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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 19:02 
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An unusual case, looks like he is heading to jail. Guilty of killing two who crashed into his wrecked van


Quote:
Driver convicted over deaths of Gosport friends Zoe West and Victoria Pickering
http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/newshome/Dr ... 5427801.jp
03 July 2009
By Michael Powell
A van driver has been found guilty of killing two young women in a horrific motorway crash.
Friends Zoe West, 34, and Victoria Pickering, 27, both from Gosport, died when their red Ford Escort collided with a Mercedes van, Vauxhall Astra and a lorry M6 in Lancashire last July.

Nigel Kirkham, 45, had denied two counts of causing death by
ADVERTISEMENT dangerous driving after being involved in a four-vehicle smash on the M6 in Lancashire.

But Kirkham, of Chestnut Avenue, Swadlincote, near Derby, was convicted by a jury at Preston Crown Court yesterday.

The jury unanimously found Kirkham guilty of two counts of causing death by dangerous driving.

Delivery driver Kirkham was behind the wheel of a white Mercedes van travelling northbound when he shunted the back of an articulated truck.

The impact caused his van to come to a stop, straddling two lanes, where it was hit by two cars.

Miss West, of Chapel Square, Gosport, suffered severe brain injuries in the crash and died the next day in Royal Preston Hospital after her parents made the agonising decision to switch off her life-support machine.

Miss Pickering, who lived in Ely Court, Rowner, was pronounced dead at the scene.

Kirkham was remanded in custody by Judge Michael Byrne for sentencing, which is due to take place on July 31.


The strange thing in this case is there is no agrivating case of the usual: mobile, drink or drugs. It seams he crashed and they then crashed into the wreckage.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 19:18 
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If that is the case then its a worrying precedent!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 19:39 
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Lets run through this again...

So Driver A crashes (for whatever reason) Driver B crashes into driver A's vehicle and dies.

Driver A is blamed for the deaths...

Diferent example..

Driver A crashes, Driver B crashes into driver A's vehcle, Killing Diver A, Driver B is blamed for the death.. (Lord Ahmed)

Looks like the new offence is "Surviving a motor crash"!

:o :o :o

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 20:39 
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If his van came to a stop, does that mean that the artic was also at a halt.........where on the motorway? And, if the van hadn't hit the artic, does that mean that the girls car would've?


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 21:25 
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That is what I am thinking. he collided with the rear of a truck. A serious accident but not enough to kill him. They failed to read the situation enough to hit his van with an impact speed in excess of 40mph probobly higher. I just dont understand this case!

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“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 10:20 
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anton wrote:
That is what I am thinking. he collided with the rear of a truck. A serious accident but not enough to kill him. They failed to read the situation enough to hit his van with an impact speed in excess of 40mph probobly higher. I just dont understand this case!



Think I've got it, now. The girls were far less likely to be able to judge the need to stop.....cos they perhaps couldn't see the artic?? Van driver commits prior offence because he didn't leave himself enough time to stop (endangers himself and other motorists). Is that it? Either way, he pays triple.....with his conscience, loss of livelyhood and a criminal record/ probable prison-sentence. The girls??????.....no words to describe that loss.

It's been some time since I've driven 000's of annual miles on motorways, but I find that alertness and awareness is significantly dulled by relativity........vehicles around me seemingly stationary until you look at their wheels, or until someone brakes. Plus, the carriageways are mostly occupied most of the time and I get short-shrift from toher drivers whenever tempering speed and distance-between.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 10:51 
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why mention that the van came to rest straddling two lanes... if the car was in the same lane ?
i immediately assumed when i read that, that the car would be in the next lane.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 12:07 
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What say you, weepej?

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 12:52 
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Weepej always states , that no matter what you hit it always YOUR fault, isn't that right Weepej?

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 17:43 
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If someone crashes in front of me thier car/van still has to disperse its energy and come to rest. I have to observe and maintain stopping distance. Even if it all went mad infront of me I would not expect to hit the wreckage at more than 10mph. It seams as if the traffic was travelling in a convoy zombie state. I also dont follow vehicles that I cant see through for long unless on a two lane road.

The answer might be it was at night.
Quote:
Mr Lamb said: 'It was a gross lack of attention because the defendant had run smack into the back of a large, well-lit lorry, on a straight stretch of motorway, in dry conditions – and with very good visibility.'


