Safe Speed Forums

Is there a written-in-stone point at which exceeding the speed limit on each class of road automatically becomes dangerous driving?

Obviously it's higher than the speed that cop walked free on a year or two back.

Makes you wonder how and where he gained enough experience to be doing this at all in the first place?
If he is way under licensed and already doing this on the road then will the Courts ruling be 'obeyed' anyway ?
Why has the respect in the system been so lost anyway, and how is that regained ?
The propaganda that has been liberally dished out must have some effect on all jury members at some point.
When some motorists now think that overtaking is a dangerous manoeuvre now, so it is not hard to imagine that that it might therefore follow too that even if conditions are good they may assume a specific speed that is not within the legal limit is automatically 'dangerous'.
This is not to say that I approve of this before anyone jumps down my throat about it - it is just that it might be 'safe'. I would expect a very experienced rider in this case, perhaps with race track experience and so on to be able to show competence.
The fact that this chap has only got a 25kw licence is of great concern.
By pleading guilty the case was not heard so I guess some facts will never become public knowledge.

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

I think the speed obsession is playing the biggest part here again, as usual. As JtB said, it’s funny how it’s acceptable when you are wearing a badge though.

Just MHO but I wouldn’t be at all surprised that if the same man was caught driving a HGV on a motorway instead, doing the speed limit for that vehicle which of course has much greater destructive power if he ploughed into traffic, his sentence would have been far less just because he wasn't speeding.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

This previous link (11 June 2009) from The Sun is interesting Here Headlines :A MOTORCYCLIST who chased and filmed his best friend at up to 170mph before he was killed in a horror road smash walked FREE from court today.

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

On a tangent but how do you measure the number of times that some one breaks the speed limit if they are at over 100mph for a protracted period.

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

This has been raised before to my recollection i.e. f someone goes through three speed cameras in close succession. (there’s a few places by me you could easily do that), is it three separate NIP’s and 3 x £60 fine plus ban or is it just classed as one?

I have a feeling it’ll be the more lucrative one.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

If done on the 'same' stretch of road the penalties are counted as one.
If the driver is going over 30mph I believe that that will end up up in Court and the charges are more sever so appointed by a Judge who uses the guidelines stipulated by Law / Government.

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

One of greenshed's previous incarnations tried to claim that multiple detections constitute multiple offences. This is of course not true.

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Regulation without education merely creates more criminals.

Oh, is that so?

So if I trigger one of a series of speed traps, I may as well "make hay while the sun shines", so to speak?

Hmmm...

So of the three in close proximity, (hey, I'm a poet and didn't know it )...

With the first speed camera along a road of which the entire limit is 40 mph, JtB goes through the first scamera at 50, (ping), the second at 60, (ping), and the third one at 80mph, (ping).

See where I'm going with this folks?

Oh, soz to use you as an example bud, it's just that your reference to making hay made sense to me And I'd be interested to know how my senario works....?


Well, if you're going to get hung for a hanging offence why not commit a hundred such offences?

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

The courts will judge each particular case on its merits. There is a precedent for triggering three cameras on the same road on the same journey being treated as one offence, but it certainly doesn't give anyone carte blanche to trigger all the cameras in a county in a day. And I'd be very surprised if the offence that counted wasn't the most serious one. You will also have to argue your case in court.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Thanks Peter.

I dearly hope they would take the merits of the case and circumstances into account. I guess I have become too cynical to trust British Justice anymore in the evening of my life.

I have become too cynical to believe that they would accept that the 80mph was safer because where he did it there was no-one around and it was open and clear, when in fact the 50 mph was more dangerous because, although slower, there were parked cars and people next to a caravan site. (Calling on my own local knowledge of an area I know now).

Despite all that has happened to the speed camera issue lately, we are still living in a country where speed is the buzz word and safety is of secondary importance.

Just MHO...

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

The target is a bit bigger too. You might be able to aim off a number plate by a few inches and get different results but you can't actually miss the moon. Can you?

'Space docking' with the moon?

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

No

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I am not a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I do have experience of the day to day working of courts and use that knowledge to help where possible. I do not represent any official body and post as an individual.

It would be three separate offences and they would be charged as such. However, there is a bit of law which requires courts to limit the points imposed for offences committed on the same occasion unless the circumstances merit otherwise. See this thread viewtopic.php?f=5&t=23164

There is also room for discussion as to exactly what constitutes "the same occasion". Three consecutive and closely spaced cameras might well be "the same occasion" . Two cameras on the same day at opposite ends of the A38 probably wouldn't be "the same occasion".

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I am not a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I do have experience of the day to day working of courts and use that knowledge to help where possible. I do not represent any official body and post as an individual.

Its not precedent its statute law. There are cases which explore what does, or does not, constitute "the same occasion".


That too is statute law. So no insurance, a bald tyre and a dud stop light would get you 6 or 8 for the no insurance and no points for the others although you could be fined for each individual offence if the circumstances and your income merit it.

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I am not a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I do have experience of the day to day working of courts and use that knowledge to help where possible. I do not represent any official body and post as an individual.

Assuming the court consider these as "the same occasion" they would look in detail at each separate offence and decide what points each merits. They would then consider if the whole of the offending merits a ban or multiple points. If not then its whatever points they decided were appropriate for the offence they found to be most serious.

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I am not a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I do have experience of the day to day working of courts and use that knowledge to help where possible. I do not represent any official body and post as an individual.