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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 07:02 
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Elmbridge Today here
Elmbridge Today wrote:
New Surrey safety camera information published
26 Aug 2011

Figures published by the county's safety camera partnership have shown that the number of road collisions and casualties at sites across Surrey has fallen since safety cameras were introduced.

The number of road collisions and casualties at sites across Surrey has fallen since safety cameras were introduced, according to the latest figures.
The statistics, from the county’s safety camera partnership, cover a total of 52 locations.
These are sites that have fixed speed cameras, combined speed and red light violation cameras, red light violation cameras only or mobile speed enforcement cameras.
Overall, there was an average of 288 collisions per year at these locations in the three years before enforcement began.

The annual average after enforcement - between October 2007 and the end of September 2010 - was 194 , a 33% reduction.
In addition, the average number of collisions resulting in death or serious injury at the sites fell from 50 before enforcement to 24 afterwards – a drop of 53%.
The news comes after the government asked all local authorities to publish details about the effectiveness of their cameras.
So far, 75 – including Surrey’s – have published some or all of their information, with the remaining 72 expected to follow suit in the next few weeks.

Road Safety Minister Mike Penning said: "I hope that this information will help local people to make informed judgements about the impact cameras are having on their local roads.”

To view the information for Surrey, click here.
Full doc here I have placed a Topic re:Surrey Data here

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 22:11 
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Ah yes, the "...at the camera sites..." small print.

Never did get a satisfactory answer from CSCP as to what "at the camera sites" meant! Is it the area covered by the stripes on the road near a camera? 100 yards either side? A mile either side? A mile radius centred on the camera?

Hmmmm.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 23:18 
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I thought is was 250yds either side ... but that might have only been one Partnership I'd have to look it up. (Sorry I'd like to be precise.)

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:36 
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The document they provide is not data, it is their analysis of their chosen data.

I would be asking them what the figures compared to the three years before the three years before looked like, and for a year by year breakdown (not an amalgamation resulting in fractions of lives being lost), in addition to the valid concerns over the definition of a "site".

I also find myself wondering if the figures for the whole area are more damning, since SCPs are often keen to include these, in order to take advantage of other engineering improvements and overall trends.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:41 
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SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
I thought is was 250yds either side ... but that might have only been one Partnership I'd have to look it up. (Sorry I'd like to be precise.)


No, that's a good thing! I'd love an answer to this! I was trying to get it "from the horse's mouth" on the old CSCP forum before they shut it down, but never really got a straight answer. In fact I still suspect that they would use a crash on a minor road within a certain radius of a motorway bridge to justify sitting a scamera van over the M6! If there was any intention to perform a genuine scientific evaluation of the effects of cameras, surely the very first thing would be to clearly set out the terms and definitions?!


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 14:22 
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Elmbridge Today website URL = elmbridgetoday.co.uk/News/Collisions-fall-at-safety-camera-sites

article wrote:
the average number of collisions resulting in death or serious injury at the [camera] sites ...

...

Road Safety Minister Mike Penning said: "I hope that this information will help local people to make informed judgements about the impact cameras are having on their local roads.”

A brilliant example of the misleading implication of 'correlation and causation'.

Informed people recognise this deception as RTTM.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 17:17 
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Absolutely ! I know that Idris and a few others have written to him to 'keep him straight' on the camera site facts ... It does imply that the data can be meaningful and it can't plain and simple!

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