Safe Speed Forums

Paul, forgive me if this is off-topic

Well I promised to pin my colours to the mast.

Subject to a few qualifications (disabled, emergency vehicles, etc):

Motorways/Major A Roads

1. Buses (better use of transport density though not as good as trains)
2. Motorcycles (never ridden a motorbike but they look very efficient in terms of traffic density)
3.= HGVs/LGVs/Taxi (to be honest we should be using rail freight for long distances but I'll give them the HGVs the benefit the doubt that they journey is local)
3.= Business Motorists (assuming we can distinguish between business and leisure motorists)
4. Leisure motorists
No cyclists (assuming their given separate parallel roads)/no pedestrians

Highways/B and Minor Roads
1. Buses
2. Cyclists/Pedestrians (assuming that its not possible to given them their own lanes/walkways)
3. Motorcyclists
2. LGVs/Business Motorists/Taxi
3. Leisure motorists
4. HGVs (to my mind a 42 tonne vehicle is inappropriate for anything other than major roads and depots should be positioned accordingly)

Urban Environments
First off "Park & Ride" areas for all cars other than residents - the sort of thing Paris has in mind.
Second, every junction to have pedestrian crossing of some sort.
1. Buses
2. Cyclists/Mopeds (rather than bitching about them, motorists should consider what it would do for traffic density if they got off their bikes and into cars)
3. Motorcyclists (more sense than cars)
4. Taxi/LGVs- subject to be licensed to use urban spaces. I'm mildly curious as to what percentage of their cargo space is actually utilised?
5. Private resident car user (bottom of the pile, beneath the U-bend, you get the picture).
6. HGVs - only for 2 hour window/day

What does this tell you about me? And I know you'll be vocal about this - Well I think that cars have a place in society but way beneath public transport.

I live in a city through choice (though I love the country I realise that to live in the country and work in the city is going to result in quality of life issues on other people (traffic) and myself (time) - maybe that's something I'll keep for retirement). We have a car (12 year old Camry Estate which not even its mother would call stylish) which we use about once a fortnight (to see parents and in-law's), otherwise we walk, cycle or take the excellent public transportation (bus or tube).

I drop the children at school, shop for groceries (every day) and go to work by walking. If you you want to have a 30 mile commute to work by car, to me thats a lifestyle choice, but don't expect me to be any more sympathetic than to someone who takes a plane to work. As far I remember, we didn't suffer a Stalinist mobilisation of people in the UK. We make choices where to live and work, and with choice comes responsibility. Put another way, live near where you work, or can get public transport to work.

I won't say where I live as that's not part of the equation but I will concede that some areas have better public transportation than others. No, I haven't always been this way. In many ways I'm hypocritical as I owned high-performance cars and driven distances where it would have been quicker to walk after parking. What changed? My wife questioned my priorities

Maybe my situation can't be replicated everywhere but I would urge people to think about how they're going to go about their life if oil reaches $120 /barrel.

Now I await your replies.......

All road user classes must have equal priority (with the possible exception of the emergency services).

Anything else creates potentially dangerous conflicts and sets road user groups against one another.

I abhor 'social engineering'. Let the market decide.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Sorry but I thought busses ran on diesel. That means massive fare increases, same as most trains so we won't be able to afford to take public transport. Cars will have got more efficient as they always have done when busses will stay in the dark ages. Car travel will still be cheaper than public transport and infinitly more reliable and convenient.

We will be on Hydrogen, Natural Gas, Methanol long before then anyway.

If not they will have to drop the fuel duty to compensate. That should more than cover it. It is already proven that when oil prices go up, the government backs off from raising duty. And with 28 million car driving voters that won't change in a hurry.

No probs.

Anyhow what about horses? you missed them off the list.

I think therefore I drive.......

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Speed camera policy Kills

What does this say about you? That you're a city-dweller living in an area that has good public transport, work at a one-location job and have the parochial view - displayed by most of the "T2000 types" (for want of a better description) - that everyone is in exactly the same boat.

Problem is, they're not.

Me, for instance...

I effectively "counterbalance" you. I live in "the country" - actually only a few miles from Telford, but it could be darkest Mongolia for the level of public transport facilities. The only place within reasonable walking distance is the pub! My job involves me in physically having to work on customer sites that are dotted around the UK. There is no way that I could do my job without using a car, be it my own or a taxi (unfeasible because of the expense) as it is necessary to transport moderate amounts of delicate equipment - too much to hand-carry - thus it cannot be taken on public transport. Shopping etc, also involves a car as, as I said above, public transport here is abysmal and the nearest shop is about 4 miles away. Most socialising also tends to involve car transport too.

When it is available, reliable, punctual and clean, I use public transport for non-work journeys - for instance I wouldn't dream of driving to London to visit friends, I go by train - but still have to drive to the station (8 miles). I spend about a third of my life in Spain and find that I use public transport there more often - because it's a lot better than here, and a lot cheaper.



It certainly isn't here!

I am dismayed that the approach that appears to be taken by both government and the "public transport lobby" is to force people out of their cars by attempting to make car use expensive, inconvenient, uncomfortable and downright illegal; rather than to attract them into using public transport because it's a nice, comfortable, reliable, punctual, convenient, economic and viable alternative. I find it utterly insane that I can fly to Barcelona for less cost than taking the train to London - and it's not because the air-fare is ludicrously low!.. And, I can get a seat!



No problems for me.. By then I'll have retired and be living on my nice, totally eco-friendly, wind-powered yacht - in much warmer climes..

What? Where?



So you live in London. Will the "excellent public transport" cope if the other 65million of us move in?

Round here we don't have excellent public transport. If you have a small child and want to travel by bus you hope the bus doesn't already have a pram/pushchar aboard because they will only take one at a time. And the next one might be 20 or 30 minutes, and if that has a wheelchair on you have to wait for the next. I know one mother who waited two hours for a bus which would allow her buggy on board before giving up and taking a taxi.

So don't give me excellent ****ing public ****ing transport!

By the way. I walk to work, my children walk to school. The car stays at home for "liesure trips", which are nigh on impossible by public transport.

Train? the trainline runs less than a quarter of a mile from my place of work. Unfortunately it is several hundered feet below ground. And it isn't a tube. Which brings me to cycling. The hills which force the train to run underground make cycling something of a chore.

And did I mention the fact that it always rains, unless it's snowing.

If I lived in London I would use public transport. I think it's fantastic you can take an underground train which drops you within yards of anywhere you want to be. Oop 'ere it just doesn't exist. Trains are few and far between. Buses are only a realistic option for local trips, and to be honest I would rather walk (it's quicker for starters).

So before you start with your idealised ideas based on life in what may as well be another country. Try life out here in the real world.

are you having a laugh???

Highways/B and Minor Roads
1. Buses
2. Cyclists/Pedestrians (assuming that its not possible to given them their own lanes/walkways)
3. Motorcyclists
2. LGVs/Business Motorists/Taxi
3. Leisure motorists
4. HGVs (to my mind a 42 tonne vehicle is inappropriate for anything other than major roads and depots should be positioned accordingly)

Urban Environments
First off "Park & Ride" areas for all cars other than residents - the sort of thing Paris has in mind.
Second, every junction to have pedestrian crossing of some sort.
1. Buses
2. Cyclists/Mopeds (rather than bitching about them, motorists should consider what it would do for traffic density if they got off their bikes and into cars)
3. Motorcyclists (more sense than cars)
4. Taxi/LGVs- subject to be licensed to use urban spaces. I'm mildly curious as to what percentage of their cargo space is actually utilised?
5. Private resident car user (bottom of the pile, beneath the U-bend, you get the picture).
6. HGVs - only for 2 hour window/day

HGV/LGV are the same thing. a vehicle over 7.5 tons used for freight!

you represent the biggest problem that we face every single day. the attitude towards us. it is very simple. without HGVs, your local shop has no stock or bricks to build it or road to access it. we deliver everything around you. rail freight is expensive, unreliable and unworkable. you would need the train to stop at every single building in the country or transfer the goods back onto a truck and let them deliver to the door but then again, that doesnt suit you either. remove us from the roads and you can live in a tree and live off the land because that is your future without trucks. you better take your family and friends too since transport is delivered by truck. components are taken to factories by trucks and they are then delivered to traders by truck. final delivery to the customer is by truck too. remember that next time you get in your car (delivered by truck) and put fuel in it (delivered by truck) then go shopping (building materials delivered by truck (everything you buy is delivered by truck)). then go home (materials delivered by truck) on a road (materials delivered by truck).

we are not the problems of congestion. it is car drivers. most of us cant use public transport either because we start work before buses run or go home after the buses stop. some of us have to travel to places that buses dont even go.
JEEZ

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Richie

SSAFA supporter
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=126025031585

Obviously a Green Party Fanatic who can't understand the necessity of Trucks on the UK's Roads, unfortunately the Truck Driver is not like the School run mummy who decides to take the kids to work in the car rather than walk or public transport.

HGV's / LGV's regardless of their Maximum Gross Weight are an important part of everyday life, these Green Party Members think that Goods simply arrive at a shop on their own accord, sorry matey, life is not like that at all, Trucks are responsible for carrying everything you purchase from the shops at some stage through its life.

