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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:18 
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Yes on GMTV he launched this Christmas drink drive campaign with a call for zero alcohol limit but admitted in the same breath that they could not make people stick to the current one.

This was followed by an item calling for thick sliced bread to be banned.
I am not kidding!

Suddenly Edwina Curry seams quite sane :headache:

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 14:12 
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The idea of a zero-alcohol limit sounds attractive to many, but in reality it's completely impractical.
If you have a moderate drink or two with dinner, you will still have a small residual alcohol count the next morning. Even 24 hours after a party you could still show some reading on a test machine. how far does he want to take this zero-figure?


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 16:05 
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anton wrote:
This was followed by an item calling for thick sliced bread to be banned.
I am not kidding!


I saw this very briefly earlier myself too, I'm avoiding looking into why cos it'll just annoy me


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 16:43 
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I feel like posting each thick slice to westminster in seperate jiffy bags in protest. That should mess thier day up.

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 16:50 
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anton wrote:
I feel like posting each thick slice to westminster in seperate jiffy bags in protest. That should mess thier day up.


If you did it in direct proportion to the MP thickness -you might find it difficult to find a slices to fit the bill - especially for ones like the member for Kingston on Hull :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 18:34 
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Calls for a zero limit are ridiculous. Is somebody who blows a 0.005% any more likely to be impaired than somebody else who doesn't register at all? A true zero limit would effectively make it illegal to drive after eating a sherry trifle, brandy butter with Christmas cake, or even many cough syrups.

And all for nothing. The people who take no notice of the existing limit and try to drive when they're at 0.2% or even more are the biggest menace. If they drive drunk now, how is a zero limit going to make any difference?


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 18:46 
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Surely laws against drink-driving violate our human right to choose to drive drunk?

In some accidents, you're better off being drunk, since it relaxes your muscles and means you're less likely to break bones.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 19:10 
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Robin,

Ha, ha. Very funny.

Not expecting a reply from anyone in particular are you?

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 19:13 
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Chalk and cheese......


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 19:51 
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anton wrote:
Yes on GMTV he launched this Christmas drink drive campaign with a call for zero alcohol limit but admitted in the same breath that they could not make people stick to the current one.

Back to a more serious note, news report here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7120711.stm

Quote:
Mr Fitzpatrick also said the government would be consulting on lowering the drink drive limit.

He told GMTV: "There is always an argument for zero tolerance.

"We are going to be consulting early in the new year on whether to keep the limit as it stands or drop it, and whether to introduce random breath testing of motorists."

Look out for another smokescreen to cover the government's road safety failures :x

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 00:35 
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And when the government in 5 years time realises that this won't improve road safety, I'm sure they'll try speed limit cuts again. :roll:

Has anyone noticed how emotion seems to be used the most with drink driving to get people to accept lower limits?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 03:37 
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Sounds like a good way to close all the Pubs to me...... :roll:


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 06:44 
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We need to shift thier argument from the " in a test drivers were X times slower to react" to
"Where is the evidence that a driver who has had 1.5 pintes is having significantly more injury accidents" Because I dont believe it is there.
If the evidence was there I would support a reduction in the limit. But not to zero

Responsible drivers who have a pint and are the driver adjust thier driving to thier slower reaction just as you would if you had a cold.

A drastic cut in the limit would realy spoil life for millions of people and thier passengers. For years designated drivers have had just one or two drinks over about 3 hours. There is a limit to how much coke and orange juice you can drink.

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 10:09 
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Draco wrote:
Sounds like a good way to close all the Pubs to me...... :roll:


[conspiricy mode]

Bad for pubs maybe but good for the brewers! People who get into the habit of boozing at home tend to drink rather more. So more profit for the "manufacturers".

Political contributions anyone??

