for sectionalist headlines.


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 21:25 
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As I read it . .. guy had been TAILGATING another driver before he hit the old lady.

There is a difference then. Guy who hit poor Amber suffered serious remorse and trauma after the event. The judge considered this very rightly when deciding the outcome.

Brake people know darned well who we are !

I want JUSTICE for those who fall victims of the downright dangerous and illegal.

I WANT blatant THIEVES with zero regard or compassion or human feelings to be locked away for their own good as well as mine.

I WANT those who deliberately drive a car or ride a bike (motor or normal) whilst impaired by drugs or plain drunk to be dealt with firmly by the courts as well as those who have zero right to drive anything with any kind of power to feel the stern force of the law.

However, if someone has a simple accident.. never intended and made some really stupid but fatal out of character and one-off mistake - then I do not think a revenge justice will ever serve the public good.

We have to think of the victim and the person who suffers badly because of the chance sequence of tragic events and co-incidents. A fair and just society which seeks to embrace "Britishness and British fair play" by voting the date the Magan Carta was signed as a Bank Holiday Celebration of "all things British" must observe this equity and compassion to the victim and his hapless and guilt-ridden causer of never-ending trauma to each party.

Please bear in mind - I nearly lost my lovely wife. I admit she's a mischievious handful at time :lol: but she's still loveable. :love:

Also bear in mind that this family lost one other much loved relative in a similar incident to Ms Williams and his brother in a plane crash two weeks prior.

Thus we more than understand deep grief and despair and the sheer black hell hole of trying to make sense of their loss and they are never forgotten .. NEVER!

But.. when faced with attempted suicides of the guilt ridden causers of such trauma. .. how the hell could we live with knowing our lack of understanding would cause more trauma?

We forgave.. made our peace.

You really cannot continue without retaining human decent feelings. I do post from my heart here.

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