42 tons? Why quote 42 tons as being unnacceptable on Urban Roads? 44 Ton is the maximum Gross weight permitted, which includes the weight of the vehicle itself. Am I to take it you would prefer to see 12 Little 7.5 Ton vehicles each with a maximum cargo payload of 3 tons each carrying the bricks or Mortar to these new housing estates in the Countryside, Oh dear mr green party fanatic, you have not considered the extra Fuel which as a result means extra pollution






No, This tells me you are one of the Green Party know Alls who actually cannot come to grips with reality of the need for Trucks on our Roads.

Trucks are one of the heaviest levied modes of transport in the UK, £3500 per year Road Tax, vehicles which only cover 10 mpg (Just think of the tax the government are creaming off the Road Haulage Industry towards your green policies)

Trucks are subject to strict regulations as far as maintainance goes, every 6 weeks max they must be serviced, whereas with a car your looking at 6 months to 1 year.







Ahhh Yes you have a 12 year old Camry, a car which was manufactured back in 1993 when exhaust emissions and Euro 3 Engines were not much of a special topic.

Trucks are fitted with Euro 1, 2 or 3 engines, which means they meet very strict reduced pollution levels, so here we have a Green Party fanatic whosimply uses his OLD car to pollute the countryside when he decides to go out in it.

You Live in a city, so how do you want your goods delivered to your local shop? Maybe a good idea for you is to start your own business in your beautiful city, something like a Rickshaw service delivering from the City Outskirts to the inner city shops





You certainly love the public transport system dont you, yet you dont like more important things in life such as trucks which deliver your food






Yes you are Hypocritical as you certainly cannot understand the important requirements of Food on the table delivered to the shops by trucks





Oil will not reach $120 a barrel because the Arabs are well aware that they would not survive the war that would rage to get the oil from them

I have to agree with all that was said by Davey-D. (Before it's questioned, yes I do know him.)

I drive one of the beasts that you so obviously hate, a 44 tonner, as Davey said the heaviest vehicles on our roads without going in to special categories.

I drive for a firm that does multi-drop and many of my drops are in villages. What I would like you to answer is; "Who is going to pay, under your plan, to relocate all the thousands of small businesses, that for reasons of their own, are located in such places ?"

And then think of all the redundancies in the countryside, where the problems are the greatest already.

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English first, British second,
European? What's that?

bollox

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http://www.nitrucking.tk

This EtoileBrilliant person is living in a DREAM WORLD quite simply.

Certainly doesn't have a clue about the transport industry, that is for sure.

So we have 4 times as many 7.5-tonners? That'll do wonders for congestion.


So what do the drivers do for the remaining 6-8 hours of their working day?

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

6 - 8 hours? try 10 - 12 hours for a normal working day as a trucker

_________________
Richie

SSAFA supporter
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=126025031585

or 22 for an irish driver

_________________
http://www.nitrucking.tk

Where I rank road users by Conor Turton


1) HGV/PSV

2) Everyone else.

1) should always be given priority at all times.
2) Can get whatever is left.

Ah yes, the legendary consideration and courtesy of the "Knights of the Road"

Fancy meeting you here

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Oh Conor! You nitwit!

Nice to see you hear.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

And so it starts Truck haters of the world unite.

Where I rank road users (personal opinion) is;

1 All road users.


But courtesy comes in to it of course with all road users. If you see a truck climbing a hill, doing maybe 25 mph, and his side of the road is blocked with a parked car. As a car driver what do you do

Answer, the vast majority of you completely blank the truck and go through forcing the truck to stop on the hill, thereby delaying his journey unnecessarily, causing yet more global warming (if the dodgy theory is to be believed) and more congestion due to the domino effect on traffic behind the truck.

Here is a question for you. The organizers of this site who should know the answer, please don't give the game away, so, for want of a better word, ordinary motorists;


What is the legal speed limit for a vehicle over 7.5 tonnes gross weight, on a single carriageway road with the national speed limit in place ?

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English first, British second,
European? What's that?

I am not a truck hater - but Conor and I know each other from "another place" and when he makes remarks like that he is rather asking for it

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Touche

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English first, British second,
European? What's that?

What normally happens is, the truck is climbing the hill at 25mph and comes up behind another truck doing 23mph. He will then sit there for a minute or so, just until I'm coming up behind, at which point he'll to pull out to overtake the other one. And not content with holding me up for another few minutes while he creeps past, he'll then stay in the RH lane until he's passed another truck 100 yards further up the road.

Courtesy cuts both ways

Cheers
Peter