Safe Speed Forums

For all the (understandable) vitriol, Bombus has hit the nail on the head with his point that you are not the police. The real police get trained in order to prevent people causing a danger, and how to protect themselves, through training and equipment, should these offenders turn nasty. I would hate to see you stabbed with a screwdriver, as has happened, because you decided to take policing into your own hands. I would urge you to wind your neck in, and inform the police of any transgressions you witness, rather than trying to 'teach them a lesson' on your own!




Hows this for a reason; if your speedo reads 70mph, the chances are it could be out by as much as 7mph. Thus, if you are indicating a dead 70mph on the motorway, your true speed could be as low as 63mph. How do you think that reducing the entire motorway to your artificially low speed benefits the interests of society, and more importantly, who put you in a position to be judge of this?

Furthermore, changing lanes on the motorway should be effortless and safe, every time you do it, unless you lack the competance to drive on the motorway. You should always remain as far left as possible, to maximise the road's traffic carrying capacity.



Techinically, by posting this rot, you are highlighting your glaring ignorance.

Yes, I know, I tried to start off understanding and contructive, but suffering fools gladly has never been one of my strong suits, and some of this ignorance was just too irritatingly obtuse to overlook.

I'm sorry peegee, I am sure you have the best of intentions, but your driving attitude is downright dangerous, and you are likely to cause more of a danger on the roads than the 72mph motorway drivers that you are trying to 'stamp out'. Please get back in your box, for the sake of us all!!

Hear hear robin.

Nothing annoys me more than 'middle lane drivers' I've often suspected that there was some envy or other strange motivation at play rather than sheer bumbling incompetance but now you've confirmed it.

Do you see yourself as a kind of motoring equivalent to Batman?

Misguided and very sad.

People are starting to quote the highway code - lovely stuff. Let me explain.

Recently I spoke to a solicitor I know about a road traffic offences that could be incurred.

After the ringing of laughter from the solicitor abated - as they saw no reason to believe any road traffic offence would be heard "freely and fairly", anyway - they proceeded to tell me the following.

The highway code is what it say!!! A code and not law!!! I argued the case in point and the plain fact is that no matter what the code says - its only an interpretation of the laws - and how best we get by and apply them. Therefore there is no law that states you must jump out of the way into the tramlines on a motorway if your going at 70mph in the middle lane. Any inference otherwise in the "code" is only that.

To quote the "lane rules" on one breath but on another seem to advocate or condone flying past "breaking the speed limit" is completely nuts. Its almost as bad as the idiots that feel undertaking is a great wheez when faced by a driver adhering to the laws and trying to over take with a 10mph advantage a line of lorries trundling along at 60mph on a dual carriageway. Primarily because the police dont patrol for lorries breaking the speed limits by 10 or 20mph.

I even got one policeman (Inspector) who swore blind an HGV could do 50mph on a single lane A road!!! I pointed out 40mph - and he actually had to go off and check - and didnt even apologise for his grossly wayward error!

Read into it as you may - but we're sitting here throwing stones at each little glass house. What we need is for people to admit things are wayward and wrong - and start fixing it.

peegee.

I agree that the HC is just an interpretation of the current laws governing our roads. However drivers and riders are taught to pass a test based on that code. Having just gone through the current test system again for my motorcycle test I will say this.

You are taught to make safe progress for yourself. If you are not in the nearside lane, when you should be in the opinion of the examiner, you are very likely to fail.

To block, intentionally or not, following vehicles is regarded as unsafe. Irrelevant of the illegalities the following vehicle is committing. You are viewed as driving in an unsafe manner by putting yourself in harms way and you will fail a test.

I always drive for myself. If I can get out of the way of a vehicle going quicker than me I will do. I would rather have them driving away from me than towards. They are less likely to cause me grief that way.

http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk/

If you goto each section you'll see some are advisements - and contain no "law" reference. Others as you'll see form the "basis" of law and could see you fall foul of the draconian laws they present in the most "basic" terms.

