Safe Speed Forums

Is it safe to drive on any road, at the given speed limit, on compacted snow in fog? If not then the speed limit cannot have been set for the worst-case scenario.
…..unless you are one of those people who relies upon the limit as their only guide to their driving speed, so much so that their judgement of a safe driving speed has been eroded.

So is defending red light jumping .. pavement riding and not having lights ion the bike at night. These are agaisnt the law - but we see a lot of cyclists defending this practice on C+.

There have also been threads encouraging throwing rocks at cars and kicking out at cars at traffic lights as well.

That's what really made Kriss post in the first place. She'd had a scare on her horse from two riders on mountain bikes and the wretched thing nearly bolted with her on it. Had it thrown her - despite a hard hat and a "feline" ability to land on her feet - could have been nasty.

She'd also seen a cyclist almost run down her little girl on a pavement outside the school. She ran after him. I am told from those who saw this that this was one BIG Cat in a lioness-like pounce! Result - she was injured when the cyclist kicked her when she caught up with him. Hence she had time on her hands.. and read on thread about chucking rocks at cars, defending using mobile phones whilst riding, kicking cars and then when she mentioned she drove a Landy for work.. all hell let loose on her - even though she did explain that as a rural vet - she did need the type of car by necessity and used a vehicle more in tune with a town when in town. SO "greedy" for having two cars .. but the woman does live in a very peaceful rural area. Off the beaten track so to speak.

But I think any ccyling campaing needs to address this militancy and wanting both the roads and the pavements.. and deliberately causing gridlock in towns with CMs as well.

Nothing against any bike ride or protest procession.. but we do need to knwo about the route for safety and security reasons for all.. and we have to keep inconvenience to others to a minimum.

Besides.. the more people ride bikes - more legislation and regulation will be required. Does not follow that thousands of bicycles competeting for the same road space will be any less congested at peak than the current situation of lunatics in cars and on bikes trying to get to work on time at present.

Cyclotopia does not exist any more than Dreamdriveland.

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

Don't think he's exaggerating:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0, ... 33,00.html

I like them little guys.. and since you don't like my using them..

Shall have some fun....



Lum posted up the relevant link I think.. though will check again. Though I saw it the last time I visited the forum.

It's in a speed zone area. Basically we cannot enforce in these "zone" areas" as most are private lands as in owned by NT, English Heritage , supermarkets and so on. Or they are residential areas with a number of side streets governed under this same zone. So - since it would be extremely difficult to enforce in any case as we have not enough officers - we try to enforce a slow down with the speed hump.

If the road is limited by a local council bye-law and I know many of the Lakeland and Co Durham villages do have such limits along major A trunks which go through the villages - tehy have to have repeater lollies.

Contrary to urban myth by the way We can enforce that limit. In fact - penalty for breaking this can be as much as 6 points at 26 mph.

By the way .. Royal Parks come under a different brolly.

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

I think Red Ken ditched that idea pretty quickly, although I could be wrong.

But then again if I manage to get the COAST message across to all the angry drivers who hit this site because they have been pinged.. don't you think we might stand a better chance of getting them to think about thier driving and give you that much needed space - by reading and accepting.COAST. You would be amazed at the number of Mr Fuming at Oorrd Cop who sent NIP who registers here... and then pms me to find out what COAST is all about. I have moved it to Word so that I can do waht spindrift does and just past it up to the provate message and they always seem thankful for a kind word and a bit of advice to actually improve their standards for the better.

COAST is not about "speeding". It's about choosing the safest speed possible to match those road conditions and not scare the lycra off the cyclists and leave pedestrians and other drivers with moist undies.

Most of the time - it's bubbling just below speed limit but within "pass the driving test" speed as they can fail you for "not making progress within moving traffic" For a serious hazard .. - means well below limit.








But you still need to COAST this drive. I'd much rather no one was hit cos it does hurt a lot. You can still be hit and hurt vry badly if the driver fails to see you and adapt position and speed accordingly.

So - on that basis - I think I am justified like my retired guv in focusing on the actual driving standard to control the the speed to its safest level for the condition.

COAST has never been about "breaking speed limits or abolishing speed limits"




Then I would be considering "furious pedalling!" You are obliged to keep to the same limit as the drivers. What about grids and potholes? What if your tyre overheated from all that furious pedalling?

