Safe Speed Forums

For a bit of motoring-connected light relief have a look at: www.lingscars.com
Then let's have your reactions.

WAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why everyone from here flood my website???

I have chat software and suddenly WOOOOOOOOOOOOSH! like a bloody herd of Yaks, everyone from Safe Speed forum descend on me like ton of bricks.

If my server crash, I blame Cooperman!

Please to note, I live on my website, it is my home. Please leave it tidy and do not spit.

I quite like speed cameras, I even have section about speed cameras. Enjoy!!!

Ling!

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

Even though you say you like speed cameras, Ling, I think I've fallen for you.

I don’t agree with your views on speed cameras (no surprise there); I suspect you would get more trade if you didn’t air views saying speeders are ‘idiots’. Why don’t you stick around and examine the reasoning as to why speed camera enforcement isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.

However, you really do have such a great website, almost tempted to do business “WAH!”

Only tempted?

Everybody has views, i speak my mind, most like that!

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

Well, Smeggy...

Apparently this is UK and I can air any legal view I want (unlike China). So I am glad you don't agree with me, it shows you have your own brain. However, I have been driving in the UK for 6 years now, and I must say that I have noticed a reduction in fast driving in inappropriate places - let's face it, that must be a good thing.

I do not want to get into a debate over speed cameras, but you will find that the vast majority of people rather appreciate them, as they have contributed to a reduction in speeding. People must be rather stupid if they get caught; I never have. There are sensible guidelines controlling their use, and while the British police and camera safety partnerships can never be perfect, I think that generally they are fair.

There are so many places in the Uk where there are no speed cameras, and I think that people who get one hot-potato topic like this dominating their thinking are rather sad. You will notice that speed cameras are simply a non-issue to most sensible-driving people and most are probably rather glad that many habitual speeders have been banned. You will also notice that there are not many resources on the web similar to my speed-camera guide; they seem to be low on people's demand-list.

You carry on thinking what you like, Smeggy, I simply don't care about your views, and would simply encourage people to slow down in places where it is inappropriate to drive fast. I am sure you are a very nice person, though.

Discuss...

Ling!
www.LINGsCARS.com

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

Hey Ling, can you do personal contract hire on motorcycles?

_________________
Former Military Police Officer and accident investigator

Hey, Patch,

I would LOVE to. Every few months I trawl round BMW, Honda etc trying to get deals on Fireblades or RT or whatever. The finance companies are never interested and the dealers are next to useless. They just have retail-sales in their eyes, you can see it when you talk to them. They have no concept there is a massive market out there for renting a nice bike for 2 years or so.

I have an old C reg 1985 BMWR80RT. Does that get me extra points? No, maybe not

Ling
Ex Chinese schoolgirl and good boiled egg.

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

Not necessarily, I could instead be agreeing with whatever SafeSpeed says. For me, a sign of intelligence is being able to justify your opinion.

Here's why I don't believe in the current speed camera policy (notice I didn't say speed cameras). I used to believe the cameras resulted with 40-70% reduction of KSI at speed camera sites simply because I believed the SCP's claims at face value (I didn't have a brain). Then I did research prompted by the argument of 'Regression To The Mean' (overview can be found here), something which the SCPs still refuse to acknowledge.

Then there's the distraction these devices cause: speedo watching combined with panic braking (especially by those already caught) when entering speed enforcement zones is very dangerous.

Then there's the disproportionate penalty - families losing their income because the provider was caught doing 77 or so on a motorway 4 times in 3 years.

There is also the definition of speeding. Most KSIs of which speed was stated a factor (12%) were with all involved within the speed limit (30% of the 12%, hence speed cameras won't have much effect anyway). However, the SCPS are redressing this by systematically reducing all limits thereby skewing the figures such that more accidents occur above the (reduced) limit (hence cleverly justifying their existence).

Worst of all is the fact the authorities have been focussing on speed at the expense of other more significant factors (inattention, lack of skill, drink driving.........). There are 2000 staff (my estimate) working on what is believed to be far less than 4% of the overal problem.


I disagree. It all depends on the question you ask them: "are speed cameras meant to save lives?" or "are speed cameras actually saving lives?". The answer is indicated by the number of drivers who admit to exceeding the motorway speed limit.


But the constant reduction of speed limits are having the reverse effect, which is why prosecutions are still on the increase.


Neither have I. You say on your site that "These vans are very difficult to spot, their operators are very good at hiding." so not all can be so stupid. Also, drivers concentrate on the road ahead, a box on a pole is not a real hazard so subconsiously they can easily be dismissed.