To fully understand the code and be able to interpret this properly - you'd have to understand the underlying law being referenced.

In the case of the "lanes" and which one we should go to and when - this is an advisement only - and has no reference in law.

If your in the middle lane and its safe to do so - and your driving at the posted speed limit 70mph - there is not a thing captain fast and the reckless crew can do. In fact the MLM may actually be doing a good service by getting people to at least think about how fast they are actually going.

Bottomline - if we think the speed limits are too low - then perhaps those need fixed and mlm wouldnt look so silly sticking to the law.

Hey Bombus - you know you've added a lot to the general discussion by lowering things to personal insults at me - and this "member" is calling me a troll!!! Lovely bunch.

As to last poster - what is blocking!!! If I'm driving along minding my own business passing slower vehicles in "slow" lane - then should I jump out of the way of a person obviously speeding way beyond the law and their ability allows!! No chance.

More often than not you jump out of the road - into slow lane - have to put the anchors on to ensure your doing "lorry" speed and to keep a reasonable gap - then have another ball ache trying to get back out to middle lane whilst doing 60mph now. This highlights the problems these captain fasts create and just dont understand.

As for the "unmarked" police car "two cars behind" - they all still have "siren and lights" hidden on their cars - so that in the event of an emergency - they can stop pretending to be a normal car. The point is also mute on a "3 lane" as they would just overtake in the 3rd lane - so being in the middle wouldnt affect their pursuit for safety ;)

Oh good! So you can drive like a twat legally!

Do you mean 'moot'?

You seem to have changed your tune, previously you were boasting about obstructing people you considered to be breaking the law, and now you're claiming that you can't get into and out of L1 of the motorway safely? Which is it peegee, vigilante menace or underskilled driver?

If you're overtaking slower traffic then noone is suggesting you should be pulling over to let someone fly past you, as if they had more right to the roads than you, and indeed this would not make you a MLM! What does make a MLM is someone who does not move to the left when there is ample space for them to do so safely and without inconveniencing themselves or others.

We should all be on the same side on the roads, we all have a common goal after all, to get where we are going in a safe and timely fashion. That some people, through ineptitude, ignorance or a misguided vigilante stance, see fit to drive in a discourteous and inflamatory manner works against both those points, reducing road capacity and introducing needless risks.

You can spout all you like about not having to obey the HC because its only a code, but that merely makes you a hypocrite as well.

No you are overtaking a slower vehicle and have as much right to be in the "overtaking" lanes as the car following.

However you, being a conscientious and safe driver minding your own business, are viewing the traffic flow both in front and behind and can make a determination as too the safest time to allow the car behind past. To sit in a lane and not take the opportunity to remove a hazard from your environment is, at best irresponsible at worst stupid.

As I said I would rather have that vehicle going away from me than towards.


How do you know the ability of the driver behind? Do you have telepathy?

Having just got a sat nav I was very supprised to find my digital speedo doing exactly this. Toyotas under read 10% on the speed. Strangly they read correct on the distance.

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

Did you actually mean to say 'over read'?

Presumably you mean over read?

I have a theory that this is designed in. To be cost effective the manufacturing process will produce speedos with some error. By making sure that error is always on the "right" side of true the manufacturers avoid potential liability that could occur if a faulty speedo resulted in a conviction.

Most posters on this site appear to consider lane disclipline as of extreme importance.

PeeGee you seem to regard adherence with the posted limit as more important than lane discipline. Too me this is indicitive of a muddled perception of road safety priorities.

Am I correct in my understanding of your priorities?

peegee, could you please do us other road users a bloody favour and use L1, L2, and L3 where appropriate.

Use of all available lanes on a M-Way is good practice for both yourself and other drivers around you. It makes you more aware of your road space, makes you use your mirrors and indicators more often, singles you out as a courteous and well mannered driver, and (assuming that you have the necessary awareness of closing distances, and the nous to indicate and manouvre when appropriate) gives other drivers in your outside lanes a better chance to compensate and adjust in a smooth, unobtrusive manner.

