Safe Speed Forums

they seem to work ok for the AA.

They have a different purpose to the AA, and don't need to carry a ton of tools although the weighted cones are not exactly light; but they might have to go off-road to get to get near a vehicle that has crashed and is off the road. I would also assume that they are a bulk buy with competitive tender, so they should have cost a lot less than the showroom prices.

why a luxury 4X4? Why not something midrange like shogun?

Can't you imagine the complaints that HMG would get for importing Japanese built cars and putting even more UK Car Manufacturing jobs on the line? This is fleet buying, where the price paid will be nothing like that in the showrooms - LandRover would have had to bid a price against the competition, and may have decided to bid low in order to get the vehicles seen, or to ensure that they shift stock that would otherwise sit on some old airfield slowly rusting away. They are unlikely to be "vogue" or similar specification and will be more like those purchased by the Police - no CD player, no fancy trim ao anything like that.

they were in the "Police Only" observation point again this morning. I was in L2 overtaking some slower traffic with a good gap between myself and the car in front, a Mini2 was in L3 overtaking me at a good pace when he saw the HA vehicle, quickly darted into my safety zone and applied the brakes to get down to 70!

What was, IMHO, a safe driving distance now turned into 1 car length at 70! I just pulled into L3 and continued at my normal cruising speed.

Who says they dont cause a distraction to motorists?? From a distance they look like police patrols, sometimes the BiBs will sit in their vehicles pointing their radar guns at traffic so it is sometimes understandable that people panic break.....

No-one says that they don't distract motorists, because they do. I was saying above that to the observant they should only cause a minimal distraction because it is easy to see what they are, but as always it is the unobservant that cause the problems due to fear of speed related prosecutions.

This problem could be eliminated by an alternative livery, except the Highways Agency and DfT either do not want to acknowledge that the problem exists, or believe that as motorists shouldn't be speeding in the first place, that by definition the problem cannot exist - any resulting accidents will obviously have been caused by speeding motorists, therefore justifying the placement of speed cameras on the motorway...

A police officer friend of mine has told me the new vehicles for his force are not actually poverty police spec - they are retail spec, as such they can be resold for a higher value on the second hand market when they have served their time. There has also been a recent trend for silver police cars rather than white ones, agian for the same reason.

Also if landrover are now owned by ford surely its not the brits who pocket the cash if the company is sucessful, its the yanks. Aren't a lot of japanese models built here these days?

I headed south last weekend and saw a few of the Highways Agency cars on my travels, but noticed that they now say 'traffic officer' (i thing it was traffic officer if not it was something similar) on the rear side windows (along with Highways Agency on the bumper) have they got extra powers now? i would have thought a 'traffic officer' is someone with power and authority?

and to add to the colour of lights debate the latest cop cars in the hull region have led lights that are just clear/whiteish when off same as the highway vehicles (but obviously light blue not amber)

They are always going to do that be it a HATO vehicle or a Police car. Panic braking is a fact of life, if people are over the limit and a Police car is in the area, they are going to jump on the brakes.

FWIW, Can we all stop using the word "break" instead of "brake" in the correct context please.

If the HA pretend "Cop Cars" aren't meant to be pretend cop cars someone should have chosen a more obvious colour scheme, the AA the RAC and various construction companies seem to be able to find highly visable colours that work on Motorways without having to resort to something that looks too like a cop car for comfort, although i must say it is funny to watch someone go blatting past (~100+) the 2 lanes of slower traffic behind what they assumed was a HA vehicle only for it to be a rare beast of a motorway patrol car,

Don't speak too soon.

If you look at the matter in an historical sense then you will see that in the early days of Traffic Wardens they were only allowed to give out tickets. Later on they were given the power to 'direct traffic'. More recently we have seen the creation of PCSO's with the power to 'detain'.

In my view, what we are heading towards to a system of 'multi-layered' enforcement with 'non-warranted' appointees having the power to prosecute for a limited number of offences. Of course we have this already with bodies like the RSPCA or Environmental Health Officers but, until now, these have remained the reserve of specialist areas.

Do we want 'Policing' on the cheap? For the majority of Motorway and Trunk Road incidents, where it is simply a matter of 'dusting' down the injured and packing them off to Hospital where necessary, and then clearing the road, does it really require the services of an Officer highly skilled in the knowledge of Criminal Law, Investigative and Interrogation techniques, and qualified to examine vehicles at Engineering level?

The discussion as to whether the U.K. should have a U.S. style Highway Patrol has been about for countless years. Various models have been trialled. In the 1970's there was the Midland Links Motorway Police Group (if I've got the name right) Subsequent amalgamations, and the fact the the structure of pay for a Chief Constable included an element based on the number of 'Motorway Miles' for which they were responsible made advances in that sphere impossible.

I'm totally against HATO's and PCSO's. Not as individuals but rather the role that they represent. I perceive it as a 'dumbing down' of enforcement.

If the Government wants to have 'tiered' levels enforcement, which, conversely, I am not against, then surely they can publicly announce it as an intention rather than having this 'drip-drip' subornation of the electorate.

Are we likely, in the near future, to see HATO's being given the powers to stop vehicles for seat belt or mobile phone offences? I can foresee it happening. After all, somewhat akin to the role of PCSO's, the Courts will readily look upon them as 'professional witnesses' and, if it makes our roads safer, then why not? Whilst they will need to be trained in 'Confrontational' skills, they are not next likely to be sent to a pub fight or a knife wielding domestic, where physical and negotiating skills are more in demand.

My main current concern is that when I see them dealing with matters already within their remit, I often have this compulsion to stop and 'kick arse' and 'educate' them as to the manner of doing things 'efficiently' as opposed to doing things 'correctly'.

Grumps - i have said , and agree with you totally - but at the end of the day , i have my wife, possibly my grandkids on board - i braekdown on th M6 -- and whilst waiting for the AA to arrive - what would i like to see - NOT MR PLASTIC POLICEMAN - A Traffic Officer - what i want to see putting his blue lights on behind me is A PROPER TRAFFIC COP - two of them will have the knowhow to keep my lot up the bank SAFE ( with my in car kit , the lot would be in foul weather hi vis orange ) -the lights will make most idiots slow down and move over.

The blues won't stop a foreign HGV hitting the police car - but it'l make life a lot safer till the AA arive. Something the (from what i've seen ) armwaving chat a lot Traffic Officers won't. Their orange lights - is it a breakdown truck - is it a heavy load - is it superman ---who knows - but blue lights - on the motorway - panic sets in - it's definately the police.People do slow down , get real / show courtesy.

And now that HATO are using even more psuedo cop cars - new style discoveries ,with the black almost blue - can we expect more panic accidents??

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

This kind of "on the cheap" strategy is happening everywhere, not just with police and law enforcement agencies. Take the the NHS for instance, 10 years ago: prescribing of drugs, routine operations and giving an anaesthetic - these all had to be done by a suitible trained medical doctor - now they can be (or will be very soon) done by nurse practicioner with appropriate specialty training.

If I needed my appendix out i would want the operation done by a doctor

In the same respect, If our roads need to be "policed" it should be done by the police.

similar thing with dentists. Once you saw a dentist for all tooth related woes. Now you see the "hygienist" for the basics. Having done some programming work for a dentist as this changeover was being done I can tell you it has nothing to do with convenience or whatever they want to dress it up as and everything to do with maximising the dentist's income by having him only doing the more profitable work.

I had a big rant about this a few months back.

I'm more than happy with their current role but not their ambigous status and placebo police role.

Firstly...They are not 'officers' they are Traffic Management Operatives

Secondly...They do not NEED expensive 4x4's (discount prices or not) I see no reason for them not to drive transit/ldv vehicles.

Thirdly...they need to stick to what they're doing now and not incrementally take over police duties.

fourthly... They should be cleraly marked so that they CANNOT be mistaken for police vehicles. We have enough people wearing uniforms and lording it thankyou very much.