That's because the majority have been hoodwinked by the SCPs statistical illusions (RTTM, 'bias on selection').


Of course, but on free flowing motorways where there can be no subsequent danger?

Post deleted...

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Aquila



Licat volare si super tergum aquila volat...

We'd agree with that.

But do you REALLY think that the speed limit defines 'too fast'? What about all those 60mph country lanes? Are they full of people driving at 60mph? And if not, why not?

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Ling, it's quite simple.
My brother was knocked off his motorcycle on the A592 when he met a car overtaking into a blind bend, who WAS within the speed limit.
Driver was prosecuted for dangerous driving.
Since then, neither my brother nor the driver has had an accident on that road.
One driver who it is suspected was speeding, ran out of road and killed himself. He has not had another accident either.
Net result?
Reduction in accident statistics, (two less KSI) for which the "Safety Camera" partnership now claim credit for, while collecting large amounts of money from drivers who still speed, without having accidents!

The clowns with the cameras don't even bother to stop them!!!
At least the police in UK and China STOP the idiotic speeders!!

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

Hmmm,

For whatever reason, you are all very passionate about these speed cameras.

Even this forum title is sanctimonious. "Safe Speed" indeed! Like someone who uses this forum is superior in their judgement. Why not just call it "Safe" or, "Speed" and tell the truth? Go one way or another. You sound a bit like the American Gun lobby! "Safe Shooters" would also be a good forum title. A car can be just as lethal as a bullet.

At least cameras do a basic job of making people aware that there are limits and that if you drive at speed regardless, it is simply a matter of time before you lose your licence. And cameras must release some police for other duties, as must the new Highways Agency people I see.

But don't you all understand the basic premise?

Your views are not a significant political factor, therefore it doesn't matter what you think. Because in reality very little will change, however much you jump up and down. - You must have very little else in your lives to worry about! Why not get out there and do something exciting or difficult, my business is like riding a tidal wave, I would never have imagined I would be juggling £1m of sales per month, plus cash flow, plus 50 customers at a time, plus another 25 enquiries a day. It is better than fast driving for getting my adreneline going! What on earth are you all doing? Some boring job with no risk?

Now I know it is good to have a group who sort of provide a check and balance to any significant excess by "the system", but really, are speed cameras the worst thing about the UK and something that should be on a priority list of "things that need something done about them"? - Nahhh.

I would repeat my view that it seems that most people are quite satisfied by their effect, and that it this were not the case then Safe Speed would be a significant movement instead of something 99% of people have never heard of, and care less about.

I hate all the santimonious rubbish by people who intrinsically know that they have the ability and skill to know the correct safe speed limit for any piece of road. I hate it that no one can ever be seen to make a mistake in their driving. My husband recently took his C and D tests and he failed both, first time, passed both second time and never had a clean sheet - yet he is reasonable driver. Any of his faults could have resulted in an incident, maybe an accident. It's interesting that if you exceed the speed limit in your test, you fail. And also if you drive too slowly - fail to make reasonable progress.

It makes sense to me, that if (generally) on a 40mph road, everyone is travelling at a sensibly similar speed, there will be less overtaking (so less risk), less acceleration and braking, a consistent traffic speed for pedestrians and turning drivers to judge, and a more relaxing going on. We've all jumped out of our skin when a noisy bike suddenly overtakes at speed, and you think "sh1t, I never even saw him coming in my mirrors". Well I think 99% of drivers do not check mirrors enough (me included) in normal driving - certainly they would fail a driving test if they had to take one at the drop of a hat, or if after YOUR next journey a driving examiner popped up from the back seat and said "I've been observing you for the last 40 mins and you've failed".

The point being that in any drive speed does contribute to shorter reaction periods, more braking, more likelihood of sudden changes of direction etc. Try a PS2 driving game nice and slowly, smoothly - then try it fast. Most people are not experts. Most of you. And even experts only need one mistake... I mean look at the number of collisions involving police or fire vehicles. So try it a bit slower, consistently, smoothly, safely... and stop thinking about yourself!

Everyone can trot out some specific example, yet in our heads we all know we have had lucky escapes when we have made stupid mistakes, ourselves. My God, it hurts when you crash and it is even more stupid to injure someone else. Speed cameras that make traffic behave more consistently really are appreciated by most drivers.

Why are you all so obsessed with wringing the last drop of speed out of your journey, anyway? To travel a bit slower is often more pleasant, less stressful, certainly better for the environment, better for your car/bike and more pleasant for other road users and pedestrians.