What if a child ran in front of you. Are yoiu sure you'd be able to stop in time given a bicycle does not have the same braking force as a car.. check out Frankin in first chapter and and artticle in CW - think you can get the archived review from their website.

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

He backed down.. but it's still being discussed in the House of Lords and some Tory MPs are now muttering about it per CW piece which I think I posted down in our Cycling forum.

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

For record - Co Durham prosecute more on aggregate for careless/undue than for pure speeding offences - though we have a fair share of these as well. Usually above our fair tolerance and usually "travelling through" as they do underestimate just how strict we really are. . These are the type who scare me as driver, motorbiker, cyclist and pedestrian. We will nab the truly awful as a priority and speeders (whether fined or let off this time) usually benefit more from a really firm but fair ticking off and we will not go into how long COAST lectures "drone on for" - but I think you could guess

_________________
Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

I don't see why you shouldn't answer the simple points in these posts:
http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewt ... 913#116913
http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewt ... 922#116922
... because otherwise we'll just have to recover the same ground.



Yes you do. The speed limit won't save anyone in such high hazard situations.



Everyone has to take responsibility for safety. Such responsibility extends way beyond the limits defined in law.



Whereas blind speed limit compliance will ensure that everything in the garden smells of roses? Give me a break!

"Safe Speed" is a consequence of skills, attitudes, consideration and responsibility.

We need to aim a lot higher than blind legal compliance. That's one of the problems - the government is aiming low and the rest of the world is following them down.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

But it isn't silly - it's the ultimate consequence of the argument you are offering.

You're calling for speed limit compliance with utter disregard for the other factors. I'm telling you that it is NOT safe to ASSUME that those other factors will be preserved as emphasis on speed limit compliance increases.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Never in a million years. The worst case scenario is zero mph and it's extremely commonplace.

You might also find the following recent PR helpful: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SafeSpeedPR/message/278

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Sorry, I'm missing this point, are you saying that I'd be satisfied to see a higher casualty rate because it would prove my argument; or that a higher casualty rate is an inevitable consequence of inflexible speed limits enforced by unthinking machines?

I was using hyperbole, but it's clear from the context what point I was making.

I note the C+ "four" are now accusing IG, MM and WC of being Scientologists?

http://www.cyclingplus.co.uk/forum/topi ... hichpage=5

Having said that I didn't quite follow the reference to Dianetics either IG?

What's COAST ?

I don't ride at 30 mph. I do stop at red lights. When the lights change the motorists can all drive past me, and when the lights change again there'll be a break in the traffic behind me. By the time the next lot of cars get the green light, I've gone far enough to stay in front of them if they keep to 30, but if they go much faster than that the'll catch me up. (Probably I could keep clear even of these if I cycled furiously, but there are too many hazards. )
The 60 mphers catch me up just where there's a traffic island that prevents them from overtaking safely; and they're going to concerned about hitting the island. I can't move to the left because of parked cars.
A Gatso there would mean that they'd be driving down the hill with their foot on the brake rather than the accelerator, which would make life safer for me and for every other cyclist on that road. The limit is 30, which is sensible here, and there's no requirement for anyone to go faster. Why not have a camera?

A certain degree of pragmatism here. If the speed limits were set to 30 or below on all roads except motorways, journeys would take too long, so higher speeds are permited on roads where there are considered to be fewer hazards. 60mph roads don't have pavements, houses and shops as a rule.

I would say it wasn't given the consistency of the subsequent responses.

That aside and returning to your point:
Much of the German road network has permanently variable limits. The limit through villages are lowered during the small hours for quality of life (I endeavour to coast where appropriate in that situation). At the same time, many limits are completely removed (no speed limit) for other stretches.
Also, nominally derestricted autobahns have a speed limit when wet (OK the definition of ‘wet’ is open to opinion, but at least the law reflects the spirit of the law).

And how do they know how much they have to brake?

While they’re watching the speedo they’re not watching the road ahead or where they’re going.

Ohmigiddyaunt

This is a REAL pissing contest isn't it?

In fact, its a six storey air-conditioned pissing contest, carpeted foyer, adult TV, lifts playing Pink Floyd, 24 hour porterage, free bar, all-you-can-eat restaurant and a 40 foot neon sign saying "THIS IS A PISSING CONTEST" (Black Adder original acknowledged).

Sheeesh

This is Tourist Tony's idea of a joke