[/conspiricy mode]

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 10:14 
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But it's our campaign of the month agaiin. :roll:

It's uniform across all 43 Forces in the "season to to be merry" :wink:


You cannot really make it "zero" in reality. Booze as C+ points out has been part of the human diet for centuries - ever since we discovered that fermenting veggies and cereals tastes rather pleasant on the tingue :drink:

But seriously - drink can affect you. This month's C+ has a good piece on drink and how it affects the cyclist :shock:


Very good explanation as to how you cannot hace "zero". For example - even if you take a sip for a taste and then spit out without swallowing (or go to test some claret when in France :wink:) - the blood vessels under your tongue have already absorbed some alcohol into your bollod system already. :shock:

As Mad Doc once explained - once it hits your stomach - unlike other foods - the alohol goes straight trhough the stomach wall into your system - dependen on what other foods are already there. It seems a bacon butty on think sliced bread will delay the process :wink:

But if too much booze gets into your system - the most senstive bit of us is the front lobe of our brains - the part controlling our judgment and reasoning :yikes:

I think Wildy once explained over on the PH forum that booze makes you feel relaxed because its a depressant drug which numbs the neutortransmitters in the brain - altering and slowing the communication between them. (Methinks C+ do read us :hehe: Funny how some articles appear in the mag after various Swiss have been chattting abouit them acorss the net's motoring sites [size=9]They're all "at it" now :shock: :lol; :yikes:[/small]

But after this front lobe chills out - the booze then hist the mid-brain and this is where it affects your balance and muscle controls. :shock:


For the ardent cyclist - a :nono: to overdo things just as much as for the driver then :wink:

For the cyclist as well - booze causes dehydration and depletes those essential minerals of magnesium/iron/zinc/potassium - which CW tell me are essential to my diet :wink:

However - there are some benefits to booze within a normal diet. (I admit to enjoying the odd single malt/real ale and my clarets :wink:

There is some evidence that moderate drinking can lead toi a longer life (which means more time for cycling per C+) and more time for "hooning it up" from the Swiss mob's point of view :lol:

Booze helps increase the HDL (good cholesterol) in your blood and so helps guard against strokes and cardiovascular diseases :drink2:

It also does help you chill and relax and so long as folk don't rely on it to unwind at the end of a stressed day - it can be pleasant to sip an aperitif just before dinner :wink: (so long as you don't go driving or cycling until you've digested it and know it's out of system :wink)


Rule of thumb - keep it moderate, never drink on empty (always have a bbacon butty on thickly sliced bread :wink: By the way - bread is not fattening - it's too much butter! :wink:) and don't go drinkin' them wine spritzers -


and don't drink after say 10 pm as you may well still be "over" in the morning where we - er.. :shock: :? :shock: cop most of our customers during the Festive/Football Cup seasons :roll:

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 13:25 
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anton wrote:
A drastic cut in the limit would realy spoil life for millions of people and thier passengers. For years designated drivers have had just one or two drinks over about 3 hours. There is a limit to how much coke and orange juice you can drink.


That is not a very good argument against lowering the limit though Anton.
The immediate and obvious comeback is that having one's life 'spoiled' by a change in drink-drive laws pales into insignificance when comapred to losing it at the hands of a drink driver.

There has to be a limit somewhere although I too don't believe it should be zero. The current one seems to deter enough people from drink/driving simply because they cannot afford to gamble with their license. Not knowing how much you can drink to arrive at that limit is part of the 'magic trick' - if you don't know, don't risk it. If you risk it and get caught, too bad.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 15:14 
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Every time I go out for a drink, I drive home. I have never had an accident because I don't exceed the limit. Strangely no one has died, I haven't even come close to crashing in a ditch or tree.

If there were statistics to prove that 80mg was dangerous and caused a lot of injury accidents they would have produced them by now.

That is why they concentrate on reaction time stats.

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 15:27 
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anton wrote:
If there were statistics to prove that 80mg was dangerous and caused a lot of injury accidents they would have produced them by now.


I believe that this is the primary evidence and remains more or less unchallenged:

Image

But I'm open to other evidence or opinions.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 15:38 
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I am open only to evidence, as most of the UK is too poorly informed to have valid opinions (including the MP's)

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 15:43 
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anton wrote:
I am open only to evidence, as most of the UK is too poorly informed to have valid opinions (including the MP's)


:hehe: Yeah, too true, but I value the opinions of quite a few of the folk hereabouts.

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