Safe Speed Forums

Hello i'm new here so forgive me if I am discussing something which has been mentioned.

I am a IT installer and travel all over the country I am so tired of wagons etc over taking each other on the motorways its dangerous it cause's non stop tail backs for miles. They seem to just pull out on you ( the majority I've encounterd) and take forever to over take then another its endless.

I understand that they do it because they are restricted to 60 miles an hour and some of the larger engined vehicles can maintain this speed up a hill where as some engines can not so they over take, This is what was explained to me by a HGV driver. Does anyone else see this madness and what do people think should happen about it the amount of times i have to suddenly brake on the motorway is frustrating and alot of the times people are nearly into the back of each other.

if you're always having to 'suddenly' brake on a motorway then you're not really paying enough attention, are you?

Hello Roadhog, and welcome.

Yes, a very tiresome event that irks quite a lot of us. I try to see it from the HGV drivers' viewpoint, but the amount of time they look likely to save doesn't seem to be worthwhile.

As for means of overcoming the problem?

Do away with limiters and leave it to tachograph records to provide some speed restraint?

Retain the 56 mph limiters but give them a short term facility to over-ride them for overtaking purposes?

I do wish some answer could be found to the problem, as I think the frustration caused to other drivers can have the potential for creating problems elsewhere.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

Absolutely. If you come across two HGVs in L1 you should be looking to see if the gap between them is closing. If it is then expect the trailing one to overtake.

Remember - you might be on your way to a job, but the HGV driver is doing his and its a difficult enough job as it is.

Welcome to the forum BTW.

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

thanks for some constructive and not so constructive comments I wil reply in lengh soon im at work so awkward thanks for the welcome.

So several drivers should be put out and frustrated because a HGV dosnt want to drop below 56mph for a few moments on a hill. Sorry but I disagree IMO they should have to stay in the inside lane unless something is slow moving i.e under 40mph or something is stationary no other reason to be in the overtaking lane. 99% of the time im in a que of traffic its wagons over taking.

If you're in the 'fast' lane of the motorway (and I assume from that you meen L3) and a lorry pulls out on you then he's breaking the law. Vehicles over 7.5tonne are prohibited from using the outside lane of 3 or more lane motorways.

I think your choice of username is rather interesting - we are here for friendly debate, and if you enter with a massive, and rather agressive rant then expect somewhat of an aggressive responce. The responces you recieved were not intended as personal digs at your driving ability but as advice to help you make better progress and improve your driving. If you don't want to listen to advice and join in the debate then I think you're in the wrong place.

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

You're confusing the two issues Roadhog and your chosen name probably tells us why. Trucks overtaking is issue 1. You having to suddenly brake all the time is issue 2. Issue 2 is something that only you can fix.

This is discussed at lengh in several places on the forum, but in short:

1) Why should HGVs be denied the right (like everyone else on the road) to overtake and maintain their own comfortable pace?

2) When you're driving for 10 hours a day, the extra concentration required and frustration caused by having to constantly alter your speed in order to stay behind another vehicle is completely unwanted and dangerous.

3) Accellerating back up to speed after slowing down to stay behind another vehicle uses an awful lot of fuel.

4) I could go on, but like I said its discussed all over the site ad nausium.

HGVs aren't all limited to exactly the same speed - they don't just gain on each other on hills. Chill out, look further ahead and relax a little more at the wheel - you might find you enjoy driving a bit more.

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

I, for one, don't envy the HGV drivers at all. They have a hard task with all the artificial restrictions they suffer and now they face loss of job for a few minor speeding offences. Of course they have the right to overtake, even though it may be frustrating to we car drivers at times. Yes, sometimes they do overtake up a long hill with about 0.5 mph speed differential (a bit naughty, that), but that's fairly uncommon. Whenever I tow my rally cars on my long trailer I find the truck drivers most courteous, unlike many car drivers who sit in the middle lane and prevent me from overtaking as, like the trucks, I'm barred from lane 3.
If you have to keep on braking hard on dual carriageways/M'ways because of trucks, then it might be suggested that your anticipatory skills are somewhat lacking and perhaps some additional training in advanced driving might be appropriate.
This is not meant to be offensive, just pragmatic.

