Safe Speed Forums

Where have you been weepej?
- RTTM
- Bias On Selection (page under development)

Thus far, there is no evidence that cameras (in general) have any positive impact at all when considering those two confounding factors.

I challenge anyone to prove me wrong!

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

To attack the message of the article


This is not a good start. Why assume the council isn’t concerned about road safety?


The public don’t want speed cameras as they know they’re being used to raise revenue.


Like folks like weepej didn’t


Ad hominem


IF the earlier budgets were aimed towards trafpol instead of cameras, there is an even better chance your son would still be alive.


Like trafpol cannot catch them

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

I think one point that often escapes people is the fact that when Police Patrol you can never know when or where they may be (hold that thought).
They look at cameras there 24/7 and then think that because they (appear) 'do their job 'all' the time' they are therefore better.
Then the public find that they often, are not working - thus the immoral seed is laid that you are being conned into thinking that they are even doing their job.
Then the revenue stream is established.
Then motorists recognise that in fact when they travel they adjust their speed according to conditions. Sometimes that is above the speed limit, and time and time again, they did not have an incident let alone and accident, let alone a near miss even. So the two bare no correlation to each other.
So the public stop 'believing' that they are this magic 'cure', because reality tells them otherwise.
Then the motorists are left with a high degree of paranoia and stress to deal with added to the task of driving.

If you are at work and you have a high level of stress and paranoia would you work better or worse ?

Brake try to show that if every location had a camera people would slow and so therefore it can be easy to fall into the trap that average cameras or ISA therefor accomplish the forced lower speed better.
They will no doubt but ....
is that the 'whole' factor ?
NO. Road safety does not show us that just because someone is forced to go at a slower rate they will therefore be 'safe'.
Stats show us that 12mph can be deadly and so can 80mph it depends on how a person is hit as to whether they die. Cars are being designed to try to make it that people slide over the car and especially the front A pillars.
Therefore it is far better to try and understand all the factors that make the average motorist safer and better then replicate that and encourage those that are not as good better still.

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

No.

That's very judicious misuse of statistics there.

You say ALL accidents and then point to a report that assessed the impact of cameras on road works on motorways.

Sorry. Not clear what you mean. Anything else than what?

And do get the straw out of your hair. I am no more convinced that speed cameras are a sensible approach to road safety than you are. \but it is not inconceivable that the presence of a speed camera might one day have prevented an accident

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

TRL 323 - excessive speed a factor in only 7.3%. Applied at ALL accidents.

I'm 6'5 and I have sticky-out ears, I'm sure you'll notice those attributes first

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Regulation without education merely creates more criminals.

So am I! If you have any hair, that will distinguish us.

I think weepej is of a similar height (can't vouch for the ears), so this could get very confusing.

You can tell weepej by the halo

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Including fender benders, or is that KSIs?

Regardless, TRL 323 was an experiment in measuring causes of crashes, and in particular relies on the interpretation of the cause as recorded at the time, which may or may not have been correct.

Or the fact that being a much keener cyclist than me, he probably looks a lot fitter.

I'm no beanpole I'll tell you that, 20 stone at the moment (6'4"); I could lose two stone or so I reckon.

Thing is I cycle a lot (over 120 miles a week, sometimes 200 and the other week 250 including one 80 mile trip), but I eat a lot too, I eat a dinner suitable for three most nights.

16st here, so slim but not skinny. Though my BMI is "borderline obese" apparently.

So when the statistics contradict you they're wrongly recorded, is that right?

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Regulation without education merely creates more criminals.

Ooooh I missed this.


It's all accidents. For KSIs, I believe the figure's about 12%. Why? are non KSI crashes unimportant?


So you're saying that crashes aren't caused by what experts thought caused them at the time?

Can you explain? And elaborate on the phrase "which may or may not have been correct"?

No, TRL323 was never meant to be used in this way, TRL said so itself after the statistics were misused.

That explains a lot

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

When you're talking about serious injury and death yes.

Look, completely whack scenario, but it makes my point:

100 crashes, 80 are slight, no injuries, 20 involve a death and those 20 were the only ones that involved excessive speed.

now depending on how you quote those figures you can make it look like excessive speed is responsible for 20% of crashes, or 100% of fatal crashes.

I believe that under the new health-speke no-one is obese anymore: they are fat. That is supposed to sound worse but to me it is the other way round. Fat people are nice and cuddly whereas obese people are gross and ugly.

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown