Safe Speed Forums

Help! (please)

I have recieved a NIP for 'exceeding the 30 restriction' and the NIP requests I inform them of the driver. Surely it should tell me what speed I was doing otherwise I could be filling in the form and agreeing to any speed they like?

Also does the NIP definately require my registration number on it?

I thought the offence was called "excess speed"?

No, it does not require the actual speed. 31mph in a 30 limit and you are breaking the law.

I'm pretty sure the NIP must have the VRM on it. They are however 'allowed' to get it slightly wrong and correct this later.

Of course you will probably be wanting to read up about the PACE witness statement over at Pepipoo.

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Andrew.

Yep, speed is not necessary, but the registration number certainly is, after all, how on earth are you supposed to know who the driver was if they don't even tell you the car!?

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Carl Prescott

Yes indeed. Wait until the NIP is 14 days old then write back and ask them which vehicle it refers to.

They will then realise their error but any freshly issued NIP to correct it will automatically be invalid due to not being issued within 14 days of the alleged offence.

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CSCP Latin for beginners...
Ticketo ergo sum : I scam therefore I am!

I worried about the PACE witness statement.

I was more then likely doing less then 40mph in a 30mph zone and therefore if I return the NIP I believe I'll recieve 3 points and a £60 fine.

However, I'm not 100% sure I was under 40 as I believed it to be a 40 road (seeing as it were a dual carriageway) and therefore could have crept past the 40 mark which might take me into the 4 point region.

So in this instance a PACE witness statement might just dig me in deeper when infact I could just be facing a basic 3 points or should I return the PACE WS as a matter of course i.e it'll satisfy the Police and wont get me in to trouble?

JT's posting looks like good advice!

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

It would be excellent if the VRM is REALLY missing from the NIP/S172 notice. I have my doubts.

Perhaps the original poster can clarify?

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

No the VRM is indeed on the NIP, I didn't have the NIP to hand at time of posting the thread so I couldn't verify.

I guess its a case of running the risk of swallowing 3 points but potentially taking a hit for 4 points... unfortunately I already have 8 points on my license.

I would definitely go the PACE witness statement route. With the ECHR case in September it is likely (in my estimation highly likely) that S172 will fail before your case gets to court.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

In some cases the scammers deliberately don't put the speed on the NIP if it's a relatively high speed, so as to dissuade you from ignoring it and accepting the (lower) penalty of "failing to furnish". Or it could just be an oversight.

But either way that leads on to an alternate strategy, which is indeed to deliberately ignore the request and later accept the penalty for doing so, which only carries 3 penalty points. You'll get hit with a more substantial fine, and it may have a more adverse effect on your insurance, but at least you get to keep driving.

Note that I'm not advising you to take this course of action, merely pointing it up as another possibility. You would also need to be sure that there isn't some other means of identifying you, eg forward facing camera (though there is a compelling argument currently that such evidence is inadmissible anyway).

Either way, I wouldn't do anything without seeking further advice. Go and start a post off on pepipoo, fill in their "NIP Wizard", and post a few more details, including a scan of the NIP (with ANY identifying marks removed).

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CSCP Latin for beginners...
Ticketo ergo sum : I scam therefore I am!

The way I think of it is... If you reply on their form you will get found guilty. If you reply on a PACE witness statement then you have provided all the information they have requested and might or might not be found guilty. I've not heard of anyone getting more points just for opting to go to court. I know which option I would prefer.

Oh and if you accept their Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty then they get your £60. If you go to court (even if you plead guilty) they don't get your £60. You don't have to attend court yourself, you can send someone else. (except Scotland?) You can even plead guilty by post if you end up giving up part way through!

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Andrew.