On the M25, my husband told me that before the variable speed limits and cameras it could be like a racing track, but worse, with wildly differing speeds and violent braking. He says the variable speed limits really have helped there. And when you have those SPECS things on a section of motorway - like on the M11 at the mo - the traffic is so well behaved it cannot be true. But it is.

And speed cameras and police checks etc are the main tools used to influence our driving behaviour. They certainly work. Most people do NOT want to lose their licence, or get points. It may be a blunt stick, and everyone knows it is not perfect. But in general they work, not perfectly, but acceptably to most people.

I'm sure you're all very nice people, so carry on banging your little obsessive drums, but most of the rest of us simply aren't listening, we are just driving calmly and paying particular attention where there are speed cameras!

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

Hi Ling,

I think you are going to be a very useful contributor to this forum as you appear to be able to put your point of view without getting too emotionally heated about it.

I am in total agreement with you on one thing - I simply don't care about your views either (but I enjoy listening to them).

"Why are you all so obsessed with wringing the last drop of speed out of your journey, anyway?" We aren't. We are "obsessed" with opposing Government policies which are likely to lead to worse road safety and their obsession with cameras is one of them.

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

I hope I can, otherwise I would never have survived this long. As Paul points out, there are a lot of narrow county lanes around here with 60mph speed limits. If I wasn't capable of setting my own speed using judgement, I would have crashed long ago, because the speed limit tells you nothing about what the fastest safe speed is.

I think you are confusing what you actually wrote ('the ability and skill to know the correct safe speed limit for any piece of road') with what you really meant ('the ability and skill to drive at ANY speed on ANY piece of road'), which I don't think any of the regulars here are in fact claiming.



Well I don't think that's true. People are encouraged to report their mistakes, in the section 'Near Misses'.

ZamZara, then for every hour of driving, most people will have to make at least 10 posts. If someone has not been observant, how near does the miss have to be before they will spot it?

Most people here have this little speed camera hobby horse. You know there is a real-life out there in the wide world - go and enjoy it!

Get over this little annoyance, we have speed cameras and - SHOCK - they make a (good) difference!

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

Hi Ling and
But wouldn't it be great if for every hour of driving, we could reduce that number of 10, to say 5? You say 'most people' - hopefully not on this forum!

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Pecunia Prius Equitas et Salus

Well, ppppffff. If this is the government policy that jumps out at you, out of all the many important things that affect your lives, then I think either you do have a slight obsession here, or you are not living in the same world as me.

Coming back from many countries to the UK, I am always amazed how much the Governments' policies (over the years) actually work, in making driving safe, steady and less stressful.

How to avoid this whole argument: Temper your speed, drive slower, take it easy.

Then this whole board and all the energy put into it can be directed up a much more worthwhile avenue.

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.

The problem is that this IS real life. Real life is that THOUSANDS of people every year are dying un-necessarily because of the fixation that the authorities have with speed.

You say that speed cameras release traffic police from their duties. That is part of the problem. We WANT traffic police, as they can spot bad drivers, drunk drivers, drugged drivers, tired drivers etc. Speed cameras can't - if you aren't speeding then they aren't interested. We need more Kojak and less Kodak as someone famously pointed out!

You make an analogy with guns. Well would you try to make guns safer by slowing the bullets down slightly? Of course not - if you were in a situation where people had to carry and use guns every day - like they have to drive cars every day - then you make them safer by training them to use them properly.

SPECS cameras don't make motorways safer. On the contrary they encourage all the traffic to sit side by side for prolonged periods, which hugely increases the risk of "side swipes". A range of different speeds between all the different vehicles is actually good for safety, it means vehicles don't stay in the danger zone for as long when overtaking, and drivers are more alert and less likely to lose attention and crash. We know that lack of attention causes about 10 times more crashes than speeding - last thing we should do is put devices on the motorway that make everyone pay less attention to each other.

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CSCP Latin for beginners...
Ticketo ergo sum : I scam therefore I am!

Oh Wah! Here we go "hopefully not on this forum". You are all a bit of a cut above the average driver. Because you have all talked yourselves into this dreamworld where because you share an intelligent dislike/unacceptance of the validity of speed cameras, and you can string an argument together, then you MUST be better drivers than the average Joe! Surley! Definitely! Gottobe! Must be! Aren't we? We're not? Really? Oh.

Go and lobby against something worthwhile, instead of trying to change things the vast majority of people support!

_________________
I am Ling!
Visit www.LINGsCARS.com
I am car sales whirlwind. I like speed cameras.
Rent new car from me, save £££s.