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BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

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Familyman

Post subject: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 18:20

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Location: West Sussex

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7358372.stm

According to the BBC, 40,000 people are killed in Europe per year and 1/3 of these are caused by speeding.

If the BBC say it, it must be true :lol:

They do show 2 crashes caused by speeding. Well caused by panic breaking after spotting the "Safety Camera Van"

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civil engineer

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 18:59

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Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 10:30
Posts: 2053
Location: South Wales (Roving all UK)

Proof positive that of the 6 clips shown

the only two that resulted in accidents were caused by braking when the camera was noticed.

Thats some sort of 'one third rule'.

Of course I would argue that 100% of the accidents shown were caused by the speed camera itself.

They are a danger and should therefore be removed forthwith.

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RobinXe

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 19:53

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Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 14:06
Posts: 3654
Location: Oxfordshire

Is this the same third that equals <5%?

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jomukuk

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 20:52

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Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 04:10
Posts: 3244

Who believes the British Bullshit Conporation anymore ?

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mmltonge

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 21:41

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Joined: Mon May 07, 2007 14:05
Posts: 498

I find it worrying that no one who made that clip has the common sense to sit up and go "hang on... they crashed cos they saw a camera, not because they were driving above the limit..."

The best one was the last one "doesn't look too dramatic, he's actually doing 130mph" - they've just pointed out it doesn't look dramatic... why? Cos he didnt crash, he didnt veer to one side, no one died and no one shit themselves.

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crash test dummy

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 22:05

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Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 20:54
Posts: 3

These clips prove how dangerous speed cameras can be - a few inches either way and who would the families of the innocent drivers (in the non-speeding cars) sue? How long will it be before there is more footage showing actual collisions in these circumstances? and how keen will the BBC be then to show that? How can the scamera crews continue to operate (in the same place too) after seeing what they are causing, a police chase would have to be immediately backed off to protect the public (even at risk of a real criminal escaping). I have asked the BBC to say where they got their 30% figures from - as if we didn't already know. Safety cameras my ars**

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civil engineer

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 23:49

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Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 10:30
Posts: 2053
Location: South Wales (Roving all UK)

So much about that sketch was depressing

one of my other highllights was the camera mounted on the expensive and highly engineered 'tripod' when the van is bouncing away on rusty old springs! :bounce1:

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Toltec

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 09:45

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Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 13:54
Posts: 1711
Location: NW Kent

I noticed a couple of things watching that clip, the driver behind the first car to lock up (no ABS?) did an excellent job avoiding a crash. The '126mph' BMW was interesting, the cross hairs were all over the windscreen and bonnet and did not get to the number plate at all nor did a speed flash up on the display. The readout flashed up an error twice while trying to read the bike's speed, is a headlamp a good place to get a reading from given reflections could be coming from the front surface or the mirror etc?

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chrisdhall

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 13:48

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Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 21:51
Posts: 38

I emailed the BBC thanking them for showing quite clearly that speed cameras can be the direct cause of an accident.

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nicycle

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 15:26

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Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 01:51
Posts: 329

chrisdhall wrote:

I emailed the BBC thanking them for showing quite clearly that speed cameras can be the direct cause of an accident.

Bah they've taken it off now....

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Ernest Marsh

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 17:16

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Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 00:15
Posts: 5232
Location: Windermere

chrisdhall wrote:

I emailed the BBC thanking them for showing quite clearly that speed cameras can be the direct cause of an accident.

I used the BBC's CONTACT US link, and complained about the accuracy of the content - it was still online when I sent it, but disappeared just after.

Quote:

Stats 19 figures - exceeding the speed limit or going too fast for the conditions was said to be a contributory factor in 15% of all accidents and 26% of fatal accidents.

I suspect they got the figures from the police along with the videos - I suggested they check their sources with the DfT website :lol:

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ree.t

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 18:01

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Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2005 00:45
Posts: 1016
Location: Mighty Tamworth

Yes saw that it really p**ed me off.
Lazy reporting
The Two crashes as a result of the camrea, and the two "speeding" drivers not crashing etc is an example of duoble think.