Anybody who thinks that trucks don't just pull out in front of cars should try the A14 towards Felixstowe. It is probably only a minority of drivers that cause the problems They might be running late for ferries and are probably getting tired from a long journey but some of the driving is truly appalling.

Trucks will often try to pull into a 2 second gap and it doesn't matter how much you anticipate it you still have to brake or you run into the back. I try to work on the principle that I should do nothing that causes another driver to have to change their speed or direction - I just wish everybody else would do the same.

My bold

The chestnut is still the same - lorry momentum earned over many a mile is lost in a heartbeat, by "you" being in the next lane when they want to pass another slower lorry. Granted there are some poor choices of gap, but in some of these cases, just easing back to a 3 - 4-second gap as lorries close on one another maintains a good laminar flow for everyone.

Just more overall tolerance needed by everyone and less 'King of the Road' syndrome from some..

Exactly - OK the A14 which is 2 lane only, can be a pain in the butt, but the same 2 lanes scenario is true for many main roads in France but because French drivers are more tolerant it is much less of a problem. If UK drivers left bigger gaps and were more willing to let the occasional lorry pull out, then they wouldn't be forced into pulling into smaller gaps when they occur - it is not as if the 20 seconds or so lost by letting a lorry overtake in front of you cannot be made up relatively quickly.

It can be fustrating being stuck behind an HGV. However I think it is far more fustrating for the HGV driver. I don't think the driver of the HGV really wants to be in this postion.

So just slow down and think about happy things.

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as an HGV driver, i can definately confirm that we do not like being out in L2. that means we have to watch our blind side rather than a quick look to the right of centre vision. on top of that, 2 vehicles running side by side and bouncing sideways slightly is quite daunting for anyone. we dont spend any longer than necessary passing each other.

as for the difference it makes, as said before (not this thread), it can make the difference between getting home or not. after 15 hours of working or 10 hours driving, we have to stop and thats it. car drivers do not have these restrictions so bear that in mind. you can finish your journey whereas we may not have that luxury

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Richie

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I think that the simple solution would be outlaw lorries overtaking on some duel carriage ways-motorways i.e.. M11 north of Stansted as I believe they have done on some roads in France & if I'm not mistaken on parts of the M42 north of the M6. Actually thinking about it I would be thankful if it was banned on some three lane motorways, M25 springs to mind.

Sitting behind overtaking HGVs for anything up to an eternity is a joke & in my opinion with no justification possible. If one HGV going 2mph faster overtakes another doing 60 mph it will take him 5 hours to get 10 minutes ahead, then when he stops for a cup of tea & back to square one. Or they both sit there in the same cue waiting for the same ferry, what's the point?

Banning this meaningless practice would be a good way to get some of our slower moving motorways moving again. There is no justification for taking 5 miles to overtake another vehicle, whether the drivers had a long day or not.

Rant over & this is my opinion & nothing is intended as being personal.

Nearly forgot. I've been loitering for some time but this is my first post so Hi everybody.

(my edits) so do you think it will work Bob or do you think that possibly a lot of the congestion could be caused by the huge number of car drivers on the motorways?

Of course we have more problems on our motorways including huge numbers of car drivers, but banning this meaningless practice of HGVs blocking two out of three lanes or worse two out of two lanes for miles at a time can only help the situation.

Two HGVs overtaking does nothing more than create a funnel neck with every other road users trying their best to get passed which in turn can create a braking point / congestion spot which can last for hours.

Get HGVS in the left lane, then the middle lane hog problem is kind of eliminated because they've got more reason for being there & then they're not constantly pulling into the overtaking lane at 65mph passing another HGV. Everyone's a winner.

Just on a side note. How much I wonder does it cost the economy of this country when people are constantly sitting in pointless cues caused by this problem, I mean there are figures showing how much road works and busy roads causing congestion cost the economy but I have never seen figures explaining how much is lost through endless congestion caused by overtaking HGVs.

And to answer your edit cars can accelerate when passing, HGVs can not.

I don't quite understand why one 400+ hp lorry being overtaken by another can't just fractionally back off until the manoeuvre is complete, then accelerate back to 56.

I've seen responses to this on the "you're not a lorry driver , you don't get it", but when I'm being overtaken on the Mway/DC by something that only just has the edge on me, I instinctively back off a little to get the process over with.