I concider the van driver may have dozed off, hit the truck, his lights fails and they drove flat out into an unlit van???

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“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 18:45 
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samandben wrote:
anton wrote:
That is what I am thinking. he collided with the rear of a truck. A serious accident but not enough to kill him. They failed to read the situation enough to hit his van with an impact speed in excess of 40mph probobly higher. I just dont understand this case!



Think I've got it, now. The girls were far less likely to be able to judge the need to stop.....cos they perhaps couldn't see the artic??


how do you NOT see an artic???

if that was the case then they were either driving too close to the van or not paying attention, either way, her fault!

it does state that he did SHUNT the artic which although open to misinterpretation, generally suggests a small difference in speed. the fact that he survived would support this theory! clearly the girls were travelling at a much higher speed since they did not survive the collision which does raise the question already asked, would they have hit the artic? if they had then it would still have been a fatality but who would be to blame? the artic driver for just being there or the girl who was driving seemingly without due care and attention at the very least?

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 23:33 
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scanny77 wrote:
how do you NOT see an artic???
Quote:


Low loader?

scanny77 wrote:
clearly the girls were travelling at a much higher speed
Quote:


Yup.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 23:41 
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I can envisage a situation where artic is in lane one, van also in lane one . Girls in lane two starting to overtake van who slams into artic and spins round to block two lanes (1 and 2) and girls suddenly find back end of van immediately in front of them....bang!

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 08:18 
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yes but they would only be traveling up to 20mph faster than the van. Whilst the crash would be nasty it is unlikly they would both recieve fatal injuries.

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“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 09:42 
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Maybe, but they wouldn't be hitting a stationary object at 20 MPH, they would be hitting something at maybe 70MPH and that may be enough?

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 09:44 
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I notice Weepej isn't commenting on this and yet he always seems to be an "authority" on people hitting objects in the road ahead of them.

What are your views, Weepej?

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:27 
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anton wrote:
yes but they would only be traveling up to 20mph faster than the van. Whilst the crash would be nasty it is unlikly they would both recieve fatal injuries.


Depends how quickly the van slowed. I lost drive in a hi-top iveco in the fast lane of the M5 once and the parachute effect doesn't half kill the speed quickly, there's evan a case I'd say for not allowing vehicles of a certain drag coefficient in the outside lane- within seconds I was "trapped" in the outside lane and the middle lane was streaming past- had to "force" my way over to the shoulder before stopping, and changing trousers. Now that was facing forwards- this van spun and was "side-on"? If the ladies in the car were unprepared differential speed at impact could easily be 50+. One minute they could be doing 80 and closing to overtake a van at 65, a moment later it's side-on at 20 and blocking off the intended overtake lane/ escape path.

Although without knowing all the facts, you do wonder how much it was his fault and how much it's "someone has to be blamed" culture.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 00:59 
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Are you all aware of the initial statement in the report?
Quote:
their red Ford Escort collided with a Mercedes van, Vauxhall Astra and a lorry

Perhaps the Escort was attempting to pass the collision, rather than brake to a halt - an option I would prefer myself since there is ALWAYS the danger that while YOU might stop, others pile in behind, squashing you.
It therefore appears that there is a possibility that the van was pushed into the path of the Escort by an Astra, OR that the Escort was in no danger of hitting the van hard enough to kill, but was thwarted by the intervention of the Astra which may have diverted them into the other vehicles?

The conviction is a result of the van driver causing the accident, and perhaps the judge decided that the Escort could not avoid the collision, and held the driver culpable.

I'd guess that the report is short on facts, and there is much more to this than we are being told.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:50 
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Now one of the mothers of the two killed is calling for a life sentence
http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/newshome/Mo ... 5431243.jp

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“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 12:37 
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The family of the dead woman Zoe Pickering were the unfortunate victims of a further tragedy.

Her Uncle and his grandaughter died in an accident on the A9 while trying to avoid an accident caused by another van driver. :(
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/scotland/article6530810.ece

There are no reports of how the Escort managed to pile into the wreckage of the van so hard as to cause such serious injuries.
However the crash happened in the early hours of the morning.
http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/burtonmail-news/DisplayArticle.asp?ID=430510

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