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crash test dummy

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 20:25

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Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 20:54
Posts: 3

I got a reply from the BBC. In the interest of fairness my question was (in full):

"Please advise where you got the statistics in the article on
speed cameras. You state that a third of road deaths across Europe are
due to speeding. Are you aware that for the UK this figure was recently
discredited and DfT admitted they misread the statistics?(by ignoring
regression to the mean). Did you merely extrapolate this erroneous
figure from the UK to cover the whole of Europe or do you have other
research to support your claim?
Also, why are the police allowed to position cameras where there is a
high likleyhood of them causing danger to nearby innoccent drivers? -
they are not allowed to continue a police chase in such circumstances."

and the answer (also in full)
"We should have been more explicit in our language on this story. Even
saying that speed was a 'factor' would have been more accurate. In our
introduction we talked about 'dangerous' driving rather than 'speeding'
and the core part of the story - the Europe wide campaign - was correct.
We do try to be careful with the use of statistics and this will serve
as a reminder about the caution needed."

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civil engineer

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 22:27

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Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 10:30
Posts: 2053
Location: South Wales (Roving all UK)

Fair play they were almost contrite

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Toltec

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 23:11

Life Member

Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 13:54
Posts: 1711
Location: NW Kent

I wonder how long it will be before the BBC forget to check and release another article with the '1/3' statistic?

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Ernest Marsh

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 23:14

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Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 00:15
Posts: 5232
Location: Windermere

Like mine - word for word! My email read:

Quote:

Dear Sir

We should have been more explicit in our language on this story. Even
saying that speed was a 'factor' would have been more accurate. In our
introduction we talked about 'dangerous' driving rather than 'speeding'
and the core part of the story - the Europe wide campaign - was correct.
We do try to be careful with the use of statistics and this will serve
as a reminder about the caution needed .

Adam Bullimore
Acting Deputy Editor, BBC Breakfast

-----Original Message-----
From: ************@tiscali.co.uk
Sent: 22 April 2008 14:50
To: NewsOnline Errors
Subject: Feedback [NewsWatch]

From: ****** Marsh
Email address: ************@tiscali.co.uk
Country: England

COMMENTS: Dear Sir, in the video story highlighted in the link below,
the reporter quotes a figure of one third of accidents caused by
speeding.
Even including inappropriate speed (below the limit) or cherry picking
FATAL accidents, none of the accepted figures are listed as one third
caused by speed!
Quote Guardian report on Stats 19:
<<<..exceeding the speed limit or going too fast for the conditions was
said to be a contributory factor in 15% of all accidents and 26% of
fatal accidents.>>>

I appreciate that the reporter might have been given this information by
the police - who supplied the misleading videos of cars crashing while
trying to avoid being caught speeding, and who should have been stopped,
not filmed!!
However it is a simple matter to check the facts against the DfT web
site.
****** Marsh, England

URL: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7358372.stm

The disclaimer on the site said they dont email people who contact them directly, but that my comments were welcomed.
Wonder why they followed up in this case and pulled the video? Maybe they didn't like being dropped in it by the police figures they quoted?

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Dixie

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 08:58

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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2005 19:50
Posts: 3369
Location: Lost in the Wilderness

Well done chaps

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chrisdhall

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:23

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Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 21:51
Posts: 38

Ernest Marsh wrote:

I believe they pulled the video because it showed two accident to which the sole cause was the presence of a speed camera. Had the camera not been there, the accidents would not have happened. (I was expecting to see a SafeSpeed PR on this!). I can't recall the Police ever releasing such speed cam footage in the past. The intention of releasing the video was to show people speeding, and WOW look what happens when you do, and spot a camera - you crash! The problem is as I said above, this is solid, hard evidence that the presence of a speed camera was the main contributor in an accident. I would have thought this was explosive stuff to Safespeed or the ABD. I didn't get a copy of the original or the video - did anyone else?

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Herbie J

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:46

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Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 15:50
Posts: 249

Familyman wrote:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7358372.stm

According to the BBC, 40,000 people are killed in Europe per year and 1/3 of these are caused by speeding.

If the BBC say it, it must be true :lol:

They do show 2 crashes caused by speeding. Well caused by panic breaking after spotting the "Safety Camera Van"

The BBc is the government mouthpiece to the gullable public why should'nt it be true? :roll:

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Dratsabasti

Post subject: Re: BBC Blame 13333 deaths on speeding

Posted: Sat May 03, 2008 21:35

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Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 00:08
Posts: 748
Location: Grimsby

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7358372.stm

Hmmmmm

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