Safe Speed Forums

The fox hunting cruelty aspect is further muddied when you consider alternative ways of keeping fox numbers in check. Shooting them is only any good if whoever is doing the shooting is a good shot.

I don't think anyone that likes to chase an animal across the countryside with a pack of dogs is anything other than not right in the head. I'm sure all the arguments used to justify fox hunting were also used to justify other cruel sports such as dog fighting, badger baiting etc.

There's no reason they can't do drag hunting instead. I'd keep the ban.

I'd certainly keep the smoking ban as it means the non smoking *majority* can now go into a pub without having to end up stinking of fag smoke. Should do the health of the people forced to work in smoky environments the world of good too.

I'd also reverse the cannabis reclassification reversal. The expert drugs committee should have been listened to but I don't think HMG liked to hear that they felt alcohol, which they made much more available, was a greater danger.

The purpose of government is not to protect vermin. Would you be in favour of a law prohibiting poisining rats?

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Dogs and cats are not vermin. Foxes are.


So you would ban the sale of mouse traps and rat poison? And ban angling?

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Why should drags be denied the protection offered to foxes?

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Yeah, like fox hunting controls the fox population.

It's nothing more than an excuse for a bit of animal abuse, to the horses, the dogs as well as the foxes.

How can you offer protection to a scent??? It's like arguing animal cruelty laws should apply to the fake rabbit in greyhound racing...

Think you're confusing drags and drag acts

Don't they?

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

Just because mankind dragged the most affectionate, pretty or useful animals into their home and attached a ‘domestic’ label to them doesn’t change the nature of the pain and abuse suffered by any animal.

Are you saying it’s okay to torture a fox but not a dog just because we haven’t domesticated it yet? BTW, when my daughter was young she had a pet rat, called Pip.


I personally haven’t killed anything but if I had to I would do it humanly and swiftly and only if it was for food or self protection and health grounds.

Regarding the use of traps or poisons I would get professional advice on the humane way of eradicating them using, if necessary, a product endorsed by the RSPCA or a veterinarian body. I don't really know because I haven't had to go down that route fortunately, but I know I wouldn't be cruel or do it for fun.

Gotta get on my m-bike now...

_________________
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I am not in favour of torturing any animal - not even terrorists. In a fox hunt the fox dies very quickly once he is caught. Much more quickly and humanely than if it were to be trapped or shot by less than a marksman.


My daughter occasionally pet-minds a couple of rats. They are really cute and clean - don't know why they get such bad press. Perhaps the chief rat should speak to the fox's PRO.


Professionals don't give a toss about being humane when they tackle rats and mice. The put down wafarin which is a decoagulant which cause the pests to die in agony from internal bleeding.


Have fun

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

So the foxes end up being shot or trapped instead. Let's face it, the foxhunting ban was nothing to do with animal welfare, and everything to do with class envy and rancour.

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

For the most part they will die of "Natural Causes"

This doesnt mean Mr Foxy dying peacefully in his bed surrounded by his loving foxy freinds and relations!

For a wild animal (and in particular an apex perditor) this is going to mean starvation, sickness, gangrene and blood poisening from injuries and so on.

Being swiftly torn to pieces by a pack of hounds is actually pretty humane by comparison!

_________________
"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

My experience with the hunt(s) is that they are a bunch of plonkers. They used to send letters around to the tenants of dads estate saying they would be in the area and if people did want them on their land to call and they would avoid it. They never did. Horses all over the wet fields, dogs in the cow sheds cows upset $hit everywhere. There was going to be a lynching. They were pretty useless at fox control, you'd seem them racing one way and the fox sneaking off the otherway , sometimes a farmer would shoot the fox, just to be a spoil sport. .

It's not unknown for a decent shot to quietly net 30 foxes in an evening. A combine harvester is quite a good, if expensive, tool for dispatching the odd fox.

Rat are quite clever, if they eat something that makes them sick quickly, they stop eating it and might not get a full dose. Rat poison tastes nice, so they keep coming back to it, they then get the full dose (if you put enough out ) and they die. Not sure with they are in pain or not, I suggest not, they always just look lethargic rather than distressed.

I would have to agree 100% with you there. Well, maybe 90% because I'm sure it had a little to do with a genuine care for the fox from some of the activists and supporters.

It’s true I heard more than one person at the time rejoice at the thought that it’s one in the eye for ‘them lot’ at last. It’s also true to say that nature is very cruel without our input.

But that still doesn't give us the right as intelligent, sentient, compassionate beings to use their pain for our pleasure. There's just something inside me which thinks it's sadistic and vulgar to derive pleasure or entertainment from another’s suffering, whether fox hunting, bullfighting or throwing live lobsters in a pot of boiling water because it ‘tastes better’.

Sounds like it could be another thread job...

_________________
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I have to agree with that sentiment, which is why I would never hunt, or go to a karaoke evening at the pub . But I don't want to ban either. I find it appalling that Parliament nodded through legislation which has led to the deaths of thousands of innocent Iraqis yet spent several days debating foxhunting.

_________________
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

The whole point of a free society is that you have to tolerate things you find unpleasant or objectionable.

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

personally i would like to see foxhunting banned totally even in its present "drag" form. They aren't fooling anyone, there are still foxes caught by this "drag hunting" crew ( I have a friend who hunts, who tells me this and another who shoots them (as Adam says a half dozen an evening isn't unusual). What I disagree with is their blatent disregard for anything or anyone who crosses their path. They often crash through people gardens, private land etc and charge across country roads without a care.

_________________
My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

I remember, many years ago, driving along a country road when I was suddenly surrounded by dogs and horses.
As I stopped (no chance of continuing anyway) I was admonished by a young lady on a horse for "endangering hounds".
Since she was also whacking the car roof with her crop at the same time as shouting at me I was less than happy.
I put my hand onto the horn and kept it there......she soon stopped whacking the car and started trying to stay on the horse.
I also remember 35 years ago when I used to work on a farm at weekends....the tenant farmer was supposed to have refreshments arranged for the hunt when they got there.....this stopped after the hunt killed one of his cats, in his front garden.
Maybe it was/is class-based.....who cares....a bunch of yahoos chasing an animal to watch it being torn to death is not my idea of fun....maybe I'm just too normal to be in a hunt ?

_________________
The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

yep, basically from my experiences of them, they are nothing more than football hooligans on horses. No -one would allow football hooligans to legally rampage across your property chasing something to kill so why let this lot?

_________________
My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.