Safe Speed Forums

Please excuse the crappy photos - taken with mobile phone which is all I had available at the time.

I saw these signs yesterday - on the A4155 going out of Henley-on-Thames towards Marlow. The signs are rather crudely hand-painted. You can see the brush marks and paint drips. Looks like the product of an art class project for Year 8.




The signs are attached to the pole by wire ties - can't think of what they're really called.




I shall be writing to the Oxon Highways Dept about these signs. They are not legal, and even proper repeater signs would not be lawful here because a system of street lighting is present. They do however serve to confuse the road's status as a "restricted road". There's enough confusion already in this area, so these signs are going to have to go.

Hmm, I'm torn on this one.

It may not be "Legal" But...

If it IS actually a then I actually dont have too much of a problem with this.

The "System of lighting" rule dates back to the heady days when there was only one limit, in "Built up areas" and the skys the limit elsewhere

These days things are WAY more confusing with multiple limits often indescriminatly applied both in and outside "Built up areas" and what is more the Historic "Scheme of lighting" rule allows the less scrupulous LA's to lower an urban limit simply by virtue of unbolting the and then putting in a to "enforce" the new limit and rake in the proffits (as I believe has actually been done on occasion )

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"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

untill it flies off in the wind and lands on your bonnet.

personally, I'd be tempted to add a zero/smiley face/ IQ <30/"be happy"/etc etc then push it up the column with a pole so he can't reach it.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

They could've at least copied a proper sign. They could've probably had one manufactured for the same money as well if they knew what they were doing.

Incidentally, no matter what, those signs are an illegal obstruction of the highway and whoever installed them can (and probably should) be fined for it.

An "illegal obstruction"?! How does that work?

"enough confusion already"? What, is it not a 30 road? If it is, then where's the confusion?

And what a miserable attitude. Someone is unhappy with the speed of local traffic and has hand-made a sign and you just whinge about it.

But if there was a speed cam around und folk slowed down because they see this sign..they might get fined like that old bloke once did.

But the sign does look a bit naff und chav like. I think perhaps Council should paint the 30 mph on the tarmac if the residents perceive there to be a problem. Or put up a proper one

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Well hjeg, you have not been with this board for long - and might not be here much longer by the look of it.

So I will indulge you this once, before you are banned forever.

In August 2006, I got an NIP on this road, about 2 miles away from where these crappy signs are. I fought the case and I won, and I left the court with my licence and wallet intact. And the reason I won is because the police/prosecution seemed to believe that EVERY road with a 30 limit is a "restricted road". It isn't. A restricted road is one where street lamps indicate a 30 limit. On a "restricted road", the presence of repeater signs is not lawful. If there are signs then one would rightfully expect there to be no street lighting, in which case it would NOT be a "restricted road". An issue like this is very important in a courtroom situation, because there are several sections in RTRA-1984 under which speeding charges can be brought, depending on the type of road on which the alleged offence occurred. So it follows that the defence to be prepared varies according to the charge brought. And the presence/absence of street lamps and speed limit signs is crucial to the defence that must be prepared.


I don't expect you to understand fully the purpose of this board. Different people come here for different reasons. I have been to the public area of magistrates' courts on several occasions, to observe procedure and discover how best to prepare a case. And having won my own case, I am happy to offer advice to anyone who could use it.

I do not agree that enabling people to gain a grasp of road traffic law in order to avoid unjust and wrongful convictions is tantamount to "having a miserable attitude".

Such short sightedness. When you think it's ok for people to make relatively legitmate looking signs of their own free will then surely even you can see you've lost the plot and gone ott in terms of "speed kills - anything to slow us down".

So, Mr Jones (or me) is unhappy that traffic is driving too slowly, or that theres not enough people running around waving their hands in the air, or that women are wearing too many clothes and skirts are too long - i'll make what looks like a legitimate sign and stick it up regarding these issues - that's fine, cos i'm unhappy with it and I'm allowed to imitate lawful sign postings just... oh, i'm not you say? I'm being ridiculous? Yes my examples are silly but it's the same principal, you can't make up legal looking signs whenever you're unhappy about something because it's not right to pretend to be official when you're not - EVEN if they are thinking of the children and trying to slow cars down all in the name of 'safety'

This pre-suposes there might be "legal obstructions"!

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They're called horseboxes.

Had a thought about this one - IF it is indeed a 30 , not requiring repeaters as lit to regs - if these are regarded as "official signs " by the HA(by virtue of non removal) - could this be taken as contravening the legislation regarding the provision of repeaters on lit 30 limits ????

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Only if they got the font, size, reflective materials, etc. etc. correct.
Heck, the councils can't even do that.

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Andrew.

But think of the pressure on the councils to prove that they have done their best to pull down these signs - or be seen to be condoning them --not what any council wants in this day of H & S --IS IT ??

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Er, I think it's you who's lost the plot. Let's find out. Answer this simple question: did the road in question have or not have a 30 limit?

What if they had been unhappy about the slow speed, and had put-up a sign with a black diagonal line across a white background ?
Not so funny then.

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56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Eh? I'm only talking about putting up an additional sign to reinforce the message about what the current limit is, not change it - did you think that I was talking about something else?

Firstly, I'm sure I wrote a reply to this post but it has either vanished (because I mentioned the moderation?) or I simply forgot to click the Submit button. If the latter - DER!



You're probably right................



So am I right in thinking that the police brought the wrong charge against you? That it WAS a 30 road and that you were speeding? That you got off on a technicality?



Yes, whereas most people who come on this board come on it because they claim to support road safety, it appears that you have come on it simply to show off for the fact that you got off a speeding offence on a technicality.



But how can you say that if, as I say above, the road did have a 30 limit and you were caught speeding? You got off on a technicality which is cynical enough and now you are moaning about a hand-made sign which someone has put up to try and get the likes of you to stick to the speed limit!

A bit like saying you got prosecuted for stealing your own car, but got off on the technicality that you owned it ?



They did not reinforce the message, they made the message illegal.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

The local authority/highways agency/whoever might have intended the limit to be 30, but if they've made a pigs ear of the signage/paperwork, then legally it ISN'T a 30 limit. And if the limit isn't legally set to 30, you simply can't go around prosecuting people for breaking it, because "it" isn't what you think it is...

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Chris