If you really, consciously, drive in L2 continually on clear stretches of M-Way with no entry slips, nothing in L1, and nothing i L3, then - sorry - but you need a little re-training because that is ignorant and selfish driving.

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Simon

SigmaMotion
CivilEng

Your not even considering what I've said.

Lane discipline has to be part of any safe driving - however as it is stated in the HWYCode the dual/motorway lane discipline is an advisement at best and not associated with any law referenced by the HWYCode - where as the speed is the law.

If I'm going at above the speed of l1 and within the 10% +or- the 70mph limit in l2 - THEN I DONT EXPECT TO BE BULLIED OUT OF THE WAY !!!
Especially if there is a free l3 - so you two and others with a death wish on your licence - can go play chicken with the local camera partnership in l3.

We should not have to suddenly speed up for you either - just coz you might have a toyota and have a crisis of whether you should believe an inacurate SatNav over your speedo - or have an agressive twitch on your full beam switch.

If I didnt use my mirrors I wouldnt see the speeders coming - and see the flashes in my mirror. If you want to go faster then pull into the l3. If that l3 is not there - then be as patient and courteous as you are expecting me not to be!!

I've got no muddled perception on road safety priorities - but unfortunately I dont make the laws either - until I do - then I'm afraid your stuck with someone doing the speed limit in l2 - overtaking people in l1 - and you'll have to slip into l3 or be patient for a change.

How simple yet effective.

But of course our couple of members above, dont see this and just "reject" a decent debate out of hand with little thought for others who have a different view - and who even try to work/adhere to the laws as they stand right now.

If these people are stating otherwise then thats a more serious matter - and could be construde as something different and more sinister.

Peegee, hopefully your shift of stance shows that you've realised intentionally blocking people is not a safe way to drive. The thing is, noone has ever suggested that using L2 to overtake slower traffic makes one a middle lane moron, so there is no debate to be had on this issue!

The issue is your original assertation that you willfully block drivers that you perceive to be driving faster than the speed limit!!

As for satnav being less accurate than a speedometer, do get real! The car manufacturers are not going to spend a penny more than absolutely necessary on speedometers, so long as any error is an overread, in order to prevent inadvertant speeding. On the other hand, the satnav network has had millions, if not billions, of dollars invested in it by the US Dept of Defence, and is so accurate it can put TLAMs through individual windows on a building!

So, the question for you really is this: what reason do you have for not moving from L2 to L1 when L1 is clear, and if you have none why are you arguing?

I'm stating nothing more serious than the fact that making full use of all lanes of the M-Way when prevailing conditions allow is nothing more than good and courteous driving. Using L2 when both lanes 1 and 3 are clear is just unconscious driving; no thought required. I'm not going to "bully" you out of your lane, I'm just going to adjust my driving to suit.

How do I do that?

Being aware of the surrounding road conditions, using mirrors, employing peripheral vision, and carrying out manouvres that don't impede other road users. Qualities that seem to be alien to your average MLM.

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Simon

My niece has a fear of heights - this is Acrophobia, Altophobia or Hypsiphobia, according to http://www.phobialist.com/#A-

So when she goes over the bridge of the Dartford crossing, or similar bridges, she drives in the middle lane so she can't see over the edge on either side.

I suppose for these particular circumstances she can be forgiven. Funnily flying in an aircraft at xx,000 feet does not bother her.

She was also telling me of a woman who can't use roundabouts, so it is a good job that woman doesn't live in Milton Keynes.

If I ever saw headlights flashing in my mirrors, the only thing I would think is 'I must have lost a brake light bulb!'

You mean people actually exceed 70 on motorways? I'm shocked, SHOCKED I tell you.

Next you'll be telling me people touch the white paint on mini roundabouts.